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Deepmind 12 - Examples and observations


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Accessing patches is relatively easy. You save the ones you want to use in a gig as a "Favorite". Then at the gig press Prog -> FX and move the scroll wheel. A menu will come up listing all of your favorites in the order which you saved them. I keep the menu up and just scroll to the patch I want. I saved them in order of the setlist. So its usually 1 click of the scroll wheel. I also rename them to make them more sensible. Usually the song name I use it on.

Boards: Kurzweil SP-6, Roland FA-08, VR-09, DeepMind 12

Modules: Korg Radias, Roland D-05, Bk7-m & Sonic Cell

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  • 5 months later...


I'm about to order. I can't believe the piano and organ in this thread, impressive. Strings superb.

RT-3/U-121/Leslie 21H and 760/Saltarelle Nuage/MOXF6/MIDIhub, 

SL-880/Nektar T4/Numa Cx2/Deepmind12/Virus TI 61/SL61 mk2

Stylophone R8/Behringer RD-8/Proteus 1/MP-7/Zynthian 4

MPC1k/JV1010/Unitor 8/Model D & 2600/WX-5&7/VL70m/DMP-18 Pedals

Natal drums/congas etc & misc bowed/plucked/blown instruments. 

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Old thread, but I gotta say I've been loving my Deepmind, had it for a few months now. Here's a song I put together using it, an Arturia Drumbrute Impact, strings from a Proteus, and a bit of shoddy bass playing. All the sounds from the Deepmind I programmed myself from the ground up, and I'd like to think of some of them as being not the typical intended use of the instrument... I've got some synth 'lap steel' and a patch I created to sort suggest or sit in the sonic space of a wurlitzer or upright piano. The song itself is like country influenced Tycho, so understand its weird and clashing for the sake of being weird and clashing.

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Mine arrived a few days ago. Found it on the bay "open box" for 580, but it was sealed (keyboard version). Wow. I'm just learning the basics, this is my first synth. I went back and forth for months on what to get, and watched 100s of YTs on everything 1500 or less. One day I wanted a neutron, then a maxibrute etc. Digitackt, Peak, Minilog, I can't believe the choices. As I started to narrow to the DM12, I went back and watched all the intro videos when it was rumoured and then first reviewed. Haha, I had no idea.

 

Controversial, OMG!

 

But it was the more obscure reviews which tipped me, one was a studio pro who had a bunch of synths, new and old, but he said this was the one for the desert Island. I kept coming accross players who just fell in love with it.

 

I was tempted by the ModX, but I wanted to get some skills which would work with other analog style synths, and that yamaha interface is......unique. Also the ModX is twice the money ;)

 

Anyway, I love the thing. I hope I live long enough to work it all :) Great build, it's sitting on my old SL-880 (which is now alternating between lower DM manual, and a hammersmith, or both) BTW I finnaly got a decent piano sound with the hammersmith, optical out from Macbook Pro to a DAC, then into the IK micros. Giant leap in sound (and the other popular pianos sound alot better too), though my upright is under no threat. Nor my Hammond, from the DM, it's just so fun, and inspiring to have all the keyboard options.

 

The DM's abilty to do such a variety of rich and varied sounds is....mindblowing. I'm just going through the patches and playing with the modwheel and a few sliders now, and reading up. The effects are really something. I'm circling that wild control sequencer....and the arp. The patches give you a taste of all the possiblites.

 

Huge help to have all the tutoirals on YT also, once upon a synth and a few other guys are just fantastic. That was another factor which made me choose the DM. If I had to gripe, it would be about the bed, which is not bad, and pretty tight in it's own way, but just a bit "small" seeming, the key size. The Hammond spoils you totally in un-hammered action. No synth action I've seen is close. Cmon Fatar, step up!!

 

I can't want to see that UBX-a coming in a few months, after all the new monos drop, each a seeming tasty affordable masterpiece, though TYG my synth craving is fully met for the moment with the DM12.

