uhoh7 Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 I'm learning lots of chord progressions in all the keys. Each has it's blend of which fingers do what for each change. IE: both upper fingers come down a whole or one drops a half etc. You know what I mean. I have the urge to make some names for those moves to remember them easier, but I would suspect somebody has done that....I searched all over and can't find it. How do you describe "low note drops a half, next remains, and second from top drops a whole whole top note drops a half" in shorthand? There are only a finite number of these in alot of common changes, but I keep forgeting what that certain finger does, and I have to go back to C and watch it LOL Maybe you have other tricks to remember the patterns? Thanks Quote RT-3/U-121/Leslie 21H and 760/Saltarelle Nuage/MOXF6/MIDIhub, SL-880/Nektar T4/Numa Cx2/Deepmind12/Virus TI 61/SL61 mk2 Stylophone R8/Behringer RD-8/Proteus 1/MP-7/Zynthian 4 MPC1k/JV1010/Unitor 8/Model D & 2600/WX-5&7/VL70m/DMP-18 Pedals Natal drums/congas etc & misc bowed/plucked/blown instruments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Williams Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 Not trying to be a smarty-pants, but do you know how to read / write music? Quote -Tom Williams {First Name} {at} AirNetworking {dot} com PC4-7, PX-5S, AX-Edge, PC361 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CEB Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 Do the music until the music does you. The hands just know where to go. If you have to think you're dead. Eventually you get to a mental state of mushin. There are no magic beans. You just have to put in a lot of reps. Quote "It doesn't have to be difficult to be cool" - Mitch Towne "A great musician can bring tears to your eyes!!! So can a auto Mechanic." - Stokes Hunt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJUSCULE Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 "You talkin' 'bout practice? Practice???" Quote Eric Website Gear page Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CEB Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 LOL. Yep. Quote "It doesn't have to be difficult to be cool" - Mitch Towne "A great musician can bring tears to your eyes!!! So can a auto Mechanic." - Stokes Hunt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bif_ Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 Learn the theory to know what notes should be played, practice so you know what fingers to use. What you described sounds like an attempt to avoid that thing called work. Quote Kurzweil Forte, Yamaha Motif ES7, Muse Receptor 2 Pro Max, Neo Ventilator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outkaster Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 Practice and a combination of your ear helps. I have never heard of the terms you are talking about? Quote "Danny, ci manchi a tutti. La E-Street Band non e' la stessa senza di te. Riposa in pace, fratello" noblevibes.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoken6 Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 No keyboard play I know thinks: "F to C? That's top note down a tone..." etc. I would start by playing broken triads of all chords all the way up and down the keyboard: C-E-G, E-G-c, G-c-e etc. Get those so they're second nature to you. You'll never stop needing that knowledge. Cheers, Mike. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synthoid Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 Do the music until the music does you. The hands just know where to go. If you have to think you're dead. +1 Quote When an eel hits your eye like a big pizza pie, that's a Moray. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groove58 Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 Don't think of chord progressions as movements of individual notes ("top note goes up X steps, bottom note goes down Y steps ...") but as movements of whole chords (for example, "C | Am | Dm | G7" in the key of C, which is equivalent to "G | Em | Am | D7" in the key of D, or generically "I | vi | ii | V7" in any key). Just learn the major and minor chords and their variants (7 = dominant seventh, m7 = minor seventh, maj7 = major seventh, etc.) in all 12 keys until you can see the symbol and play the chord instantly without having to think about it (like you can see a word and say it). Do the music until the music does you. The hands just know where to go. If you have to think you're dead. +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drawback Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 I do believe were being messed with. Quote ____________________________________ Rod Here for the gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stokely Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 I don't. It helps I guess that I am not following written music, just making **** up over the chords of songs. I doubt I've ever played the same thing twice (for better or worse!). I'm not a great player and can't solo for crap but one thing I have practiced a LOT is playing different inversions and passing notes as songs change chords, until now it's pretty much second nature. Watching our guitar player it's the same thing for him, I'm in awe at how his fingers just fly all over playing riffs while he's singing and moving around, and standing up (which, if you've played guitar, means you can't really see your fingers...). He's just played a zillion hours is all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
synthizen2 Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 What the OP seems to be going on about are the individual finger transitions when changing chords from, say, inversion I of a C major chord, to inversion II of a G major chord: The pinky stays on the G at the top, while both thumb and index finger move down by 1 white key (half step or whole step). If that's something you always have to be thinking about, as was already mentioned... "if you have to think, you're dead". Coming up with a whole new personal "music theory" in order to make this "easier" to do... will just result in it being more *difficult* to do. SOLUTION: Practice, practice, practice. Yep, those triads and the 4-chord variants... know them inside and out, in every inversion. Then, the individual note transitions between chords will come to you as second nature eventually. Quote Kurzweil PC3, Yamaha MOX8, Alesis Ion, Kawai K3M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobadohshe Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 Do the music until the music does you. The hands just know where to go. If you have to think you're dead. Eventually you get to a mental state of mushin. There are no magic beans. You just have to put in a lot of reps. That's it. There are no shortcuts if you try to create a system to learn it faster it'll just take longer. Just play lots of songs. Your hands need to become intimately familiar with the shape of every chord. That said some Dozen A Day excercises, while at first possibly seeming juveniele, are actually great at getting you a slow, steady and increasingly more challenging feel for your primary chords and inversions in different keys. Quote Kawai C-60 Grand Piano : Hammond A-100 : Hammond SK2 : Yamaha CP4 : Yamaha Montage 7 : Moog Sub 37 My latest album: Funky organ, huge horn section https://bobbycressey.bandcamp.com/album/cali-native Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mate stubb Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 Playing gig in 2 dayz i need acurate tab for Van Halen - I'll Wait Quote Moe --- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doerfler Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 Playing gig in 2 dayz i need acurate tab for Van Halen - I'll Wait Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drawback Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 Playing gig in 2 dayz i need acurate tab for Van Halen - I'll Wait uhoh :wink: Quote ____________________________________ Rod Here for the gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Loving Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 I do believe were being messed with. I agree. Just a troll. Google John Mehegan Quote "Forget it, Jake. It's Chinatown." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazz+ Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 I'm learning lots of chord progressions in all the keys. Each has it's blend of which fingers do what for each change. IE: both upper fingers come down a whole or one drops a half etc. You know what I mean. I have the urge to make some names for those moves to remember them easier, but I would suspect somebody has done that....I searched all over and can't find it. How do you describe "low note drops a half, next remains, and second from top drops a whole whole top note drops a half" in shorthand? There are only a finite number of these in alot of common changes, but I keep forgeting what that certain finger does, and I have to go back to C and watch it LOL Maybe you have other tricks to remember the patterns? Thanks Try not to be feel put down by all the negative replies above. When slowly practicing you can certainly describe it to yourself as you have stated. I find myself talking students through such situations. But what is more important is to see the topography of each chord in terms of black and white keys and also the inversions and eventually the many open voicing possibilities. The fingering can be adlibbed and eventually it will find its best fingering positions through practical use. Quote Find 660 of my jazz piano arrangements of standards for educational purposes and tutorials at www.Patreon.com/HarryLikas Harry was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WesG Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 Do you play another instrument, or is piano your first? Quote Hammond: L111, M100, M3, BC, CV, Franken CV, A100, D152, C3, B3 Leslie: 710, 760, 51C, 147, 145, 122, 22H, 31H Yamaha: CP4, DGX-620, DX7II-FD-E!, PF85, DX9 Roland: VR-09, RD-800 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Docbop Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 It's all about knowing your chord voicings and practicing a lot of common cadences and focus on good voice leading. For me I like to remember chord voicings by numbers 7-9-3-5 moving to 3-5-7-9. I find knowing the formula for chords and cadences make it easier to move to other chords and keys. But its all about voice leading be it simple triads or those big ten note Gospel chords have to think about voice leading and just practicing tunes slowly so you can start seeing chord tones your on and the where the close chord tones are for the next chord. This is where working on one song for a long time can teach a lot. As you get tired of what you're playing you start looking for ways to make it more interesting and eventually get into all sort of styles, reharm's, pedals and etc. All things you can apply to other tunes all from going deep on one tune. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
montunoman Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 For me I like to remember chord voicings by numbers 7-9-3-5 moving to 3-5-7-9. I find knowing the formula for chords and cadences make it easier to move to other chords and keys. Yes, me too. On guitar I remember more the physical shapes of the chords ( especially the movable chords) but piano I think its best to think in terms of the spelling off the chords using the number system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Emm Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 I have a nun stand behind me and whack me in the head with a ruler when I hit a clam. Once the swelling goes down, I know the piece is ready for showtime. Quote "I want to be an intellectual, but I don't have the brainpower. The absent-mindedness, I've got that licked." ~ John Cleese Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Nightime Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 I think Stokely has the right idea. He's just played a zillion hours is all. Quote "In the beginning, Adam had the blues, 'cause he was lonesome. So God helped him and created woman. Now everybody's got the blues." Willie Dixon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Nightime Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 The only time I spell out a chord is if it is a complex chord, with b5#9, Etc. Most times, it's just muscle memory from 42 years on stage. Quote "In the beginning, Adam had the blues, 'cause he was lonesome. So God helped him and created woman. Now everybody's got the blues." Willie Dixon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CowboyNQ Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 I have a nun stand behind me and whack me in the head with a ruler when I hit a clam. Once the swelling goes down, I know the piece is ready for showtime. This is how my left-handed mum was gently encouraged to write fluently with her right hand. The whack was applied to the offending hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CEB Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 My 1st piano teacher used a ruler ..... Seriously. It didn't hurt. She didn't wack me. Just corrected hand posture. I had lazy hands. Quote "It doesn't have to be difficult to be cool" - Mitch Towne "A great musician can bring tears to your eyes!!! So can a auto Mechanic." - Stokes Hunt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Docbop Posted April 11, 2019 Share Posted April 11, 2019 For me I like to remember chord voicings by numbers 7-9-3-5 moving to 3-5-7-9. I find knowing the formula for chords and cadences make it easier to move to other chords and keys. Yes, me too. On guitar I remember more the physical shapes of the chords ( especially the movable chords) but piano I think its best to think in terms of the spelling off the chords using the number system. Being guitar was my instrument for decades chords are very visual, but I also tried to know the spelling so to make voicing leading smoother. Now on piano it's a different type of visual so knowing the spelling/numbers work much better and I'm starting to view guitar that way more now too. In general these days I find figuring out and understanding the concept on why something is done makes it easier to use in other situations and for transposing. Just learning tons of chord fingerings is limiting and time consuming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gg22 Posted April 11, 2019 Share Posted April 11, 2019 There is more than enough information posted already to help the OP to work on his moves. the thread is now closed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CEB Posted April 11, 2019 Share Posted April 11, 2019 Hell it is. Quote "It doesn't have to be difficult to be cool" - Mitch Towne "A great musician can bring tears to your eyes!!! So can a auto Mechanic." - Stokes Hunt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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