Music Player Network Home Guitar Player Magazine Keyboard Magazine Bass Player Magazine EQ Magazine
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >
Topic Options
#2949692 - 09/23/18 06:10 PM Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B"
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
My Danelectro '56 Baritone arrived yesterday, and I spent a lot of time on it today, in comparison also with my Hagstrom Viking DLX Baritone.

I HATED the Danelectro at first, but as I intended to play it in "A" while keeping the Hagstrom in "B", I then down-tuned and it completely changed my experience and opinion of this guitar. Suddenly the neck felt good, and playing it was both a joy and and inspiration, with two new pieces written already.

The thing is, it came strung with EXL158's, which start at 0.013" and end at 0.062". The EXL157 set that I pre-ordered for this guitar as a replacement set is what I thought it would come with anyway, as they are designed specifically for this guitar and as the guitar itself is promoted as ideal for "A" tuning (it was shipped tuned to "B").

The Viking (a semi-hollow-body 335-like guitar) has a GHS Boomer set that is a bit less than my idea, and I had bought an EXL158 set to replace those strings soon, with identical gauge except for the GHS low string being a 0.060" and definitely wanting the 0.062" of the D'addario set.

In playing both guitars, I'm thinking the Viking is probably ideal with the lighter gauge, and that the Danelectro is possibly a bit TOO twangy with the 13's, but I'm nervous about switching to 14's as the bottom string is 0.068" and this might remove all twang from the sound altogether as well as requiring a professional setup?

The Viking might do OK with even heavier gauge strings, and it's 28" whereas the Danelectro is 29.75". So logic would dictate putting the heavier set on the shorter scale instrument, except that they're not going to be tuned the same.

I'm just not sure tension-wise whether these other factors, along with wanting the Danelectro for a bit of a twangier sound anyway and often using the Viking as a "middle voice" between bass and lead guitar, changes the equation from my original assumption that the GHS 13's would get replaced by the D'addario 13's on the Hagstrom, and the Danelectro would get the D'addario 14's would go on the Danelectro.

These are not cheap string sets (though not as bad as bass strings), and my regular guitar tech is 99.99% unavailable anymore so I'd have to feel super-confident taking it to the GC tech guy (who is quite good, but works by their standards instead of his own, so can't be flexible or spend much time on actual advice and the like).

Anyone have any strong feelings about whether it is advisable to stick with the original plan of 13's on the Hagstrom and 14's on the Danelectro, as well as whether the Danelectro string switch would be risky without simultaneous pro setup work?


Edited by Mark Schmieder (09/23/18 06:13 PM)
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
GP Island
#2949711 - 09/23/18 10:27 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Larryz Offline
10k Club

Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 11577
Loc: Northern California
I won't stick my neck out [pun intended] as I know little if anything about baritones. But, I do know a pro set up is a great way to go and the time to do it is after you decide which gauge you want to use and pack a set with you when you take the guitar in. The techs I work with will take the time to answer your questions knowing they will make a buck or two on the set up (like about $50 bucks).


I'm guessing you haven't had that Danelectro long enough to make a decision. When you tuned down and it felt great and came to life, I think I would consider keeping it as it came with the 13's. Congrats by the way! thu
_________________________
Take care, Larryz

Top
#2949720 - 09/24/18 02:00 AM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Larryz]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
Thanks, Larry. I'm not used to A/B comparisons of baritones as I've never had more than one at a time at home or in a store.

My guitar tech keeps falling further behind, and as he had a heart attack last Thanksgiving, I've been hesitant to push him more than I have, on stuff that still isn't done a year later.

I like the work the guy at Guitar Center in Concord CA did on my mandolin family of instruments (these aren't ones my regular techie is comfortable working on anyway), but he is necessarily "short" on conversation (understandably so); whereas I'm used to discussing options, rationales, and technical details -- even if rushed into a few quick sentences. I get the impression that's not really an option at GC; you pretty much hand it over and take what you get. But their current guy IS really good at least.

