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Kurzweil PC4


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...why does the 1/8" stereo audio input offer FX and the two 1/4" inputs don´t ?

 

A.C.

 

:facepalm::freak::idea: What on earth. :o

Yamaha: Motif XF8, MODX7, YS200, CVP-305, CLP-130, YPG-235, PSR-295, PSS-470 | Roland: Fantom 7, JV-1000

Kurzweil: PC3-76, PC4 (88) | Hammond: SK Pro 73 | Korg: Triton LE 76, N1R, X5DR | Emu: Proteus/1 | Casio: CT-370 | Novation: Launchkey 37 MK3 | Technics: WSA1R

Former: Emu Proformance Plus & Mo'Phatt, Korg Krome 61, Roland Fantom XR & JV-1010, Yamaha MX61, Behringer CAT

Assorted electric & acoustic guitars and electric basses | Roland TD-17 KVX | Alesis SamplePad Pro | Assorted organs, accordions, other instruments

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External PSU...

 

That would be a deal breaker.... But I don't think Kurz would do that. Their core customer is a live performer or professional musician.

Sundown

 

Working on: The Jupiter Bluff; Driven Away

Main axes: Kawai MP11 and Kurz PC361

DAW Platform: Cubase

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It's way, way, too early to judge, but that won't stop me...

 

I'm glad they are doing a PC4. It's perhaps not the instrument I hoped for (entirely), but my beloved PC361 started life as a PC2/PC2x, and look how far that came... This could be the beginning of something great.

 

For me, a synth-weighted action is a must. I have 88-notes covered, and Kurzweil has plenty of 88-note instruments in their stable. I don't have the room or the need for another 88, and I like synth-weighted actions for many things. That means I need a 61-key version or a rack mount, which I know won't happen in today's market.

 

The polyphony is great, but the smaller wave ROM is a bit of a disappointment. If it's only forgoing the pianos, that's OK. Again, I selfishly have that base covered.

 

I like the FM addition, but I'd love to see KB3 updated. If you don't own a clonewheel, KB3 isn't too bad, and I think Kurz could re-code it and make it much better.

 

The display doesn't look great, but I'm one of the few who doesn't mind the current PC361 display. Kurzweil has so many clever O/S shortcuts that I don't necessarily need a fancy graphic display. But to keep up with the Joneses in this market, you kind of have to do a big display. This one falls a bit short.

 

I don't like the appearance, but that's highly subjective. It just looks very plasticky. The PC3 series isn't the most handsome either, but design does matter. Function beats form, but I do tend to crave instruments a bit more that have an arresting visual design. A good jet-black color, quality knobs and sliders (with LED crowns), and some quality wood cheeks would fit well with this board.

 

Ultimately it comes down to the playability and the sounds. I love my PC361 because it helps me finish projects. The sounds are useful. It has it's share of massive layers and gargantuan leads (which are fun to play but useless in a composition), but it's filled with highly useable, playable sounds that fit into arrangements. That's the most important consideration of all. Hopefully the PC4 doesn't disappoint on that front.

Sundown

 

Working on: The Jupiter Bluff; Driven Away

Main axes: Kawai MP11 and Kurz PC361

DAW Platform: Cubase

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As long as it's made well, I guess I'm OK with it. My cheap Yamaha PSR external PSU's work fine, but the Krome one was poorly designed, hence the well-documented annoying issues.

Yamaha: Motif XF8, MODX7, YS200, CVP-305, CLP-130, YPG-235, PSR-295, PSS-470 | Roland: Fantom 7, JV-1000

Kurzweil: PC3-76, PC4 (88) | Hammond: SK Pro 73 | Korg: Triton LE 76, N1R, X5DR | Emu: Proteus/1 | Casio: CT-370 | Novation: Launchkey 37 MK3 | Technics: WSA1R

Former: Emu Proformance Plus & Mo'Phatt, Korg Krome 61, Roland Fantom XR & JV-1010, Yamaha MX61, Behringer CAT

Assorted electric & acoustic guitars and electric basses | Roland TD-17 KVX | Alesis SamplePad Pro | Assorted organs, accordions, other instruments

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It's real, i saw a picture in another forum...

 

https://www.musiker-board.de/threads/musikmesse-2019.691679/

 

and no midi through(in the top kurzweil models you can change it to a second midi out...)

Kurzweil K2661 + full options,iMac 27",Mac book white,Apogee Element 24 + Duet,Genelec 8030A,Strymon Lex + Flint,Hohner Pianet T,Radial Key-Largo,Kawai K5000W,Moog Minitaur,Yamaha Reface YC + CP, iPad 9th Gen, Arturia Beatstep + V Collection 9

 

https://antonisadelfidis.bandcamp.com

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I appreciate the ribbon input is back,- but why does the 1/8" stereo audio input offer FX and the two 1/4" inputs don´t ?

