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Keybed Action Nord Electro vs C2D? Vs others too...


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A few years ago, I was shopping for a dual-manual organ clone. I presently have a Hammond B3, and had another chopped Hammond at the time. I've also owned (or still own) Nord Electro 2/3/5, Piano 2 and Stage 3. At the time I was shopping, i was able to borrow a C2D for a gig. While I've generally had good luck with Nord products, I did not love the C2D primarily because of the action. It was just a bit stiffer than I liked; more like the action on the Electro than a real Hammond action. I don't know if the Electro and C2D have the same action, but from what I could tell they seemed quite similar.

 

I ended up buying a dual-manual Mojo and really like its action. I've not tried any of the Hammond Clones so I can't comment as to how those would stack up.

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I have the electro 5D and my understanding is that it is the same, waterfall, keybed as the C2D. The electro HP models have a hammer action.

 

I have the 5d also. So the C2D has the same keybed and springs as the 5d? That's too bad.

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I ended up buying a dual-manual Mojo and really like its action. I've not tried any of the Hammond Clones so I can't comment as to how those would stack up.

 

I hear people like the mojo action

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I have the electro 5D and my understanding is that it is the same, waterfall, keybed as the C2D. The electro HP models have a hammer action.

 

I have the 5d also. So the C2D has the same keybed and springs as the 5d? That's too bad.

I can't say for sure if they're the same as i've never played the C2D, i'm making an educated guess that may be incorrect.

Korg SV2, Nord Electro 5D, Gigperformer/lots of VSTs
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I recently got an electro 6d after considering a Mojo and after selling my Roland vR700. Main considerations were the compact size, light weight and the additional sounds from the library. I LOVED the VR700 keybed and never really liked the electro 3 keys that I tried out many a time at a local store...but when my buddy got his 5d I could swear it wasn't quite as stiff and springy as that electro 3. In any case, I'm loving it so far, though I wouldn't want to play much piano on it for sure. It's springier than my Roland was, and most reviews suggest the same when compared to the Mojo, but I just play it and it never crosses my mind. Caveat, I'm not really an "organist", I make organ noises in a classic rock band! :D
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I really won't purchase the RED STUFF but I will admit I had fun with the C2D a few times. Sounds decent, good feeling keybed.

 

New XK5 keybed (and faux multi-contact) gets a gold star as well.

 

Not a fan of Mojo keybed.

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I can't play the Nord Electro actions.

 Find 660 of my jazz piano arrangements of standards for educational purposes and tutorials at www.Patreon.com/HarryLikas Harry was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book."

 

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JoJo, tried the new Mojo keybed?

Hammond: L111, M100, M3, BC, CV, Franken CV, A100, D152, C3, B3

Leslie: 710, 760, 51C, 147, 145, 122, 22H, 31H

Yamaha: CP4, DGX-620, DX7II-FD-E!, PF85, DX9

Roland: VR-09, RD-800

 

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I started this thread because action never mattered much to me before beyond semi vs full weighted. So I was fine with the Nord action, dmc,SK, and so on. Now that I've been playing a C3 for the first time in my life, going back to my Nord E5D is tough.
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It's funny, I hear a lot of complaints about the Electro action. I myself am not crazy about it either. Why wouldn't NORD just get it right like the VR700 or 730 actions? Or like their Stage Compact actions? An action that is just right for both EPS and organs....

Electro 5, NI Kontrol S61/49, MX49, PC3, Rev2, Prologue, Pro3, Juno-DS, Mopho Keys, SE02, drums, tons of synth software, guitars, amps, and pedals...help me!!

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Nord waterfall actions are not good for real organ playing

 

Mojo is still the best for real organ playing, besides the real thing (and I mean any REAL Hammond console)

"I have constantly tried to deliver only products which withstand the closest scrutiny � products which prove themselves superior in every respect.�

Robert Bosch, 1919

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JoJo, tried the new Mojo keybed?

 

No, just the early orig. Better?

From reports here, yes. I know that the Mojo 61 action is great and I am even okay using it for pianos at one-keyboard gigs. The Electro 2 I had was always a poor "worst of both worlds" compromise IMNSHO.

"I'm so crazy, I don't know this is impossible! Hoo hoo!" - Daffy Duck

 

"The good news is that once you start piano you never have to worry about getting laid again. More time to practice!" - MOI

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JoJo, tried the new Mojo keybed?

 

No, just the early orig. Better?

From reports here, yes. I know that the Mojo 61 action is great and I am even okay using it for pianos at one-keyboard gigs. The Electro 2 I had was always a poor "worst of both worlds" compromise IMNSHO.

 

I love my E5D, but I agree that the action is kind of a bad middle ground. It should be lighter, or they should sell a mod kit that has lighter springs.

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Okay, here's some non scientific measurement. I stacked a few weights at the end of a white key to move it to the high trigger point.

 

C2D 75 grams

NS3 (compact) 95 grams

VR700 55 grams

 

This confirms what I always thought, that the C2D action is lighter than the NS/NE (I don't have a NE anymore so I can't measure, but afaik it's similar to the NS).

 

Disclaimer is that my C2D is 7 years old and the NS3 new, but the little played keys (low octave, upper keyboard) are approx. the same. The VR700 is very light but also seem to have less resistance moving up and down, very smooth action. To me, lighter is definitely nicer...

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The newer Mojo keybeds (including the Mojo61 and newer dual manual Mojos) are definitely different. Crumar began custom adjustments to the standard Fatar waterfall keybed thats is used in almost all clones.

Endorsing Artist/Ambassador for MAG Organs and Motion Sound Amplifiers, Organ player for SRT - www.srtgroove.com

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Why wouldn't NORD just get it right like the VR700 or 730 actions? Or like their Stage Compact actions?

Roland VR700 and VK8 actions are great. Roland has their own actions, Nord is limited to what they can get from other companies (typically Fatar), though they can be modified somewhat. Everyone seems to agree that the newer Mojos feel better than the original, despite using the same basic Fatar TP8O mechanism. Similarly the Numa Organ 2 feels better than the original Numa organ (lower spring tension, and a felt to shorten total throw), though both are again TP8O. Roland VR730 is supposedly also based on the TP8O, I haven't played that one. Nord Stage Compact and Electro actions are the same TP8O as well, though more heavily sprung than most (and the Compact has aftertouch, which may affect the feel of the landing).

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Okay, here's some non scientific measurement. I stacked a few weights at the end of a white key to move it to the high trigger point.

 

C2D 75 grams

NS3 (compact) 95 grams

VR700 55 grams

I have just done the same type of non scientific measurements on my Nord C2, Mojo 61 and Nord Stage 3 Compact(1.5 years old)

 

C2 75-80 grams

Mojo 61 55-60 grams

NS3C 75-80 grams

 

Mojo 61 triggers about 1.5-2 millimeters higher than the Nords. At least my measurements confirms that Crumar use softer springs than Nord.

 

And guess what triggers my 1974 B3? 70-80 grams........

 

 

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And guess what triggers my 1974 B3? 70-80 grams........

 

 

That isn't that surprising. 70s Hammonds have, in my experience, a much stiffer action than organs from the 50s and 60s.

 

 

Endorsing Artist/Ambassador for MAG Organs and Motion Sound Amplifiers, Organ player for SRT - www.srtgroove.com

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