I guess I'm so used to waiting an eternity to get anything back, that I've stopped changing gauges/etc. before a setup and try to analyze and figure it out beforehand. Continuity of thought is important too, and I lose that after a super-long wait.

As long as it is "safe" to try a heavier gauge on either of these baritones, I may go ahead. It's just strange that there was almost universal recommendation for 14's on the Danelectro and that D'addario even says they came out with the heavier gauge specifically for that model, knowing that people will likely tune it to "A" instead of "B".

Strings can change after broken in anyway though, so probably I should give this a bit of time, to see how the intonation and overall stability of the Danelectro hold up with 13's. It doesn't have a whammy bar, and I like some twang but not overkill, and also will actually play chords occasionally on this instrument so the heavier gauge will help keep those in tune with themselves.

It's surprising to me how big the difference is between the two sets, but GHS also now has a medium gauge set for baritone and its lowest string is a 0.070" gauge.

These are bigger differences than between most bass guitar sets, which is why I'm concerned about tension and what the instruments can handle -- especially after two of the charango family instruments that I ordered from well-known luthiers in Bolivia recently, started busting strings between plays even if I down-tuned before putting in the case.
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2949745 - 09/24/18 07:04 AM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Larryz Offline
10k Club

Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 11577
Loc: Northern California
@ Mark, My tech gets my guitars back within a week so I guess I'm pretty lucky. I can see where a heart attack would slow one down though. I can set my intonation on my electrics and do minor adjustments, but I like having my tech do it along with the truss rod adjustment, cleaning, string change, etc. It's all inclusive in the set up price. If you change gauge, especially a radical change like going from a 60 to a 70, I would definitely take it in. I think there is something wrong with those Bolivia luthiers if the strings are busting in the case LOL! cool


Edited by Larryz (09/24/18 07:04 AM)
_________________________
Take care, Larryz

Top
#2949807 - 09/24/18 12:31 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Larryz]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
Thanks, Larry. I've been loyal for 20 years but I had to do Saturday's gig on a different bass than I intended as the Hofner still isn't back after so many months I can't remember. I have a severe astigmatism so don't trust my vision for delicate work, and definitely a big gauge change like .060" to .070" is safer with someone who does this all the time. Saving money isn't my main thing; time is my biggest limitation at this point in my life.

I have spent 100 hours analyzing and researching all of the possible factors in the charango failures, and as I waited many days before opening the cases, to adjust to the 14,000 foot elevation change and other climate differences. The bottom line is that I think the bridge and nut weren't sanded and cleaned of tiny particles that can stress and weaken strings prematurely, but also nylon strings break the easiest of any. Beyond that, there was the mystery of the intended tuning, which I am now confident of, but which doesn't match the third-party seller's info from back-and-forth (in perfectly good Spanish) comm.
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2949883 - 09/24/18 06:00 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
A co-worker agrees that going to 14's on the Danelectro for the A tuning -- even though they were designed specifically for that guitar -- would likely bring it back to the playability issues and lack of inspiration I felt when I tried it in its shipped default of 13's in B.

I tend to like arch tops a bit heavier gauge though, so will probably consider going to 14's on the Hagstrom Viking Baritone instead, as I only plan to do single-note lines for the most part and more in a supporting contrapuntal role, so don't need much bend.
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2957289 - 11/10/18 04:36 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
Funny how things change. Now that the strings are more broken in on both baritones, I am feeling the Danelectro is too squishy with the 13's and would still have enough twang and bend with 14's; whereas the Hagstrom just needs a slightly better balanced set and so will benefit from the D'addario's vs. the GHS's.

In both cases, the middle string is the best currently, and the bass string the weakest, so both baritones would address the main issue using either set.

Also though, I'm finding the Hagstrom really good for chord playing now that it's more broken in, and the arch-top feel and sound really make it distinct from the Danelectro, so even if both were tuned to "B" (I tuned the Danelectro to "A"), they cover very different territory. The Danelecto is more "washy" overall, but sometimes the more articulate nature of the Hagstrom can be wrong for the song.