 

All these beds have me seriously shedding now. :)

RT-3/U-121/Leslie 21H and 760/Saltarelle Nuage/MOXF6/MIDIhub, 

SL-880/Nektar T4/Numa Cx2/Deepmind12/Virus TI 61/SL61 mk2

Stylophone R8/Behringer RD-8/Proteus 1/MP-7/Zynthian 4

MPC1k/JV1010/Unitor 8/Model D & 2600/WX-5&7/VL70m/DMP-18 Pedals

Natal drums/congas etc & misc bowed/plucked/blown instruments. 

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uhoh7, cool, sounds like you did your homework and got an inspiring synth for not much money- congrats! The holy grail for many of us that don't have alot of moolah but are endlessly sound motivated.

 

Check back in and give us a further report once you've had it for awhile-

Numa Piano X73 /// Kawai ES920 /// Casio CT-X5000 /// Yamaha EW425

Yamaha Melodica and Alto Recorder

QSC K8.2 // JBL Eon One Compact // Soundcore Motion Boom Plus 

Win10 laptop i7 8GB // iPad Pro 9.7" 32GB

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I find the action in my DM12 similar to my XP-80. It may not be quite as snappy - but both are semi-weighted (with weights under the keys) feel close to the same weight in practice, and have about the same distance from the key pivots to the ends. I can get consistent velocity responses from both when I move into the action - something that unfortunately is not the norm these days.

 

I find the DM12's action solidly out of the budget category of boards like the FA-06 and KingKorg. But I have one of the later runs. I guess the earlier ones had issues.

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I cant find this keyboard locally, so cant take it for a test drive. What is the keybed like? How would you describe the action: solid, light, flimsy, fast...

 

It's diving board style. I just took a close look and compared it to 5 keybeds, riffing. At first, thought...hmm those black keys look narrow. WTF? Then I woke up, the black keys on my Numa Compact 2x (TP/9) are wider, but i feel both sides of my fingers between the black keys, when I have to reach in. You don't get that in the DM12. So you get a great feel between black keys. The springs are very light, which I think is much better. The Numa is over sprung. Aftertouch is very good. The key travel is not as long as any off my other beds, but does not effect expressivity. Conclusion: this is a very fast bed. Somebody thought quite a bit about it. Key length is a bit under 5.5 ", near identical to Hammond, shorter than the numa, which is right on 5.5. My hammered beds are 6".

 

What throws you off is the mechanical noise. It's not the volume of the click when the key rebounds and hits the top, its the light plastic tone. My other beds have more of a thud, just as loud or louder (upright piano is louder), except a Nektar T4 bed I have, which has a similar noise. BTW that bed is super expressive, with a very deep aftertouch and long soft travel, very unique.

 

But once you have some volume...we don't notice those noises. LOL.

 

All that said, you can get the DM12 without a keybed and save about $125ish.

 

But plastic clicks aside, the DM12 keybed, in terms of function, is excellent. Way better than I thought at first. You have several curves for velocity and AT. And you can MIDI in with anything, and controllers are very cheap these days, like Roland or Komplete A-49s.

 

One note: the DM12 is not multi-timbral. Polyphonic, yes, but any exterior controller will be playin the same patch as the main board. It can't play two patches at once. I was a little surprised about this when I first read it, but once I heard it, I forgot ;)

RT-3/U-121/Leslie 21H and 760/Saltarelle Nuage/MOXF6/MIDIhub, 

SL-880/Nektar T4/Numa Cx2/Deepmind12/Virus TI 61/SL61 mk2

Stylophone R8/Behringer RD-8/Proteus 1/MP-7/Zynthian 4

MPC1k/JV1010/Unitor 8/Model D & 2600/WX-5&7/VL70m/DMP-18 Pedals

Natal drums/congas etc & misc bowed/plucked/blown instruments. 

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I'm a doubting Thomas when it comes to Behringer. I realize that they have their own factory in Asia, and their quality is greatly improved. I have read that the KB's are not very good, and the screens die in due time.