 

A.C.

 

 

Why would you think that?

 

1/8" stereo audio input w/ FX,- that´s what the specs say.

 

Then they mention two 1/4" audio inputs (L and R).

 

Can be they update later, but for the time being, the unit got that 1/8" audio input feature from Forte models which don´t offer 1/4" inputs at all.

 

The machine in general appears to me as some patchwork model derived from Forte SE and SP-6,- w/ the exception the ribbon controller input is back, there are now 1/4" audio inputs in addition and we´d have to deal w/ ext. 15V PSU now.

 

What purpose do you think the 1/4" inputs would serve?

My opinion:

 

No need of FX for 1/8" (consumer electronics) input because it´s mainly used for consumer-audio-playback purposes WHEN additional 1/4" L and R inputs exist to connect p. ex. a 2nd keyboard w/o or not enough of quality internal FX.

 

There might be acceptable modulation and/or delay and you want Kurz-Reverb in addition,- a scenario I´d want for one of my keyboards when being connected to the PC-4 via 1/4" inputs.

 

A.C.

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External PSU...

 

That would be a deal breaker....

I don't see how this is a deal breaker. Hypothetically if the Kurz met every requirement that you had or need but has an external PSU, you would still pass on the keyboard? My two cents, but that is the least of my concerns when I'm evaluating a keyboard.

57 Hammond B3; 69 Hammond L100P; 68 Leslie 122; Kurzweil Forte7 & PC3; M-Audio Code 61; Voce V5+; Neo Vent; EV ELX112P; GSI Gemini & Burn

Delaware Dave

Exit93band

 

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Personally as long as its not the wall wart type but a line lump like the one on my SP6 its not an issue for me. I hated wall wart type on my Yamaha MOX8, just one of the reasons I sold it.

Boards: Kurzweil SP-6, Roland FA-08, VR-09, DeepMind 12

Modules: Korg Radias, Roland D-05, Bk7-m & Sonic Cell

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- Plastic body

- external PS

- Medeli keys

 

and they call it PC4 ????

 

C'mon Kurzweil, are you kiddin'???

 

 

Studio: Hammond XK5-XLK5,  Roland Fantom 8, Kurzweil PC3A6, Prophet 5, Moog Sub37, Neo Vent, HX3-Expander, LB Organ Grinder

Live: Yamaha CP88, Yamaha Motif Rack ES, Hammond SKX Pro, Hammond XB2-HX3,  Kurzweil PC3-61, Leslie 251, Roland SA1000, Neo Vent2

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- Plastic body

- external PS

- Medeli keys

 

and they call it PC4 ????

 

C'mon Kurzweil, are you kiddin'???

 

 

Agreed. I know the PC2 had an external power supply but the line is meant to signify high quality. A more accurate name for this board would be SP8 or even Artis SL or something.

 

I suppose the main positive is that if you want a Kurzweil 88, theres a lot of choice...

 

Kurzweil Forte 8

Kurzweil Forte SE

 

Kurzweil PC3k8

Kurzweil PC3a8

Kurzweil PC3x

 

Kurzweil Artis

Kurzweil Artis SE

 

Kurzweil SP6

Kurzweil SP1

 

and now the Kurzweil PC4

 

Kurzweil PC3x

Technics SX-P50

Korg X3

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I have done a quick run down of several of Kurzweils 88 key boards, focussing on four areas: Keyboard Action, Piano Samples, Outputs and Power Supply.

 

Looking through these, I am confused as to why anyone would buy a Kurzweil Artis as it still seems to hold a pretty high price. (Around £1600 UK) If you want an internal power supply and Fatar TP100LR at that pricepoint, surely you would go for the Forte SE.

 

Kurzweil Forte 8

- Fatar TP40L

- Japanese C7, German D and Triple Strike

- Main and Aux outputs

- Internal power supply

 

Kurzweil Forte SE

- Fatar TP100LR

- Japanese C7, German D and Triple Strike

- Main outputs only

- Internal power supply

 

Kurzweil PC3a8

- Fatar TP40L

- German D and Triple Strike only

- Main and Aux outputs

- Internal power supply

 

Kurzweil PC4

- Medeli Action

- Japanese C7, German D and Triple Strike

- Main and Aux outputs

- EXTERNAL power supply

 

Kurzweil Artis

- Fatar TP100LR

- German D and Triple Strike only

- Main outputs only

- Internal power supply

 

Kurzweil Artis SE

- Fatar TP100LR

- German D and Triple Strike only

- Main outputs only

- EXTERNAL power supply

 

Kurzweil SP6

- Medeli Action

- Japanese C7, German D and Triple Strike

- Main outputs only

- EXTERNAL power supply

 

 

Kurzweil PC3x

Technics SX-P50

Korg X3

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- Plastic body

- external PS

- Medeli keys

 

and they call it PC4 ????