Edited by Mark Schmieder (11/10/18 04:37 PM)
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2957538 - 11/12/18 04:04 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Winston Psmith Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 02/15/10
Posts: 3581
Loc: Inside the Beltway
Not sure if this will help, but D'Addario has this for figuring string gauge tension. All of us with ERG's and Baritones are dealing with this issue; seems almost like there's no real standard string set? Anyhow, here you go, good luck . . .

D'Addario String Gauge Tension
_________________________
"Monsters are real, and Ghosts are real too. They live inside us, and sometimes, they win." Stephen King

http://www.novparolo.com

Top
#2957543 - 11/12/18 04:23 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Winston Psmith]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
Cool; that's a good resource. They do also now publish string tensions for all sets -- I wish the other vendors would do the same, as even string specialty stores have incomplete information for a lot of sets (especially for more exotic instruments).

I know exactly what direction (and by how much) I want the tension to go, so I may even put together a custom set. have to check string length as well though; that can sometimes be a challenge.

http://www.daddario.com/upload/tension_chart_13934.pdf

The link above is for the full PDF, which I just downloaded and printed for offline referencing.


Edited by Mark Schmieder (11/12/18 04:28 PM)
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2957709 - 11/13/18 10:36 AM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Winston Psmith Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 02/15/10
Posts: 3581
Loc: Inside the Beltway
Originally Posted By: Mark Schmieder
have to check string length as well though; that can sometimes be a challenge.


Yeah, I ran into that issue with an 8-string set. It had a .080 for the 8th string, which seemed great, until I opened the set, and found that the string had been made for something with a Bass' scale length; I'd have wound up with a bird's nest wound around the peg head. Really, they must have just jammed a Bass string into a 7-string set, and sent it out.
_________________________
"Monsters are real, and Ghosts are real too. They live inside us, and sometimes, they win." Stephen King

http://www.novparolo.com

Top
#2957737 - 11/13/18 01:00 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Winston Psmith]
d Online   content
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 03/20/01
Posts: 7215
Loc: no longer lexington, Kenfunky,...
This may not help much, as I generally take a less strict tack on the "how" of gear & more a focus on the music but sometimes a diff view point can offer a new approach.

As a generality, my "less is more" approach leads me to use the lightest gauge I'm comfortable with.
Many players like heavier strings for the tonality but I find that to be as much a matter of "learned perception" as actual, if you see what I mean.
There's such a history of standard approaches to things that when enough ppl say something it becomes authoritative even if not absolutely factual.
Classic example: the "all down-strokes" idea of many rock players.

Anyway that's what I'd consider 1st: what's the range of gauge that actually feels good when you play (& keep in mind the lighter, the less stress on the gtr, frets & yer fingers).

You mentioned creating yer own sets.
It once was commonplace for stores to offer options of creating custom sets; is that flying in yer vicinity ? Or if you buy sets & select strings from them do you have a ready, cost-effective way to trade the ones you don't use ?
_________________________
d=halfnote

Top
#2957813 - 11/13/18 09:39 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: d]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
In my case, my opinions come from changing what I do constantly, and coming to different conclusions than the ones that were hammered into me in the pre-internet age by the small-town experts that were all I had to go by.

Independently, I came up with the all-down-strokes-only philosophy, based on my ears, and not knowing anyone else agreed with me as most fight me on it and quote small-town experts for instance.

My teachers were all super-macho, even on clarinet, so I was brought up to believe you want the thickest reed, the heaviest strings, the highest action, etc. It took me many years to develop the confidence to go up against this expert advice.

So, yes, I like to know the how and why, because my ears usually come to different conclusions than the experts. :-)

Please note that these comments are SPECIFIC to bass guitar vs. electric solid body guitar, but are made here anyway, because I suspect my baritone playing is going to follow more along the lines of my bass playing -- though I've seen divergence in my approach over time (I am leaning now more towards using guitar technique on the baritone).

