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#2975231 - 02/11/19 09:07 PM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: Larryz]
d Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 03/20/01
Posts: 7405
Loc: no longer lexington, Kenfunky,...
LarZ, I think you got the entirely wrong idea.
None of what I posted has been intended to target you, nor were the quotes I cited abt you or even anyone specific.
Those were comments offered to me abt the forum in general.
However, if you wanna put yerself in the field of those beyond changing yer views, OK.
The world moves on.
------------------
BTW & FWIW,
Mr Chas E A Berry
(aka Chuck)
was
is
& will always be
The King of Rock & Roll

(w/ the possible challenge of Little Richard Penniman)
[Now let's see how long he's quiet grin ]
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#2975255 - 02/12/19 03:56 AM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: d]
whitefang Offline
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Registered: 05/13/02
Posts: 11406
Loc: Lincoln Park, MI, UNITED STATE...
Originally Posted By: d
BTW & FWIW,
Mr Chas E A Berry
(aka Chuck)
was
is
& will always be
The King of Rock & Roll

(w/ the possible challenge of Little Richard Penniman)
[Now let's see how long he's quiet grin ]


HA! See, d? There are some things we actually see eye-to-eye on! shocked cool

(Slight aside....)

In the movie "Hail, Hail, Rock'n'Roll" there's some quick shots of other "legends" talking about Chuck Berry( the film covers prep for Chuck's 60th birthday concert) in which JERRY LEE LEWIS says,...."Chuck Berry is the KING of Rock'n'Roll. My MAMA said that...'Chuck Berry is the king of rock'n'roll' ...I said, But Mama, what about ME? And she told me, 'well son.....you OK, but....Chuck Berry? Well he's the KING!" roll

Great film. I'd say, a fine addition to LARRY's collection of live concert DVDs (lookin' for a copy m'self... wink )
Whitefang
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#2975292 - 02/12/19 07:10 AM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: whitefang]
Larryz Offline
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Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 11771
Loc: Northern California
OK d, you know how to push my buttons...now that Fang agrees with you, I know I'm right! Elvis is the King! Chuck Berry is just another King...as long as I'm not getting blamed for our youth leaving the forum I'll continue our discussions. Here is a youthful story I watched on a newscast yesterday about a 14 year old keeping guitar playing alive. He practices 5 hours a day and has about 20 guitars. He deserves a champion like you to tell his story, if you missed it, click on the video:

www.nbc29.com/story/39946245/colorado-14yearold-rocks-global-guitar-competition-takes-top-honors



cool
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#2975331 - 02/12/19 09:56 AM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: Larryz]
surfergirl Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/12/17
Posts: 143
Loc: Waialua, Hi
Check out this site.
https://www.famousbirthdays.com/profession/guitarists.html

You can find by age.
You can type in date and then find by profession.
Above link will not open, use this link www.famousbirthdays.com and type in guitarist where it asks for date.


Edited by surfergirl (02/12/19 10:28 AM)

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#2975334 - 02/12/19 10:05 AM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: surfergirl]
DocPate Offline
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Registered: 01/11/16
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#2975382 - 02/12/19 01:40 PM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: surfergirl]
timtheshredder Offline
Member

Registered: 02/07/19
Posts: 9
Yes, I think that was my point. I didn't mean to insinuate that there are no more good guitarists. There are tons of them. There are just no more "guitar gods" that make young people want to pick up the guitar and play. Some of that has to do with change demographic and some of it has to do with changing interests and tastes in music. Like you said, rock is not as big as it once was. That might have a lot to do with it.

Or is it a chicken or the egg? Maybe rock is dying because we don't have another Eddie to make young people interested in it again. I don't think I can really come up with a single "guitar god" post Kurt Cobain.

I can think of popular bands with good guitarists like Avenged Sevenfold, but that's not really the same. You know?


Edited by timtheshredder (02/12/19 01:40 PM)
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#2975385 - 02/12/19 01:44 PM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: Larryz]
timtheshredder Offline
Member

Registered: 02/07/19
Posts: 9
Totally agree! +1

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#2975387 - 02/12/19 01:47 PM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: d]
timtheshredder Offline
Member

Registered: 02/07/19
Posts: 9
I don't think it's an argument of people being good guitarists. It's the idea that there aren't any "guitar gods" of this generation. That includes skill, popularity, and recognition. Who would you place as a "guitar god" post 2005?