 

C'mon Kurzweil, are you kiddin'???

 

 

 

If it holds the price down to an acceptable level, I'm not complaining. I haven't seen any real deal breakers yet.

If you want more, there's always the Forte.

 

I'm withholding judgement until there's more info available, as well as actual units to get hands on.

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and they call it PC4 ????

 

C'mon Kurzweil, are you kiddin'???

 

Yep !

For calling it a PC4, it should come w/ upgraded V.A.S.T. in the sense of faster "vintage" shapeable ENVs instead of linear only, much faster and non-aliasing LFOs, more non-aliasing VA OSCs and generally faster scanner update cycles.

But that might need a partially re-write of the VAST engine and more fast DSPs.

 

FORTE features, more sample content and more memory size compared to a PC3 isn´t enough IMO.

 

But I accept they might need more money for real flagship developement and now release this hybrid.

 

A.C.

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If you want more, there's always the Forte.

 

No, it´s not, because they ditched the ribbon control connector in Forte models.

On a Kurz I want the ribbon controller,- last but not least because it´s very useful together w/ flexible MIDI programming.

And the Kurz´ are good MIDI controllers ...

 

A.C.

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I'm into making the Kurz sounds (I have the original PC3-76) usable and therefore think it is interesting to load PC3 programs such that they sound unchanged, in every way.

 

The audio input used to be usable for getting studio quality digital effects working, something missing altogether a long time already, and a sign there's interest in the way the machine works for different purposes than one-of-the-computer-workstations-with-samples!

 

There's a lot of sound possible with the built in machinery and various levels of programming, but the results aren't used as the (original) studio processing can be, which makes for the promise I was after when I was able to buy the PC3. I'm getting close to getting neutral sound that will also mix, which I dare anybody to do with any of the existing boards and their sounds. There are demos of the ROM sounds, but most of all other recordings in short suck too much but for my taste, with just some exceptions.

 

That's not directly related to needing more sample time, a popular subject, because that's not going to make an instrument suddenly sound right and it's DAC work perfectly. Recording a simple blues with these machines is a good test: can it sound normal with bass and drum, have decent but controlled presence with some solo sound and good harmonic and rhythmic control of say a 1/8 note piano part, and mix a little blues with the sequencer and the effects such that I can be convinced I could do that myself in a lost half hour? I'll bet you it cannot.

 

T.

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This is not the K3000...

 

It's the only K3000 we're ever going to get, and it's close enough for me.

 

I do wish Kurzweil would give us one "Flagship" keyboard with the best of everything they have to offer like Yamaha Roland and Korg usually do. Why not at least make the larger Pianos and Flashplay memory capacity from the Forte an option for the PC4?

 

What world do you live in?

 

To get the best yamaha has to offer, you need a cp88, montage, genosand a stagea..

Also Roland been spreading their tech over many instruments, only serving the low end and middle markets

 

The only instrument offering the best a company ha(d)s to offer is the Korg Kronos..

And just behind that is the Kurzweil Forte..

And maybe the Nord stage 3..

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If you want more, there's always the Forte.

 

No, it´s not, because they ditched the ribbon control connector in Forte models.

On a Kurz I want the ribbon controller,- last but not least because it´s very useful together w/ flexible MIDI programming.

And the Kurz´ are good MIDI controllers ...

 

A.C.

 

 

No argument here. My last Kurzweil was a K2600. I miss both of the ribbons, and I also used the breath controller.

I was disappointed to see you can't even use them as an option on the Forte. I think you still could on the PC3 though.

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I have done a quick run down of several of Kurzweils 88 key boards, focussing on four areas: Keyboard Action, Piano Samples, Outputs and Power Supply.

 

Looking through these, I am confused as to why anyone would buy a Kurzweil Artis as it still seems to hold a pretty high price. (Around £1600 UK) If you want an internal power supply and Fatar TP100LR at that pricepoint, surely you would go for the Forte SE.

