Music Player Network

Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 2 of 2 1 2
Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: iluvchiclets] #2986107 04/20/19 01:31 PM
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 1,363
El Lobo Offline
Platinum Member
Offline
Platinum Member
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 1,363
Originally Posted By: iluvchiclets
Originally Posted By: MotiDave
If you’re in Ontario, can you just drive over?
I did briefly look into driving to New York, but it was 7 1/2 hours each way. Ugh.
I had the same thought. Depending on where you are in Ontario, can you drive to Detroit to visit a "friend"? Visit the campus of University of Michigan in Ann Arbor? Or have a "gig" in Buffalo or Rochester or Syracuse?

KC Island
Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: drawback] #2986120 04/20/19 02:54 PM
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 373
I
iluvchiclets Offline OP
Senior Member
OP Offline
Senior Member
I
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 373
Originally Posted By: Polychrest
I bought a used Electro 2 on EBay a few years ago. The seller was in New York State; I’m in the Toronto area. The price was good and the board, when it arrived, was as advertised. But the customs bill contained an unexpected surprise: an extra hundred bucks or so in import duties because of the board’s country of origin: Sweden. I could have found a comparable board in Canada for what I wound up paying for my supposed “deal”.

Just the thing I am thinking will happen - an unexpected charge.


Originally Posted By: drawback


I still believe buying within national borders is your best option. You may think you’re saving 1k by getting something from Florida but there has to be a reckoning somewhere. Plus you’ve already spent maybe a day on this - and I don’t know what your time is worth - but I like to put a dollar figure on stuff like this to see what else it’s costing me, and double it for horseshit & hassle.

Again, I may be totally off course with my information, but it’s the way I do it. YMMV and I wish you luck!


This is very true. I am already fed up trying to keep track of all these different possibilities.
In reality I simply cannot afford a new Stage 3, but trying to save some money is taking any fun and enthusiasm out of the whole purchase smile

I appreciate your words.


Nord Stage 3, NI Kontrol S61, Komplete, Arturia V-Collection, Yamaha MX49, Kurz PC3, drums, tons of guitars, amps, and pedals...
Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: iluvchiclets] #2986129 04/20/19 05:22 PM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 13
D
darcphil Offline
Member
Offline
Member
D
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 13
Duty calculation is based on stated value.

I definitely buy from local retailers (first stop Long and Mcquade!), if they have what I'm looking for.

Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: darcphil] #2986153 04/20/19 08:18 PM
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 671
Shamanczarek Offline
Gold Member
Offline
Gold Member
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 671
I found out the term "hosed" originated with Canadians and is often used as a slang term for being swindled. Looks like the government makes importing merchandise into Canada so financially restrictive you are better off buying locally at whatever price the dealer dictates or do without.

At least by investigating you now know how much you are getting shafted buying locally. You can use this information as leverage to negotiate a better price locally. Unless the government is requiring Canadian Musical Instrument dealers to pay high import tariffs we don't know about their wholesale costs shouldn't be much different than dealers in Germany and the USA. Considering the typical advertised price can be well over a thousand Canadian Dollars more than German or US prices there is no reason why they should't come down at least a few hundred if you are persistent.

One thing about buying from another country at a much lower price you will also be declaring the item at a lower price for any duty or sales tax you might be charged. Judging by what Canadian dealers are charging I think the chances you will come out significantly ahead financially are quite good. Since you don't know the exact delivered price you could calculate the worst case scenario to determine the most you might pay. Then you can decide if it's an acceptable risk.

Last edited by Shamanczarek; 04/20/19 08:20 PM.

C3/122, M102A, Vox V301H, Farfisa Compact, Gibson G101, GEM P, RMI 300A, Piano Bass, Pianet , Prophet 5 rev. 2, Pro-One, Matrix 12, OB8, Korg MS20, Jupiter 6, Juno 60, PX-5S, Nord Stage 3 Compact
Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: Shamanczarek] #2986160 04/20/19 09:36 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 4,058
drawback Online Happy
MP Hall of Fame Member
Online Happy
MP Hall of Fame Member
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 4,058
How much is lower? Our dollar is set fairly stable now at the rate of approximately 75¢ against the Greenback and Euro. That means a $3500 USD keyboard at the current rate of exchange is $4600 CDN. This is before any CDN customs fees, brokerage fees, and cost of shipping.