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#2975394 - 02/12/19 02:07 PM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: timtheshredder]
Larryz Offline
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Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 11771
Loc: Northern California
@ Doc, Thanks! Totally agree...There a are some other greats like Chuck Berry like d mentioned, But it's still gonna be hard to beat Elvis the Kings' Records! [pun intended]! cool

@ Surfer Girl Thanks, great site! Just for fun I typed in 2017 Grammy winners which shows their ages. 37 32 30 25 69 32 28 85 63 85 87 78 49 52 50 32 50 61 50 24 47 40 50 77 27 67 & 89. 85% are age 30 or above. Comes out the same as what I see on our birthday thread...at least it's a site where I can see the ages of the entertainers. These are not guitar players so it's a little OT. I want to see more young artists getting Grammy's too! cool

And Again @ Scott, Congrats on your Grammy! Great job! cool


Edited by Larryz (02/12/19 02:08 PM)
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#2975404 - 02/12/19 02:39 PM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: Larryz]
surfergirl Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/12/17
Posts: 143
Loc: Waialua, Hi
This years Grammys had something for everyone, unless you watched, that was torture. Greta Van Fleet, ages 20-22, best rock album, Buddy Guy, 82, best traditional blues album, and Kacey Musgraves, 30, album of the year+3 more.

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#2975407 - 02/12/19 02:53 PM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: surfergirl]
Larryz Offline
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Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 11771
Loc: Northern California
@ Surfer Girl, +1 I went back and looked and the numbers and they came out better for younger artists in 2019. They went from 15% to 25% under age 30. I can't take watching the awards shows anymore but I still admire those who take home a Grammy! cool


Edited by Larryz (02/12/19 02:53 PM)
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#2975411 - 02/12/19 03:19 PM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: timtheshredder]
p90jr Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 3258
Originally Posted By: timtheshredder
I don't think it's an argument of people being good guitarists. It's the idea that there aren't any "guitar gods" of this generation. That includes skill, popularity, and recognition. Who would you place as a "guitar god" post 2005?


Nels Cline became widely known after 2005, at the age of almost 50, when he joined Wilco. He is a guitar god and he plays for huge crowds in that band.

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#2975412 - 02/12/19 03:23 PM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: p90jr]
p90jr Offline
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Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 3258
You know who has been driving guitar sales for the past few years? Taylor Swift... and she's driving sales among teenage girls... and that's awesome.

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#2975413 - 02/12/19 03:27 PM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: p90jr]
p90jr Offline
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Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 3258
This is all reminding me of something Elliot Easton said, about how the trumpet player was once the soloist and famous... then the sax players had their era of being the soloist.. then guitar became the featured solo instrument and hung in there forever if you look at it in historical terms. Now the dj/recording engineer or guest rapper gets the mid-song breakdown spot to push the song to the next level. It's just how it goes...

So if there had been a Trumpet Player message board back in the 1950s we'd be asking "where have the Trumpet Heroes gone?"

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#2975452 - 02/12/19 10:07 PM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: timtheshredder]
d Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 03/20/01
Posts: 7405
Loc: no longer lexington, Kenfunky,...
Originally Posted By: timtheshredder
I didn't mean to insinuate that there are no more good guitarists. There are just no more "guitar gods" that make young people want to pick up the guitar and play.

Uh....NAH !
Yer looking at this from whatever demographic you is but not from the angle of a young person who is motivated to play gtr by some gtr player they heard.
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#2975453 - 02/12/19 10:11 PM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: surfergirl]
d Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 03/20/01
Posts: 7405
Loc: no longer lexington, Kenfunky,...
Originally Posted By: surfergirl
This years Grammys had something for everyone, unless you watched...

freak facepalm grin
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#2975461 - 02/13/19 04:15 AM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: d]
Eric Iverson Offline
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Registered: 08/03/05
Posts: 5294
Loc: Jackson Heights, NY
Re: "guitar gods", yes, I think it's true: the general public doesn't revere good guitar players like they used to.