 

Kurzweil Forte 8

- Fatar TP40L

- Japanese C7, German D and Triple Strike

- Main and Aux outputs

- Internal power supply

 

Kurzweil Forte SE

- Fatar TP100LR

- Japanese C7, German D and Triple Strike

- Main outputs only

- Internal power supply

 

Kurzweil PC3a8

- Fatar TP40L

- German D and Triple Strike only

- Main and Aux outputs

- Internal power supply

 

Kurzweil PC4

- Medeli Action

- Japanese C7, German D and Triple Strike

- Main and Aux outputs

- EXTERNAL power supply

 

Kurzweil Artis

- Fatar TP100LR

- German D and Triple Strike only

- Main outputs only

- Internal power supply

 

Kurzweil Artis SE

- Fatar TP100LR

- German D and Triple Strike only

- Main outputs only

- EXTERNAL power supply

 

Kurzweil SP6

- Medeli Action

- Japanese C7, German D and Triple Strike

- Main outputs only

- EXTERNAL power supply

 

 

Strange things, Kurzweil moving to Medelli

While Nord moves to Kawaii

 

I know what i prefer...

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I'm under the impression Kurzweil needed to get weight down to compete in the gigger's scene, hence the Medelli in the SP6. Their other meat and potatoes is the Broadway shows where they also now compete with software and who knows what controllers. In that scenario, the TP-40L based models are great for playing acoustic piano, electric piano, strings, brass, synth, organ, etc. Pitch wheel, mod wheel, ribbon controller, foot controllers all useful. But I don't know how much these shows are using Kurzweil sound engines any more with MainStage and RMS KeyboardPatchSolutions.

Yamaha CP88, Casio PX-560

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Once bitten...too many issues with my pc3. I'd have to wait and see if they have gotten better with quality control. I love the fact that they have a decent b3 organ engine *cough* Yamaha, c'mon *cough*
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External PSU...

 

That would be a deal breaker....

I don't see how this is a deal breaker. Hypothetically if the Kurz met every requirement that you had or need but has an external PSU, you would still pass on the keyboard? My two cents, but that is the least of my concerns when I'm evaluating a keyboard.

 

I understand there will be different points of view on this, but to me, it's a simple signal as to whether it's a professional instrument or not. Top flight, roadworthy instruments are generally going to have internal PSUs.

 

When I see an external PSU, I interpret it to be midgrade or prosumer.

Sundown

 

Working on: The Jupiter Bluff; Driven Away

Main axes: Kawai MP11 and Kurz PC361

DAW Platform: Cubase

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I understand there will be different points of view on this, but to me, it's a simple signal as to whether it's a professional instrument or not. Top flight, roadworthy instruments are generally going to have internal PSUs.

 

When I see an external PSU, I interpret it to be midgrade or prosumer.

 

Why would you care about an external PSU if you'd never take the board out?

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I understand there will be different points of view on this, but to me, it's a simple signal as to whether it's a professional instrument or not. Top flight, roadworthy instruments are generally going to have internal PSUs.

 

When I see an external PSU, I interpret it to be midgrade or prosumer.

 

Would you consider the $8000 Moog One 16-voice Analog Synthesizer midrange or prosumer then? Since it has a 19v external power supply.

Boards: Kurzweil SP-6, Roland FA-08, VR-09, DeepMind 12

Modules: Korg Radias, Roland D-05, Bk7-m & Sonic Cell

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I understand there will be different points of view on this, but to me, it's a simple signal as to whether it's a professional instrument or not. Top flight, roadworthy instruments are generally going to have internal PSUs.

 

When I see an external PSU, I interpret it to be midgrade or prosumer.

 

Why would you care about an external PSU if you'd never take the board out?

 

Because it signals the intent/target market for the instrument. You're not going to find world-beating, top flight features coupled with an external PSU. Porsche doesn't engineer a world-class powertrain with a finely-tuned front suspension and then slap a solid rear axle on their vehicles. The two just don't go together.

Sundown

 

Working on: The Jupiter Bluff; Driven Away

Main axes: Kawai MP11 and Kurz PC361

DAW Platform: Cubase

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I understand there will be different points of view on this, but to me, it's a simple signal as to whether it's a professional instrument or not. Top flight, roadworthy instruments are generally going to have internal PSUs.

 

When I see an external PSU, I interpret it to be midgrade or prosumer.

 

Would you consider the $8000 Moog One 16-voice Analog Synthesizer midrange or prosumer then? Since it has a 19v external power supply.

 

Now that's interesting... I didn't know that.

 

That's how you change minds...

Sundown

 

Working on: The Jupiter Bluff; Driven Away

Main axes: Kawai MP11 and Kurz PC361

DAW Platform: Cubase

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