Back when the US economy suffered in 2008/9 the CDN dollar was worth more than USD. That's about the only time I ever bought from Fort Wayne! I recall back in the 70's the better exchange rate changed places so often that we used to wait till the beginning of a US tour before requesting what funds we wanted to be paid in, but normally our dollar is worth less and that is what keeps trade in balance and tourism alive.

Earned and spent within your own border, a dollar is still a dollar, so a $10 tip from an American is $15 to me. I put away the cash for spending money in the States so I don't have to buy US dollars with my own money.

We have a free trade deal with the European Union and Asia Pacific on manufactured goods imported directly into Canada. These deals may not yet be in effect, I'm not sure. I do know the new NAFTA has yet to be ratified but not too many goods are made in the USA any more so the North American duties need to be paid, usually by the USA, when the cargo lands in LA or NY or wherever the port of entry. At least this is how I've come to understand it.

Last edited by drawback; 04/21/19 12:31 AM.

Arturia Keylab MKii 88 | Mojo61 A/B | iConnectAudio4+ > iOS / MacOS
VI Ravenscroft | Neo-Soul Studio | Acoustic Samples V-Tines | iSymphonic | Pure Synth Platinum | iFretless Bass
Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: drawback] #2986172 04/21/19 01:07 AM
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,272
M
MotiDave Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
M
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,272
Originally Posted By: drawback
How much is lower? Our dollar is set fairly stable now at the rate of approximately 75¢ against the Greenback and Euro. That means a $3500 USD keyboard at the current rate of exchange is $4600 CDN. This is before any CDN customs fees, brokerage fees, and cost of shipping.

Back when the US economy suffered in 2008/9 the CDN dollar was worth more than USD. That's about the only time I ever bought from Fort Wayne! I recall back in the 70's the better exchange rate changed places so often that we used to wait till the beginning of a US tour before requesting what funds we wanted to be paid in, but normally our dollar is worth less and that is what keeps trade in balance and tourism alive.

Earned and spent within your own border, a dollar is still a dollar, so a $10 tip from an American is $15 to me. I put away the cash for spending money in the States so I don't have to buy US dollars with my own money.

We have a free trade deal with the European Union and Asia Pacific on manufactured goods imported directly into Canada. These deals may not yet be in effect, I'm not sure. I do know the new NAFTA has yet to be ratified but not too many goods are made in the USA any more so the North American duties need to be paid, usually by the USA, when the cargo lands in LA or NY or wherever the port of entry. At least this is how I've come to understand it.

Euro has been stable at about $1.12 to $1.15 fo awhile. May look small but thats another 15% delta to your $C.


The baiting I do is purely for entertainment value. Please feel free to ignore it.
Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: MotiDave] #2986173 04/21/19 01:36 AM
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 3,635
WesG Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 3,635
Lol, I wouldn't advise having a fake gig in the U.S. unless you are a U.S. Citizen, have a P2 work visa, or a green card. Working illegally in the U.S. Is a serious crime.