Also, I have a Bass VI to pick up, and may put flat-wounds on it. Not sure yet how I'll approach that instrument, but probably with a plectrum. baritone goes either way for me; plectrum or finger-style -- just like bass.



Edited by Mark Schmieder (11/14/18 03:47 PM)
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2957860 - 11/14/18 06:50 AM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Larryz Offline
10k Club

Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 11577
Loc: Northern California
I like using GHS 10-50's on all my guitars (acoustic and electric) for string gauge...+1 when researching sets, I really liked D'Addario posting the string tensions on all of their strings on-line and on the package. I used to have to have a wound 3rd, but now prefer a plain 3rd to get rid of some string squeak... cool
_________________________
Take care, Larryz

Top
#2957897 - 11/14/18 10:50 AM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Larryz]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
One has to be careful about wound vs. plain 3rd's though, as not every guitar can handle the wound string. Sometimes just the nut has to be re-cut, but my understanding is that certain bridges can't deal with them. Maybe a Balanced Tension set helps there though.
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2958017 - 11/15/18 07:25 AM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Larryz Offline
10k Club

Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 11577
Loc: Northern California
Most acoustics come with a wound 3rds. My Taylor T5 came with two bridge saddles, one for wound and one for plain 3rds. Electrics are no problem as long as you are using lighter sets like 9' or 10's, so that the 3ds stay in the lighter gauges like the 18, 20, 22 zone...

I used to always use wound 3rds for rhythm playing as the open chords can sound tinny on some guitars but all of my guitars sound pretty good and the plain 3rds bend easier... cool
_________________________
Take care, Larryz

Top
#2958019 - 11/15/18 07:32 AM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Winston Psmith Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 02/15/10
Posts: 3581
Loc: Inside the Beltway
Originally Posted By: Mark Schmieder

Please note that these comments are SPECIFIC to bass guitar vs. electric solid body guitar, but are made here anyway, because I suspect my baritone playing is going to follow more along the lines of my bass playing -- though I've seen divergence in my approach over time (I am leaning now more towards using guitar technique on the baritone).

Also, I have a Bass VI to pick up, and may put flat-wounds on it. Not sure yet how I'll approach that instrument, but probably with a plectrum. baritone goes either way for me; plectrum or finger-style -- just like bass.



The Fender Bass VI can go either way, too; IIRC, the late Jack Bruce used one with Cream, at least briefly. It also makes a great Surf/Rockabilly Guitar, strung with Flats.
_________________________
"Monsters are real, and Ghosts are real too. They live inside us, and sometimes, they win." Stephen King

http://www.novparolo.com

Top
#2958324 - 11/16/18 09:48 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Winston Psmith]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
See my review of the Schecter Hellcat-VI that I just posted in the bass forum a few minutes ago.

I originally thought I might put flats on the VI, but I don't want to mess with anything as it's perfect as-is.

I may put flats on my Danelectro Baby Sitar though. It shipped with round 10's and I was going to go to 10-1/2's or 11's, probably in a balanced set, but saw 11 flats at GC today, with a wound 3rd. As long as it's OK to use a wound 3rd, I prefer that as one loses the sitar-like effect on the unwound strings on that instrument anyway.

It's doubtful I'll put flats on either my Hagstrom Viking Baritone or my Danelectro Baritone. I love flats, but when the rounds are perfect on a specific instrument, I go looking for something else to be my target for flats. I bought the Pat Metheny arch-top to put flats on; my D'angelico has rounds.
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2958327 - 11/16/18 09:52 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
It looks like the ECG24 set would be safe to put on an electric:

http://www.daddario.com/DADProductDetail...b6-ca332175a0e9

I thought I had a set of flatwound electric strings from D'addario on something, but I checked my chart and I don't (that's faster than opening a dozen cases). Unless I bought some for the next string change, for one of them, which I doubt as most currently have Thomastiks.
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2958363 - 11/17/18 07:17 AM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Larryz Offline
10k Club

Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 11577
Loc: Northern California
I used Thomastik flats for quite some time. Excellent strings but just got to be too damned expensive. I switched to D'Addario Chromes in 10-48 and they worked just as well for half the price! I loved the silent running with no string squeak using flats with a wound 3rd. Only problem was I was giving up a lot of my bass tone so I decided to go back to roundwound squeak and all as the flats got to be too thumpy flat bass sounding.

