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#2979178 - 03/07/19 04:51 PM Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things"
Sundown Offline
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Jan Hammer may be the most proficient bender I've ever heard, but when it comes to getting the most out of an individual synth note, I gotta give my Man Winwood a shout-out. I love the opening notes to "The Finer Things". His solo in the middle and in the end reminds me of a sax player. What a great synth player...

Any guess what instrument he's using for the leads?

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#2979183 - 03/07/19 05:12 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Sundown]
Mike Martin Offline
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#2979184 - 03/07/19 05:15 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Mike Martin]
Mike Martin Offline
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Edited by Mike Martin (03/07/19 05:15 PM)

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#2979185 - 03/07/19 05:18 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Mike Martin]
Mike Martin Offline
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#2979186 - 03/07/19 05:23 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Mike Martin]
Sundown Offline
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Originally Posted By: Mike Martin
Best thread ever on the same topic
http://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/1105282


Hilarious... smile
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#2979190 - 03/07/19 05:46 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Sundown]
Al Coda Offline
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Originally Posted By: Sundown


Any guess what instrument he's using for the leads?


In that vid at 03:41 it looks like a DX7,- but it sounds like his signature MOOG Multimoog leadsound.

Yes, he also used Prophet-5 and other synths/keys, but this sound to my ears is the Multimoog.
He prefered it over the Minimoog because of the early aftertouch called "force sensor" which allowed modulation of OSCs or VCF via the modulation bus and it had OSC sync.

Doesn´t mean he wasn´t able recreating that sound on other instruments later.

A.C.

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#2979192 - 03/07/19 05:54 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Al Coda]
ksoper Offline
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I'm almost positive this is a Multimoog. My memory of the 80s is faulty, but I think he said in an interview it was the Multimoog. It's two synced analog oscillators which narrows things down a bit.

I may be wrong.

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#2979196 - 03/07/19 06:12 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: ksoper]
Al Coda Offline
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Originally Posted By: ksoper
I'm almost positive this is a Multimoog. My memory of the 80s is faulty, but I think he said in an interview it was the Multimoog. It's two synced analog oscillators which narrows things down a bit.

I may be wrong.


I added some info above because many, many years ago, I´ve read it in an interview too.
It was about recording his solo albums after he had realized his home studio on his farm.

In the old thread linked above, no one found out what it really was.
In the vid you don´t see/hear what you get,- it´s just only the official vid.

A.C.

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#2979259 - 03/08/19 07:39 AM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Al Coda]
PianoMan51 Offline
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Oh man, did anybody notice that the cat doing the Carlton dance is Mark Ledford?

RIP. He made some beautiful music with the PMG.

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#2979264 - 03/08/19 08:22 AM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: PianoMan51]
Phnymiboy Offline
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Winwood does a beautiful Moog solo on John Martyn's One World album, track Small Hours.

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#2979267 - 03/08/19 08:56 AM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Phnymiboy]
MathOfInsects Offline
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Originally Posted By: Phnymiboy
Winwood does a beautiful Moog solo on John Martyn's One World album, track Small Hours.


Actually that's a Nord.
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#2979277 - 03/08/19 09:52 AM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: MathOfInsects]
Al Coda Offline
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Originally Posted By: MathOfInsects
Originally Posted By: Phnymiboy
Winwood does a beautiful Moog solo on John Martyn's One World album, track Small Hours.


Actually that's a Nord.


Wiki

Track listing

All tracks composed by John Martyn except where indicated.

1)"Dealer" – 4:58
2)"One World" – 4:10
3)"Smiling Stranger" – 3:29
4)"Big Muff" (Martyn, Lee Perry) – 6:30
5)"Couldn't Love You More" – 3:07
6)"Certain Surprise" – 3:52
7)"Dancing" – 3:43
8)"Small Hours" – 8:45

Personnel

John Martyn - vocals, guitar, harmonica
John Field - flute (2)
Steve Winwood - bass (1), electric piano (2, 6), Moog synthesiser (1, 3, 8), Yamaha organ (5, 8)
Dave Pegg - bass (7)
Neil Murray - bass (3)
Andy Newmark - drums (1)
Morris Pert - percussion (4, 8)
Harry Robinson - string arrangements (3, 6)
Hansford Rowe - bass (2, 4)
Bruce Rowland - drums (6, 7)
Keshav Sathe - tabla (3)
Danny Thompson - bass (5, 6)
John Stevens - drums (3, 4)
George Lee - saxophone (3)
Rico Rodriguez - trombone (6)

A.C.