Hammond: L111, M100, M3, BC, CV, Franken CV, A100, D152, C3, B3
Leslie: 710, 760, 51C, 147, 145, 122, 22H, 31H
Yamaha: CP4, DGX-620, DX7II-FD-E!, PF85
Roland: VR-09
Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: WesG] #2986201 04/21/19 11:50 AM
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 54
T
tonybanksfan Offline
Senior Member
Offline
Senior Member
T
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 54
So I can help here if you guys buy any kind of product or item from the USA that is being shipped by UPS.
I complained about brokerage fees being applied to my imported goods to a UPS delvery driver about 20 years ago. He advised me to act as my own broker.
This is what you do to pay nothing for UPS brokerage fees if they are shipped using UPS from the states.
1) When you are advised of your waybill number from the seller and it is trackable in the UPS system, pick up the phone, call UPS and tell them you will act as the broker when your item arrives and are declining their brokerage service.
2) When your item is shipped to your local UPS distribution warehouse, they will notify you of its arrival.
3) You then drive to that UPS facility and collect the paperwork that accompanies the shipment. You sign for it and they give you the necessary documents for step 4.
4) You now proceed to the appropriate Canada customs facility (UPS person will give you the address), give them your paperwork, they fairly quickly look up your imported item, determine its country of origin, and apply all taxs and duties applicable to the item or items. You pay them and they give you the clearance paperwork to take back to the UPS facility.
5) You present this paperwork at the UPS customer pick up area, they retrieve your item from the warehouse location, you sign their paperwork and your all done. You have now saved yourself about $80.
I've done this many times and it usually takes from 1/2 hour to an hour. I live in Winnipeg and my UPS facility and my Canada customs building are only a couple of blocks apart so it is convenient and worth my time. I'm usually doing some other errands anyways and tie them together.
I've even had the customs guys on occasion wave the import duties, but never the tax. Depends who your dealing with and how nice they (and you) are.
Maybe where you live it's just too inconvenient(I'm thinking Toronto) but in a smaller city like Winnipeg its perfect.
UPS is the only carrier with the large brokerage fees.
Given this, I still try to avoid UPS as the carrier but it is no longer a deterrent in buying an item if that's all the seller uses.
There you go, hope this helps.
Brian

Last edited by tonybanksfan; 04/21/19 11:52 AM.

Kurzweil PC3K8/ GSI Gemini Desktop/ CPS SSV3/ GK MB112
Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: tonybanksfan] #2986202 04/21/19 12:14 PM
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 3,635
WesG Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 3,635
Good advice, Brian. I didn't realize that there were customs facilities that were not co-located with border crossings. I'm going to have to find out where my nearest one is.

The other thing I have thought about doing is getting DHL to act as the customs broker for my UPS shipments. I have a DHL brokerage account I have used with LTL shipments. It wouldn't save me much money to do it this way, but it would sure send a message, LOL.


Hammond: L111, M100, M3, BC, CV, Franken CV, A100, D152, C3, B3
Leslie: 710, 760, 51C, 147, 145, 122, 22H, 31H
Yamaha: CP4, DGX-620, DX7II-FD-E!, PF85
Roland: VR-09
Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: tonybanksfan] #2986240 04/21/19 09:20 PM
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 373
I
iluvchiclets Offline OP
Senior Member
OP Offline
Senior Member
I
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 373
Wow - thank you for the very detailed reply! smile


Nord Stage 3, NI Kontrol S61, Komplete, Arturia V-Collection, Yamaha MX49, Kurz PC3, drums, tons of guitars, amps, and pedals...
Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: drawback] #2986289 04/22/19 11:45 AM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 591
bourniplus Offline
Gold Member
Offline
Gold Member
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 591
Once I ordered parts from Vintage Vibe that were shipped through UPS. The extra costs were insane. I still have the receipt somewhere on which I've written "never use UPS again" as a reminder.


"Show me all the blueprints. I'm serious now, show me all the blueprints."
My homemade instruments
Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: bourniplus] #2986352 04/22/19 06:57 PM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 13
D
darcphil Offline
Member
Offline
Member
D
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 13
Also- if you buy from the U.S. you are basically forfeiting the chance to return the merchandise at all. I mean, you can do it, but it's difficult and costly. I learned this the hard way:

Shipping is much more expensive going the other way. And you have to make sure you have the paperwork in order, e.g. commercial import document. Also, unless you include a "Foreign shipper's declaration of foreign goods returned", you will be charged duty on the export, which you will then have to apply to recover. You will also have to apply to recover the tax and duty that you originally paid on the item (which they do say is possible, fingers crossed). Oh, and you'll probably end up eating the brokerage fees. Not to mention taking a bath on the exchange rate going one way and then the other. That part alone cost me a couple of hundred dollars.