Then I found the GHS (Eric Johnson) set of 10-50's with a plain 3rd in pure nickel rollerwound. A lot less squeak, nice feel, easy bending, nice bass and I love the gauge. They have found their way to all of my guitars... cool


Edited by Larryz (11/17/18 07:19 AM)
_________________________
Take care, Larryz

Top
#2959217 - 11/22/18 07:08 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Larryz]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
It was kind of tricky doing the chart comparisons as I have bad eyesight (including an uncorrected astigmatism), but after several repeats to correct for mistakes, I found that the EXL157 Medium Baritone set would only pose potential risk to the tension in the low 4th and 5th strings, which would both be slightly higher tension down-tuned to "A" then using the EXL158 Light Baritone set tuned to "B".

I'll do a bit of playing to see how I feel about that. The 3rd string is the same in both sets, and the 1st, 2nd, and 6th strings are about 1/3 of the way between the tension of a down-tuned medium set and down-tuned light set vs. regular-tuned light set.

And now I'll check the flats as well, as many prefer flats on just about anything Danelectro makes (and I'm considering them on the sitar as well as maybe getting their 12-string as a "Byrds" alternative to my "Tom Petty" oriented Gretsch and Hagstrom, only one of which I am likely to keep long-term).
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2959218 - 11/22/18 07:10 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
Larry, I only became aware of the Eric Johnson set a few days before your post -- funny timing. I had already made a mental check to look into them a bit more, so your endorsement is helpful -- especially as my biggest complaint about GHS the past few years has been the balance between the strings tension-wise, which I feel D'addario had been addressing better.

Ain't competition great? And recent GHS and Ernie Ball strings that have shipped with new instruments, no longer have that sticky feeling that made me hate both brands. I only experience that now, when experimenting with new string formulations from La Bella (not their traditional strings).
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2959219 - 11/22/18 07:26 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
A chrome set would have to be done as a custom set, as the 7-string ECG24-7 set, when dropping the top string and using the rest, is way too light in tension compared even to the normal light round-wound baritone set.
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2959220 - 11/22/18 07:35 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
As for the Danelectro Baby Sitar, the ECG23 10's would be slightly heavier tension than the current EXL110 rounds, and a bit less than the rounds (not a good thing in this case) if down-tuned to compensate.

They would be a bit less than the tension of round wound 11 sets though, and as a set of flat 11's would be heavier tension than the round wound 11's, it's probably better to just go ahead and experiment with flat 10's since I know I want just a bit more tension and also a bit more mid-range body.
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2959222 - 11/22/18 08:11 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
I have confirmed that the Medium Baritone set has the right balance for the Danelectro, as the 4th and 5th strings are way looser than the others, and those are the two that budge a bit more in tension by going with the medium set and down-tuning.

My theory at this point is that I can always tune the instrument to Bb instead of B or A, if it ends up being just a bit too taught with the heavier strings.
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2959223 - 11/22/18 08:16 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
The Baby Sitar DEFINITELY needs a wound third string -- all the other strings sound fine, except likely to benefit from slightly more tension.

I do think it's worth trying the flats first, as I'll never know otherwise, and as I have grown to prefer flats on mandolin.

If for any reason they don't work out, I'd probably then try the jazz version of the round 11's, as that set has a wound third string.
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2959229 - 11/22/18 10:12 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
I just ordered the ECG23 10's for the Baby Sitar, and will take the baritone for setup work within the next week using the 14's that I bought earlier.

