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#2952662 - 10/11/18 10:18 PM Radial Key Largo recording
UnderGroundH Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/19/06
Posts: 232
Loc: Keratsini, Hellas
Hello.
I bought a Key Largo. I want to use it, mostly for recording.
I patch all my synths and i made some tests.
I made an aggregate device to use it in parallel with my duet firewire.
While it sounds fantastic, when i try to record, i must set my volume full in my synths and set the input of keylargo to full to have a loud recording.
For example, when i use my Kurzweil K2661, i must go to output page and increase the db to have a recording near to 0 db in Logic.
This is a method i used with my apogee duet when i recording through the xlr inputs(so i did not use duet's pre amplifiers but only converters).
Is it normal the behavior of key largo;

The other problem i have, is, when i record something in logic, while i listen to it when i record it, i don't listen to it when i playback(i use the monitor outputs of key largo).

Thanks.


Edited by UnderGroundH (10/11/18 11:40 PM)
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Kurzweil K2661+full options, iMac 20", Mac book white, Apogee duet, Genelec 8030A, Logic X, Kawai K1, Strymon Lex and Flint, Vox Satchurator, Hohner Pianet T, Radial Key-Largo, Kawai K5000W, Minitaur

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#2952869 - 10/13/18 01:44 PM Re: Radial Key Largo recording [Re: UnderGroundH]
UnderGroundH Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/19/06
Posts: 232
Loc: Keratsini, Hellas
Concerning the recording issue people from Radia wrote to me,l that is a normal operation. They made it primary as a live mixer so the recording feature is a "bonus".
I made recordings from the same midi track to both key largo and duet.
With minitaur the duet has a bigger headroom and sound a little better...
With a Kurzweil piano the differences is difficult to hear...

If we assume the they have the same price and duet is a recording device only, then radial done the recording job very well...

The second problem was my fault. I forgot to open usb volume...i know i am stupid...


Edited by UnderGroundH (10/13/18 01:48 PM)
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Kurzweil K2661+full options, iMac 20", Mac book white, Apogee duet, Genelec 8030A, Logic X, Kawai K1, Strymon Lex and Flint, Vox Satchurator, Hohner Pianet T, Radial Key-Largo, Kawai K5000W, Minitaur

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#2952872 - 10/13/18 01:50 PM Re: Radial Key Largo recording [Re: UnderGroundH]
davedoerfler Offline
KCFF League Champion 2017
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 12/27/12
Posts: 7775
Loc: the swamp
no one here believes what you said about yourself. You made an omission and corrected it. All humans make mistakes. Glad you got it sorted out. thu
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#2952873 - 10/13/18 01:59 PM Re: Radial Key Largo recording [Re: davedoerfler]
UnderGroundH Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/19/06
Posts: 232
Loc: Keratsini, Hellas
I'm self-masquerading... smile
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Kurzweil K2661+full options, iMac 20", Mac book white, Apogee duet, Genelec 8030A, Logic X, Kawai K1, Strymon Lex and Flint, Vox Satchurator, Hohner Pianet T, Radial Key-Largo, Kawai K5000W, Minitaur

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#2952992 - 10/14/18 10:19 PM Re: Radial Key Largo recording [Re: UnderGroundH]
UnderGroundH Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/19/06
Posts: 232
Loc: Keratsini, Hellas
Yesterday i made more recording tests between key largo and duet.

I wrote a bass line (midi) from minitaur.
The connections was :

to duet through pre amplifiers(11 db)
to key largo
Key largo through duet's pre amplifiers(11 db)
Key largo through duet's pre amplifiers(22 db)
Key largo through duet's converters +4db
Key largo through duet's converters -10db

A piano from kurzweil to duet pre amplifiers(11 db)
A piano from kurzweil to key largo

All recordings was near to 0 db

I check the differences by ear but mostly comparing waveforms. I check all of that with a sound engineer, friend of mine.

Key largo has less headroom than duet. Noticeable more with moog less with kurzweil. The duet waveforms was more "open" especially with moog.
Key largo has more silent pre amplifiers with less noise. The wave forms had less "body" than duet's but the edges was more filled...

Because i bought this to record my keyboards(i bored to patch 4 different synths to duet all the time) i am near to take the decision to keep it.

The lesser noise(than duet) and the compressed wavs allows to do not use compressors when i must mix my songs.

For Digital synths the differences is difficult to hear...

The recording combination(key largo through duet) was lesser interesting.
I decide to use any of the cards alone for recording...

I will make some more tests with Kawai K5000, today. Kawai has "hot" outputs...