Long story short, looks ok on paper, but is actually full of problems and expenses to the point where I will never do it again (the only reason I bought this way is the item I wanted was not available from any dealer anywhere in Canada).

However I do want to send a shout out to Sweetwater Sound, they've been extremely and patient and helpful, to the point of offering to take over the export duty refund application and reimburse me for that themselves. Above and beyond the call.

Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: darcphil] #2986379 04/22/19 11:54 PM
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 190
Polychrest Offline
Senior Member
Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 190
Originally Posted By: darcphil

However I do want to send a shout out to Sweetwater Sound, they've been extremely and patient and helpful, to the point of offering to take over the export duty refund application and reimburse me for that themselves. Above and beyond the call.

Plus one to that. I bought a Spacestation from Sweetwater before they were available in Canada. They made the process painless and transparent. No surprises.


"That's another thing that bugs me, the naysayers who say the music sucked. Come on, you ever been to a gig? The only time it's perfect is when it's on hard drive."
--Lefsetz on Woodstock
Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: tonybanksfan] #2987968 05/03/19 02:34 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 298
Q
Quai34 Offline
Senior Member
Offline
Senior Member
Q
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 298
Originally Posted By: tonybanksfan
So I can help here if you guys buy any kind of product or item from the USA that is being shipped by UPS.
I complained about brokerage fees being applied to my imported goods to a UPS delvery driver about 20 years ago. He advised me to act as my own broker.
This is what you do to pay nothing for UPS brokerage fees if they are shipped using UPS from the states.
1) When you are advised of your waybill number from the seller and it is trackable in the UPS system, pick up the phone, call UPS and tell them you will act as the broker when your item arrives and are declining their brokerage service.
2) When your item is shipped to your local UPS distribution warehouse, they will notify you of its arrival.
3) You then drive to that UPS facility and collect the paperwork that accompanies the shipment. You sign for it and they give you the necessary documents for step 4.
4) You now proceed to the appropriate Canada customs facility (UPS person will give you the address), give them your paperwork, they fairly quickly look up your imported item, determine its country of origin, and apply all taxs and duties applicable to the item or items. You pay them and they give you the clearance paperwork to take back to the UPS facility.
5) You present this paperwork at the UPS customer pick up area, they retrieve your item from the warehouse location, you sign their paperwork and your all done. You have now saved yourself about $80.
I've done this many times and it usually takes from 1/2 hour to an hour. I live in Winnipeg and my UPS facility and my Canada customs building are only a couple of blocks apart so it is convenient and worth my time. I'm usually doing some other errands anyways and tie them together.
I've even had the customs guys on occasion wave the import duties, but never the tax. Depends who your dealing with and how nice they (and you) are.
Maybe where you live it's just too inconvenient(I'm thinking Toronto) but in a smaller city like Winnipeg its perfect.
UPS is the only carrier with the large brokerage fees.
Given this, I still try to avoid UPS as the carrier but it is no longer a deterrent in buying an item if that's all the seller uses.
There you go, hope this helps.
Brian


Funny, I also live in Winnioeg and I've done that anytime I "import" stuff from France that are my belongings and that are still in my garage in France....I don't even pay customs because it's my stuff that I had when I was living in France....
I usually use Canada post when I bipuy from the USA, the fees are very small compared to the other shipping CIE...

Last edited by Quai34; 05/03/19 02:36 AM.

Stage 2, C2, NL2X+TC Pedals, P08+Tetra+H9, P12+TC Chorus D50+PG1000, 2 Matrix 1K, Proteus 2K, TX802, Streichfett, Drumbrute. Guitars:G&L Legacy, Asat X2, Ibanez Artstar AS153.Bass: L2000, SR1200&2605.
Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: Quai34] #2987984 05/03/19 09:05 AM
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 373
I
iluvchiclets Offline OP
Senior Member
OP Offline
Senior Member
I
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 373
Thanks for that note. I have learned a lot from all the replies!