 

I suppose that you still can't buy a Merecedes for the price of a KIA. I would consider the desktop version if it were possible to change programs on it without having to use Midi Change messages to the unit every time you need to change it. Bad idea.

 

It still has too much reverb for my taste, but the sounds Bush got out of his unit are VERY impressive.

 

One final note. Sweetwater has the desktop selling for $599 whicn is rock bottom. I am assuming it comes with their 2 year warranty and free shipping. That makes it an incredible deal.

Yamaha Motif ES8, Alesis Ion, Prophet 5 Rev 3.2, 1979 Rhodes Mark 1 Suitcase 73 Piano, Arp Odyssey Md III, Roland R-70 Drum Machine, Digitech Vocalist Live Pro. Roland Boss Chorus Ensemble CE-1.

 

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Currently considering an analogue desktop model..

 

Either the DM12 or the Novation peak..

Both are quite different, so maybe both

They will be a great addition to my modx8

 

Any advice is welcome tough..

 

Maybe a DM12 as 2nd keybed, controlling the peak?

 

Hi. DM12 and Peak owner here. (I have also accumulated various other synths over the years, because I am oldso have some sense of perspective on synth tone, I think.). If you have specific questions/comparisons re Deepmind vs. Peak , I will try to answer if you want.

 

I would say up front that they are *both* instruments you can enjoy and make music with. The Peak costs more and imo there are good reasons for thatboth re its features and because you are paying for Novations good customer support and experience in the synth business. But the Deepmind is also, as you can see from other responses here, not a bad synth.

 

One question: When you say youre considering an analogue synth what are your expectations? In other words, *why* do you want an analogue synth? These days, different people use that word to mean different things...

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  • 7 months later...

So many great synths, that new hydra looks fantastic.

 

But the more I learn the DM12, the more impressed I am. I think I paid 525 for the keyboard 12 voice. Even right now, with so much cool stuff, at such low prices, that is beyond a steal. The more you play the more you love :)

 

It's so helpful that there are many good synth gurus who've made tutorials on it. I'm always turing up new, interesting ones.

RT-3/U-121/Leslie 21H and 760/Saltarelle Nuage/MOXF6/MIDIhub, 

SL-880/Nektar T4/Numa Cx2/Deepmind12/Virus TI 61/SL61 mk2

Stylophone R8/Behringer RD-8/Proteus 1/MP-7/Zynthian 4

MPC1k/JV1010/Unitor 8/Model D & 2600/WX-5&7/VL70m/DMP-18 Pedals

Natal drums/congas etc & misc bowed/plucked/blown instruments. 

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Those are some really nice sounds, BB. :thu:

 

I don't have one, but the DM12 is kind of an oddball synth.

Really nice because it has a lot of the programming features I like to use.

 

But at the same time it has some limitations that might be frustrating at times.

Mainly things like the oscillator configuration, being mono-timbral (not a deal breaker for me),

lack of an audio input, and a few other things.

 

It'd be great if they came out with a V2, rather than dropping the whole concept for something else.

Even if they don't, I still wouldn't mind getting one sometime.

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Accessing patches is relatively easy. You save the ones you want to use in a gig as a "Favorite". Then at the gig press Prog -> FX and move the scroll wheel. A menu will come up listing all of your favorites in the order which you saved them. I keep the menu up and just scroll to the patch I want. I saved them in order of the setlist. So its usually 1 click of the scroll wheel. I also rename them to make them more sensible. Usually the song name I use it on.

 

Is that documented somewhere? I couldn't find it in the manual.

 

Doesn't look like it allows saving the same patch twice, which makes it less like a setlist feature.

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Is that documented somewhere? I couldn't find it in the manual.

 

Doesn't look like it allows saving the same patch twice, which makes it less like a setlist feature.

 

It's not a setlist feature, but it is documented on page 12 chapter 4.5 of the manual. It's very helpful for accessing patches spread out over the keyboard that you call up often. There are so many patches on the board I never use, that I just created a few that work for my purposes and call them up in the favorites. There are only about 15 of them. I do more bread & butter sounds on my SP6 than anything else.