Edited by UnderGroundH (10/14/18 11:18 PM)
_________________________
Kurzweil K2661+full options, iMac 20", Mac book white, Apogee duet, Genelec 8030A, Logic X, Kawai K1, Strymon Lex and Flint, Vox Satchurator, Hohner Pianet T, Radial Key-Largo, Kawai K5000W, Minitaur

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#2953030 - 10/15/18 08:55 AM Re: Radial Key Largo recording [Re: UnderGroundH]
hardware Offline
Platinum Member

Registered: 03/04/14
Posts: 1466
Loc: Macau
I havenít conducted scientific testing but ran my DSP Rack XLR out to TRS inís, then XLR out of KL into powered cabinets.
I lowered my gain on the K8.2s and raised the Largos output.
Itís like I put a mic pre onto it.
Now Iím using it as an AUX where my ASIO channels get Big Sky Strymon, and other 2 channels are discrete audio synths.
Code 8 gets Strymon Timeline, SE-02 gets Strymon Deco.

Iím glad I experimented with this.
I was trying to go all hardware but I canít get the Horn sections to sound the way I wanted so the PC stays.

But Key Largo sounds good when the Master Outs are hot.
And I canít say enough about the Strymon FX Pedals.
My entire rig now is SHARC ADSP-21369 Chips anddiscrete Audio synths.
Neo Vent, Strymon all use SHARC DSP and are worth the extra dough.
I like Big Sky better than my TC Fireworx or PCM90.
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Magnus C350 + FMR RNP + Realistic Unisphere Mic

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#2953036 - 10/15/18 09:24 AM Re: Radial Key Largo recording [Re: hardware]
UnderGroundH Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/19/06
Posts: 232
Loc: Keratsini, Hellas
I try to understand how good is key largo for recording.
I am sure that is great for live use.
_________________________
Kurzweil K2661+full options, iMac 20", Mac book white, Apogee duet, Genelec 8030A, Logic X, Kawai K1, Strymon Lex and Flint, Vox Satchurator, Hohner Pianet T, Radial Key-Largo, Kawai K5000W, Minitaur

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#2953039 - 10/15/18 09:26 AM Re: Radial Key Largo recording [Re: UnderGroundH]
DanS Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 11/14/00
Posts: 6530
Loc: Montrťal
Originally Posted By: UnderGroundH
I try to understand how good is key largo for recording.
I am sure that is great for live use.


It is very nice for live use, 3rd gig & counting. laugh
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#2953041 - 10/15/18 09:43 AM Re: Radial Key Largo recording [Re: DanS]
UnderGroundH Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/19/06
Posts: 232
Loc: Keratsini, Hellas
I do not use it for live use yet.
I patch all my synth to key largo and the monitor out to my pair of Roland CM-30 for studio use(not recording).
Before key largo i have hiss from monitors. With key largo...quiet !


Edited by UnderGroundH (10/15/18 09:48 AM)
_________________________
Kurzweil K2661+full options, iMac 20", Mac book white, Apogee duet, Genelec 8030A, Logic X, Kawai K1, Strymon Lex and Flint, Vox Satchurator, Hohner Pianet T, Radial Key-Largo, Kawai K5000W, Minitaur

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#2953050 - 10/15/18 10:31 AM Re: Radial Key Largo recording [Re: UnderGroundH]
hardware Offline
Platinum Member

Registered: 03/04/14
Posts: 1466
Loc: Macau
Thatís even better news as I am about to use Monitor Out for QSCs and Main XLR to House.
Still want to hear about how good it records.

Just thought Id share my happiness with it.
But itís a Radial, it should be a cut above everything else.
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Magnus C350 + FMR RNP + Realistic Unisphere Mic

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#2953081 - 10/15/18 01:27 PM Re: Radial Key Largo recording [Re: hardware]
UnderGroundH Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/19/06
Posts: 232
Loc: Keratsini, Hellas
It records very good. Not as good as duet but very close. If you think that both has the same price and duet is only a sound card then the radial is a winner!
Unfortunately i cannot share the recordings i made to listen to the differences...


Edited by UnderGroundH (10/15/18 01:39 PM)
_________________________
Kurzweil K2661+full options, iMac 20", Mac book white, Apogee duet, Genelec 8030A, Logic X, Kawai K1, Strymon Lex and Flint, Vox Satchurator, Hohner Pianet T, Radial Key-Largo, Kawai K5000W, Minitaur

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#2953132 - 10/16/18 01:03 AM Re: Radial Key Largo recording [Re: UnderGroundH]
UnderGroundH Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/19/06
Posts: 232
Loc: Keratsini, Hellas
I made some more tests with Kawai K5000W and K1, yesterday...
I send the waves files to sound engineers and told me that the differences in recordings(vs duet) are small ones and the benefits are so many(patch all synths) + the live use + di's etc.
So i take the decision to keep it and i am very happy about it.
_________________________
Kurzweil K2661+full options, iMac 20", Mac book white, Apogee duet, Genelec 8030A, Logic X, Kawai K1, Strymon Lex and Flint, Vox Satchurator, Hohner Pianet T, Radial Key-Largo, Kawai K5000W, Minitaur

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