Nord Stage 3, NI Kontrol S61, Komplete, Arturia V-Collection, Yamaha MX49, Kurz PC3, drums, tons of guitars, amps, and pedals...
Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: Polychrest] #2988242 05/05/19 11:43 AM
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 527
W
WheelHead Offline
Gold Member
Offline
Gold Member
W
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 527
Originally Posted By: Polychrest
I bought a used Electro 2 on EBay a few years ago. The seller was in New York State; I’m in the Toronto area.


eBay is a tax collector now if you buy from any State unless the State has no sales tax or has not initiated it yet with them (everything-new or used)

In New Jersey starting May 1st and PA, I believe, starting July 1st (a few days ago for NJ). (and other States at different dates soon if not now) (previously your State tax returns would ask for what you bought and used-to-be: if you ordered from the same State you lived or had a brick-and-mortar outlet in your State, Ebay charged tax on top of purchase price)

Quote from eBay page: "This stems from the supreme court ruling (South Dakota v. Wayfair) regarding internet sales tax. This means that states may now charge tax on purchases made from out-of-state sellers, even if they have no physical presence in that state. <snip> "

New policies, I would think, will not effect Canada, perhaps.

I sold 2 heavy Mackie 1521 PA active speakers once to Canada. The buyer did not want to pay for insurance (this was quite a while ago). I shipped without insurance by UPS only if he sent me a disclaimer that he would accept the speakers if damaged by UPS since there was no insurance. One of the speakers had the cabinet top-corner ripped/crushed from a fall probably stacked in a warehouse or truck fall. He kept it.

WH


Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: WheelHead] #2988332 05/06/19 12:31 PM
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 373
I
iluvchiclets Offline OP
Senior Member
OP Offline
Senior Member
I
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 373
Thanks for the notice - perhaps that will only be in the USA? We'll probably find out shortly....!


Nord Stage 3, NI Kontrol S61, Komplete, Arturia V-Collection, Yamaha MX49, Kurz PC3, drums, tons of guitars, amps, and pedals...
Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: WesG] #2988501 05/07/19 01:20 PM
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 6,540
DanS Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 6,540
Originally Posted By: WesG
Do not ship UPS if you can help it. Their customs brokerage fee is so high it should be criminal. They recently charged me, IIRC, $77 to collect $11 worth of HST.

Every single other carrier I do business with is markedly cheaper. Fedex, DHL, USPS are all better in my experience. USPS transitions to Purolator at the border for parcels.

Note that most of this stuff has no duty on it -- only HST!


Agreed, anyone BUT UPS, or prepare to take it ups the butt with their ridiculous brokerage fees.


What we record in life, echoes in eternity.

MOXF8, XK1c, Motif XSr, PEKPER, Voyager, Univox MiniKorg.
https://www.abandoned-film.com
Re: Canadians Buying Keyboards from the USA - Any Advice? [Re: drawback] #2988504 05/07/19 01:40 PM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 6,823
Outkaster Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 6,823
Originally Posted By: drawback
Something else to bear in mind is what your exchange rate is going to end up to be when you see your Visa statement. I believe it’s set depending on when your lender got their funds, not necessarily what today’s posted rate is. Plus I think there will be a fee involved although I don’t have direct info on this. I’m not an economist, but I went to Murphy’s Law School.

I still believe buying within national borders is your best option. You may think you’re saving 1k by getting something from Florida but there has to be a reckoning somewhere. Plus you’ve already spent maybe a day on this - and I don’t know what your time is worth - but I like to put a dollar figure on stuff like this to see what else it’s costing me, and double it for horseshit & hassle.

Again, I may be totally off course with my information, but it’s the way I do it. YMMV and I wish you luck!



I sold a Triton years ago like that and the guy was in Hamilton. I am only in Rochester but they tacked on $100 on it and the guy was livid. That too awhile to sort out. Just to avoid a lot of negative feedback I refunded some money. It was one of the worst E-Bay experiences because he blamed me for it.


"Danny, ci manchi a tutti. La E-Street Band non e' la stessa senza di te. Riposa in pace, fratello"


noblevibes.com

Page 2 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  Grave Bryce, Stephen Fortner 

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.3