 

If you want it to act like a setlist, you can always take an entire bank and rewrite each of the 128 locations and rename them to the song on your list in whatever order you want. Personally instead of doing that I would get a tablet or phone app that would send midi program changes. I use a program called 'setlist' on my iPad. I use to control both my SP6 & DM12.

Boards: Kurzweil SP-6, Roland FA-08, VR-09, DeepMind 12

Modules: Korg Radias, Roland D-05, Bk7-m & Sonic Cell

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It's not a setlist feature, but it is documented on page 12 chapter 4.5 of the manual.

 

Oh, interesting, looks like they updated the manual--the version I was reading doesn't have that, but I downloaded a new version from their website that does. Thanks, more reading to do!

 

It's very helpful for accessing patches spread out over the keyboard that you call up often. There are so many patches on the board I never use, that I just created a few that work for my purposes and call them up in the favorites. There are only about 15 of them. I do more bread & butter sounds on my SP6 than anything else.

 

If you want it to act like a setlist, you can always take an entire bank and rewrite each of the 128 locations and rename them to the song on your list in whatever order you want. Personally instead of doing that I would get a tablet or phone app that would send midi program changes. I use a program called 'setlist' on my iPad. I use to control both my SP6 & DM12.

 

Yeah, I'm currently copying everything I care about to low numbers in the "A" bank, which makes navigation very easy. I haven't gone so far as to arrange them in setlist order since I only have a few so far.

 

I already use an app (MobileSheets Pro) that claims to support sending MIDI on song changes, so I'll look into that next. Unfortunately most of my sounds are coming from my PX-560 which won't accept registration changes over MIDI. I may give up and replace it eventually just over that issue; the band I'm playing with likes to minimize transition time, and between changing songs on the app and patches on both keyboards, I'm usually the slow one. Or else I get flustered and fudge the start of the new song.

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So many great synths, that new hydra looks fantastic.

 

But the more I learn the DM12, the more impressed I am. I think I paid 525 for the keyboard 12 voice. Even right now, with so much cool stuff, at such low prices, that is beyond a steal. The more you play the more you love :)

 

It's so helpful that there are many good synth gurus who've made tutorials on it. I'm always turing up new, interesting ones.

 

The hydrasynth is a big reason I don't have a DM12 already, considering the silly low price you can get them for. Not that they are in any way similar as far as sound--but simply that I can't just add keyboard after keyboard to my live OR studio rig (studio "rig" is software anyway). The poly aftertouch and ribbon on the Hydra are really appealing to me as a controller. I need to see if it can do "simple analog" to go with its crazy wave sounds. I've played the DM12 and the action is fine with me, as is the build quality (it's more substantial overall than my MODX7, AND has a built-in power supply too.)

 

In other words, when I can "strike", I need to make it count (or the wife's ire descends upon me like the arrows of the Persians.....)....she sees "keyboards" no matter if they are controllers, analog, organs or whatever and too many spells trouble! :D

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

I finally got the thing out to a gig last weekend, after what...three years? It did pretty well. There"re only a couple of my sounds that need more tweaking for the live set...mostly just need to dial back the amount of OSC-drift. Most of the noises filled in well with the band. Gotta say that it is so nice to have Aftertouch expression in my live rig again. Quite anxious for the next show...a much smaller, intimate bar scene.

I"m sure it has been mentioned before, but Behringer"s soft case for this board is of exceptional quality.

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I finally got the thing out to a gig last weekend, after what...three years? It did pretty well. There"re only a couple of my sounds that need more tweaking for the live set...mostly just need to dial back the amount of OSC-drift. Most of the noises filled in well with the band. Gotta say that it is so nice to have Aftertouch expression in my live rig again. Quite anxious for the next show...a much smaller, intimate bar scene.

I"m sure it has been mentioned before, but Behringer"s soft case for this board is of exceptional quality.