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#2979278 - 03/08/19 10:00 AM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Al Coda]
MathOfInsects Offline
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I think Wiki got that one wrong. It’s definitely a Nord.
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#2979290 - 03/08/19 11:11 AM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: MathOfInsects]
Phnymiboy Offline
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Originally Posted By: MathOfInsects
I think Wiki got that one wrong. It’s definitely a Nord.


Unless you are just having fun with us I don't think there was a Nord in 1977.

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#2979293 - 03/08/19 11:23 AM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Mike Martin]
Rod S Offline
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Originally Posted By: Mike Martin


I went through the thread and find an old comment I wrote. I have a vague idea what I was gettin at... confused freak ... but it seems I was being an ass, which seems to be on par with that phase of my life.

I pity the new generation that have their lives recorded in the internet, whether posts, videos, photos, whatever - searchable for years to come.
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#2979295 - 03/08/19 11:39 AM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Phnymiboy]
area51recording Offline
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Originally Posted By: Phnymiboy
Originally Posted By: MathOfInsects
I think Wiki got that one wrong. It’s definitely a Nord.


Unless you are just having fun with us I don't think there was a Nord in 1977.


Painfully obvious even to the most casual observer....

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#2979308 - 03/08/19 12:43 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: area51recording]
eric Offline
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Winwood was one of the Nord inventors and used low key prototypes of the Nord Lead for decades. It is well documented.

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#2979309 - 03/08/19 12:47 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Rod S]
EscapeRocks Offline
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Originally Posted By: Phnymiboy
Originally Posted By: MathOfInsects
I think Wiki got that one wrong. It’s definitely a Nord.


Unless you are just having fun with us I don't think there was a Nord in 1977.
Originally Posted By: Rod S
Originally Posted By: Mike Martin


I went through the thread and find an old comment I wrote. I have a vague idea what I was gettin at... confused freak ... but it seems I was being an ass, which seems to be on par with that phase of my life.

I pity the new generation that have their lives recorded in the internet, whether posts, videos, photos, whatever - searchable for years to come.



Please. please. please let's not go back to the days of that most annoying thread.

The nord thing was maybe funny the first one thousand times it was posted in 2002-2003.

If you look at that 17 year old thread closely, you will see it was started and continued by some of the ne'er-do-well trolls from another forum that just closed.
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#2979311 - 03/08/19 12:50 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: eric]
MathOfInsects Offline
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Originally Posted By: eric
Winwood was one of the Nord inventors and used low key prototypes of the Nord Lead for decades. It is well documented.


The Nord website used to have the story of this song and even had a link to an early recording of it where you could hear Winwood giving feedback to the Nord engineers about how to refine the sound. I don't know why they removed it, it was a really cool bit of music history.
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#2979317 - 03/08/19 01:33 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: area51recording]
Piktor Offline
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In listening to the whole tone pitch bends that Windwood does in the intro, I would venture that this is not a Multimoog. These bends are quick and the intonation sounds spot on, as if the bend range had been set to exactly a whole tone (not a fan). Multimoogs did not have programable bend ranges. The bend range on both of my Multimoogs is a minor 6th, give or take. Yes, Winwood did use the Multi on the Arc of a Diver album, but something about the patch's attack makes me think that I the lead in this video was played with a DX7, as that tone is achievable with FM if one has the programming chops. I did find a video of someone who got close to this sound with an Andromeda, so Winwood could has used an analogue synth too. It doesn't sound like an overly complex patch to me.

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#2979332 - 03/08/19 02:41 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Mike Martin]
jerrythek Offline
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Originally Posted By: Mike Martin


True, but...

In it I state: "Mitchell’s column teaches how to do this on a Prophet-5 (real or virtual), as Winwood used one extensively at that time. But reading interviews from that time (like the June ’81 Keyboard), Winwood stated that he used a Multimoog for the solo in “While You See A Chance.” He also told Musician magazine in October 1982, “the Multimoog is where I get the effect that everybody thinks is a saxophone.” That should put to rest any Internet chatter that it was a Minimoog, or even a Yamaha DX7, which he did use later in concert."

So my best bet would be for the Multimoog.

Cheers!

Jerry

P.S. what makes the research hard is what he said in a Musician Magazine interview, but it is from before the Back In The High Life album:

"For the last 2 albums I've used a Multimoog for bass and some lead lines, and a Prophet 5, a polysynthesizer made by Sequential Circuits, for most leads on Arc of a Diver. I also used a Steinway piano and a Yamaha CS-80, too, as well as a host of different guitars: an Ovation acoustic, this 1954 Fender Stratocaster, an Ibanez mandolin on a track of Arc of a Diver.