I also just ordered Danelectro's semi-hollow 12-string, and will likely try the Pyramid flats on them after first checking it out as-is (with Elixir's, unfortunately). It was worth it at the current double-discount, and I might even consider down-tuning this one to "D".

I like the idea of having a single-coil 12-string -- when I owned the Schecter Starcaster-12, I usually used it in coil-tap mode.
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2959251 - 11/23/18 06:19 AM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Winston Psmith Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 02/15/10
Posts: 3581
Loc: Inside the Beltway
@Mark - I use the ECG23's on my Epi DOT, and like them very much. I also use them sometimes on my Godin Synth Access Guitar; just feels a little faster. Nonetheless, it strikes me that you might want a round-wound string for a slightly "twangier" (is that even a word?) sound on that Baby Sitar.

As far as Ernie Ball strings, I was never a fan, either, until I started hunting down 8-string sets. It's not so much preference as convenience, as they make a set that works nicely on the Omen-8, and will probably let me down-tune on an 8-string with an even longer scale.
_________________________
"Monsters are real, and Ghosts are real too. They live inside us, and sometimes, they win." Stephen King

http://www.novparolo.com

Top
#2959384 - 11/23/18 06:27 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Winston Psmith]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
Winston, thanks for the feedback. I dropped off the baritone for a setup with the 14's today, and Mark at GC in Concord is quite confident they will work well on that scale length and voicing of "A" vs. "B" tuning.

He also previously owned the Jerry Jones version of the Baby Sitar, which is what I think this recent re-release by Danelectro is based on. He felt it didn't have enough resonance overall. And it has too much twang currently; not well-controlled. So I'm hoping flat wounds will improve matters. You don't know if you don't try, and these new Danelectro instruments are good value and thus also a proper investment for experimentation.

I noticed that Ernie Ball 8-string set for the Omen-8. Schecter used to ship with D'addario's, but they switched to Ernie Balls a few years ago. Probably part of that deal was Ernie Ball agreeing to make that special Omen-8 set.
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
#2959391 - 11/23/18 06:52 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Mark Schmieder]
Larryz Offline
10k Club

Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 11577
Loc: Northern California
Originally Posted By: Mark Schmieder
Larry, I only became aware of the Eric Johnson set a few days before your post -- funny timing. I had already made a mental check to look into them a bit more, so your endorsement is helpful -- especially as my biggest complaint about GHS the past few years has been the balance between the strings tension-wise, which I feel D'addario had been addressing better.

Ain't competition great? And recent GHS and Ernie Ball strings that have shipped with new instruments, no longer have that sticky feeling that made me hate both brands. I only experience that now, when experimenting with new string formulations from La Bella (not their traditional strings).


I was never a fan of Earnie Balls as they just seem to not last very long and break a little more than other brands. I stopped using them long ago...

The GHS pure nickel set is somewhere between round and flat wounds. Gives me some nice lively bass while cutting down on the squeak a little. They bend easy too! So far they are lasting quite well and I'm really liking the 10-50 gauge. Let me know how you like them if you decide to try them on one of your guitars one of these days! thu
_________________________
Take care, Larryz

Top
#2959401 - 11/23/18 07:19 PM Re: Advice for string gauge on 2 baritones tuned to "A" and "B" [Re: Larryz]
Mark Schmieder Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 9107
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
Ah yes, the pure nickels from GHS -- those are the ones I have on some world instruments that hardly anybody makes strings for. I have been truly amazed by them, and to the extent that I doubt I'll even ever try D'addarios or others, in the cases where GHS isn't the only game in town (there actually are several instruments that NOBODY makes strings for other than GHS, except by special order of course).
_________________________
Eugenio Upright, 60th P-Bass, Select J-Bass, Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, Viking Bari
Select Strat, Select Tele, Am Pro JM, LP 57 Gold Top, RS520T, T486-RB, ES295, PM2, EXL1
WX5, XK1c, Voyager

Top
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >


Moderator:  A String, Bluesape, myles_rose