 

I'm sure you know, but it also has "note off velocity" control.....per key. I don't know of another board that does. So, for example you can modulate envelope release based on how fast you let up.

 

Somebody said it has too much reverb LOL? It has whatever reverb you want---huge array of digital effects, up to 4, 10 ways of stacking them.

 

The DM 12 is now the most documented polysynth you can buy. Y-tube has 3 guys who are making patches with you "let's make a drum machine"... super high quality tutorials.

 

There are a number of tricks and tweaks that allow the DM12 transcend the Juno mold exponentially. The modwheel can be trained to do some wild stuff in short order. 3 envelopes where you have not only ADSR, but the curves for each, and a choice of about 8 different triggers besides a key press.

 

There are many little tricks with the oscillators.

 

It's a monster in the mix if you want it that way. Huge rich poly phonic bass....warms your heart. Model D flavor can be had in various ways. Or you can rustle up a gorgeuos generative pad to put under your keys. It's become a secret favorite of alot players with more fancy stuff in the room.

 

I haven't even really started with the control sequencer yet...but the arp is fine.

 

Build quality? Outstanding. PWS is built in. All metal body, excellent quality on controls and the keybed, as noted is also excellent.

 

I just ordered a Stylophone Gen 8 to go with it. :)

 

[video:youtube]

 

RT-3/U-121/Leslie 21H and 760/Saltarelle Nuage/MOXF6/MIDIhub, 

SL-880/Nektar T4/Numa Cx2/Deepmind12/Virus TI 61/SL61 mk2

Stylophone R8/Behringer RD-8/Proteus 1/MP-7/Zynthian 4

MPC1k/JV1010/Unitor 8/Model D & 2600/WX-5&7/VL70m/DMP-18 Pedals

Natal drums/congas etc & misc bowed/plucked/blown instruments. 

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  • 8 months later...

I'm resurrecting this thread because I'm in the market for a new MIDI controller, for use with MainStage.

 

The controller I'm considering (Arturia KeyLab MkII) will cost between $450 and $500. The advantage of this is that I own all of the Arturia synths...however, I also have a ton of other synths so having "exclusive control" over the Arturia stuff really isn't a huge motivator for me...

 

I'm thinking that for another $200 or so for the Deepmind 12 I'd get a controller with aftertouch, expression pedal outputs, and built-in power supply (not to mention a very capable polysynth!). I also like the "simplicity" of it; from the many reviews, I've watched. The Deepmind seems to be more limited (in a GOOD way) which won't get in the way of my getting lost in endless patch creation...seems like a nice, little basic synth...

 

Your thoughts?

 

As an afterthought...I'd also be open to the idea of a used synth, something not too expensive...again, the fact that it makes "a sound" is a big plus...

Or am I just crazy? ;)

Tom

Nord Electro 5D, Modal Cobalt 8, Yamaha upright piano, numerous plug-ins...

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For me, it is a self-contained box of levers, buttons and sliders that exudes wondrous sonic textures causing blissful moments of amazement nearly every time the thing receives current; even these years later.

 

Being so smitten with this board"s internal capabilities, I cannot offer much insight how it may perform strictly as a controller. I"ve absolutely no experience with MainStage so no help there either. However, I use an iPad quite a bit and find the Numa 2X much more suited as a controller, likely because of the MIDI and audio over one usb cable. MODX too, though that"s a super deep beast as well.

 

Good luck on your quest.

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I'll just leave my $.58 worth of opinion here:

 

I have both the Arturia Keylab61 black edition, and the Keylab MKII Black edition.

They are both great boards. I've used my 1st Keylab for years on gigs without any issue. I like the "full size" keys...as compared to what I call mini keys of boards like the Roland FA-06, etc..

 

My subjective opinion is they keys play wonderfully. The after touch is implemented very well. You don't have to be careful not to trigger it whi8le at the same time, you don't have to exert too much force to use it.

I can get smooth and linear CC from 0-127.

 

Big bonus, of course, is it's natural mapping to all the Arturia software instruments.

 

They are metal chassis. Built tough.