On this last album, I used the Prophet 5 exclusively, which is very limiting; I would never have dreamed that I would have found myself doing that. I just never found the need for any sound I couldn't get out of the Prophet 5. And the Multimoog is where I get the effect that everybody thinks is a saxophone. In terms of drums, I use a Haman kit, with a Ludwig snare, and a Linn Electronics, LM-1 box. Lastly, I use a Roland Vocoder and an ANS Phaser, model DMT20. By using a 16-track machine, you overcome most limitations on the part of the instruments, in addition to several of one's own shortcomings. And with my new-found wealth, I've already ordered a new 24-track custom board.
"Rock's Gentle Aristocrat"
Musician, October 1982"

So although he states the Prophet is his favorite, and can do "everything" he still credits the Multimoog for that lead sound. Hmmm....


Edited by jerrythek (03/08/19 06:57 PM)

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#2979359 - 03/08/19 05:28 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: jerrythek]
Motif88 Offline
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Multi Moog...I owned and read every issue of keyboard magazine from 1977 through now. I distinctly remember it being a multimoog as I struggled to replicate it on my MS20 or Oberheim OB
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#2979367 - 03/08/19 06:46 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Motif88]
waygetter Offline
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People don’t realize the full history of Nord. It actually started way back in the early 1900s led by Bob Nord, and before they had keys they were making guitars and other stringed instruments. They started off with a small shop in Seattle, and using a variation of the popular “strum” style, they put the name together and the rest is history.
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#2979379 - 03/08/19 09:03 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Motif88]
Piktor Offline
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I remember the Keyboard mag Winwood interview well. His discussion about using the Multi stuck with me, because that was the synth that I owned. However, the song in this video came out in 1986, a time when many people were moving on from analogue synths for digital synths. The Multimoog was released in 1978 and the DX7 came out in 1983. Winwood's lead sounds on the Arc of a Diver album (1980) and the Talking Back to the Night Album (1982) are similar, but the lead sound in this video is different. Note, there is clearly another DX7 (ep) in the intro, so you know that the instrument was there. If you listen carefully, Winwood is getting a bit of pop on the some of the attacks/releases. The Multi's envelopes aren't so snappy and I cannot get so close to that sound (without a compressor). Therefore, I'm not changing my vote.

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#2979383 - 03/08/19 09:55 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Piktor]
MathOfInsects Offline
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This is all I could find. I remember that later in this article it goes into how he secretly played his prototype for what became the Nord on every recording he did from 1975 (when the first prototypes were brought to him) until whatever time period the article was from.

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#2979385 - 03/08/19 10:22 PM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: MathOfInsects]
Sundown Offline
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Originally Posted By: MathOfInsects
This is all I could find. I remember that later in this article it goes into how he secretly played his prototype for what became the Nord on every recording he did from 1975 (when the first prototypes were brought to him) until whatever time period the article was from.



roll roll roll
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#2979400 - 03/09/19 03:22 AM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Sundown]
nursers Offline
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Love this relatively recent performance of his - amazing how good his voice is as well:

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#2979417 - 03/09/19 06:25 AM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: waygetter]
Synthoid Offline
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Originally Posted By: waygetter
People don’t realize the full history of Nord. It actually started way back in the early 1900s led by Bob Nord, and before they had keys they were making guitars and other stringed instruments. They started off with a small shop in Seattle, and using a variation of the popular “strum” style, they put the name together and the rest is history.


The early Nords were quite popular in Russia... sold at Barnes & Chernobyl stores.
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#2979424 - 03/09/19 07:15 AM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: Phnymiboy]
xp50player Offline
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This is why I come on here, to be sent down a rabbit hole into an artist I have never looked into, but who has worked with some of my favorite artists. On the John Martyn, I have to know what Winwood’s FM-sounding vibes sound is on “ Couldn’t Love You More” E-70, D-80, CP30? It just says “Yamaha organ”.

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#2979425 - 03/09/19 07:57 AM Re: Milking every note... Winwood's "The Finer Things" [Re: xp50player]
Sundown Offline
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Originally Posted By: xp50player
This is why I come on here, to be sent down a rabbit hole into an artist I have never looked into, but who has worked with some of my favorite artists.


Be sure to check out not just his solo work, but the things he's really well known for... The Spencer Davis Group, Traffic, Blind Faith. etc. Amazing stuff...


Edited by Sundown (03/09/19 07:58 AM)
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