For the money, I think they are great.

 

Now then, as a disclaimer. I am using my NI Komplete Kontrol S61 MKII more and more in my rig. Since all my Arturia instruments are now NKI capable, the Komplete Kontrol is awesome.

It does not have the sliders, however, that the Arturia does. For me it's not an issue.

 

When setting up and designing my sounds on the Arturia instruments, it's really nice having name of the parameter right there on the screen of the Komplete Kontrol. Bonus: when scrolling thru the presets using the Komplete Kontrol, it plays you an audition of the sounds.

 

Caveat, the Komplete Kontrol is more expensive than the Arturia.

 

Either of the above would work great with your Arturia software. The Deepmind, and others mentioned are also good. I just prefer having a controller that can natively (or NKI) map my software so I can quickly design and modify sounds.

 

Keylab 61 on stage

U8hBVC.jpg

 

 

Komplete Kontrol onstage and at home(programming)

QsloPl.jpg

 

h5K7KC.jpg

 

HtHHTg.jpg

David

Gig Rig:Casio Privia PX-5S | Yamaha MODX+ 6 | MacBook Pro 14" M1| Mainstage

 

 

 

 

 

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  • 1 year later...
Burningbusch, your patches are simply stunning. The depth, the detail, etc. Can you tell me what the original patch for some of these are? Especially the brass and jazz guitar. TIA. keep up the killer work.You should release a DM bank for sale on your website.
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Mainstage is pretty friendly to controllers, and you can configure lots of stuff on the Mac. Every slider and wheel on the DM12 can send MIDI, and I always thought it could make a great controller. What is also nice: you have a reliable analog polysynth that will not tax your computer and can make big sounds. The digital effects are extensive. The interface is classic, and not hard to learn. Many videos.

 

All this said, most good VAs do all this on multiple channels. That's the only "heel" of the DM12: it makes one instrument on one channel at a time. If you want a light cheap controller with much of it's own power, and have patience to study the book, a MOFX is cheap used, and has huge MIDI power, many buttons, channels, every instrument, and a very complex sequencer with a ton of presets to drive a whole band. It was made for gigging. My 61 key is like 18 LBS? No aftertouch, but the keys are very easy on the joints. It has a million arp patterns, for all kinds of genres, each can send to MIDI, four at once I think. The newer MODX is a different beast with it's own strenghts and headaches, moving all the buttons to a single touch screen being one. The MOXF is still widely used in live shows, and was really the last MOTIF.

 

You could find one of these for $500 easy:

 

[video:youtube]

 

I play it more than the DM12, but love them both :)

 

Many rave about the System 8 Roland as well, but that and the MODX are double the money, and less proven live. Anyway, the point is, this thing is a good contoller and can belt out a whole band by itself as well. The arps change chords at one touch etc. Pretty fun.

 

The DM 12 has a deep arp, but you pretty much have to tell it everything, and it's just one MIDI channel's worth. The forte of the DM12 I think is as a teacher of the classic synth interface, and as a single instrument....which could also be an impressive controller.

 

A multi-channel DM12 = Access Virus TI. It's a VA but general interface is same model as DM12, and it is very powerful. Remains in wide live use in EDM scene. Simliar features as controller as DM12. Great effects machine for any instrument. The 61 key version has the famous TP8/S keybed, best synth keybed to date. But these are over 1K.

 

In the 500 range NEW, Studiologic Numa CX2, would also be a good Mainstage controller. Very limited sounds onboard, but good pianos and organ.

RT-3/U-121/Leslie 21H and 760/Saltarelle Nuage/MOXF6/MIDIhub, 

SL-880/Nektar T4/Numa Cx2/Deepmind12/Virus TI 61/SL61 mk2

Stylophone R8/Behringer RD-8/Proteus 1/MP-7/Zynthian 4

MPC1k/JV1010/Unitor 8/Model D & 2600/WX-5&7/VL70m/DMP-18 Pedals

Natal drums/congas etc & misc bowed/plucked/blown instruments. 

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