That doesn't mean that GGPs can't make a living playing music, and that they aren't appreciated by their PEERS, such as those of us on the forum.

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#2975462 - 02/13/19 04:17 AM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: Larryz]
whitefang Offline
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Registered: 05/13/02
Posts: 11406
Loc: Lincoln Park, MI, UNITED STATE...
Originally Posted By: Larryz
OK d, you know how to push my buttons...now that Fang agrees with you, I know I'm right! Elvis is the King! Chuck Berry is just another King...as long as I'm not getting blamed for our youth leaving the forum I'll continue our discussions. Here is a youthful story I watched on a newscast yesterday about a 14 year old keeping guitar playing alive. He practices 5 hours a day and has about 20 guitars. He deserves a champion like you to tell his story, if you missed it, click on the video:

www.nbc29.com/story/39946245/colorado-14yearold-rocks-global-guitar-competition-takes-top-honors



cool


Well, one kid in an obscure video that has a glut of guitars and an interest in "shredding"" history does not a "trend" make.

But, it's a good beginning! wink

Plus, I think the main reason MANY people( not just me, d and Jerry Lee's mom) think Chuck Berry is the "true" king of Rock'n'Roll was his dedication to the genre. NO cheezy movies, NO Vegas lounge act, just ALL Rock'n'Roll,ALL his career( OK with a teeny bit o' blues thrown in wink ).

That plus the FACT that most(if not all) of our guitar "heroes" from the '60's claim CHUCK as the main influence and catalyst for them picking up a guitar in the FIRST PLACE is the reason. smile

The last time I saw Chuck live was back in '87 when he appeared at the annual pre-race festivities of the Detroit Grand Prix races at the city's riverfront HART PLAZA. (I got some great photos! ). He had people from their mid to late '60's, early to mid '70's, AND kids like my daughter( 12 at the time) down to little FIVE YEAR OLDS jumpin' jivin' and dancing to the old Chuck "standards"! laugh

Of course, y'all know I have NOTHING AGAINST Elvis, whom I'll always feel HAS done more to PROMOTE Rock'n'Roll as a VALID commercial music genre than any contemporary. AND mostly due to him being the WHITE guy! wink

BTW: A "famous birthdays" site I sometimes use doesn't limit itself to just guitar players(although I'll have to give SUFERGIRL'S site a try) and also lists kids that are considered INSTAGRAM "stars" and such, which I'll never understand. I mean, what's DONE on Instagram that can make someone a "star"? shocked
Whitefang
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I started out with NOTHING...and I still have most of it left!

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#2975475 - 02/13/19 07:20 AM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: whitefang]
Larryz Offline
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Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 11771
Loc: Northern California
I think a young kid flying from Colorado to London and winning 1st place in a guitar competition making our national news is more than just an obscure video of a kid with a glut of guitars (which I knew you would key on Fang LOL!). I never said anything about a "trend" or "shredding."

I have no idea as to the criteria for making oneself a star on Instagram, as I have never visited the site.

I love Chuck Berry, but I'm afraid that the "true" title belongs to Elvis...google it. cool



Edited by Larryz (02/13/19 07:21 AM)
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#2975480 - 02/13/19 07:41 AM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: Eric Iverson]
d Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 03/20/01
Posts: 7405
Loc: no longer lexington, Kenfunky,...
Originally Posted By: Eric Iverson
Re: "guitar gods", yes, I think it's true: the general public doesn't revere good guitar players like they used to.

That doesn't mean that GGPs can't make a living playing music, and that they aren't appreciated by their PEERS, such as those of us on the forum.


I think it's a mistaken perception that the general public ever did.
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#2975484 - 02/13/19 07:52 AM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: d]
DocPate Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 01/11/16
Posts: 900
Loc: Virginia
Originally Posted By: d
Originally Posted By: Eric Iverson
Re: "guitar gods", yes, I think it's true: the general public doesn't revere good guitar players like they used to.

That doesn't mean that GGPs can't make a living playing music, and that they aren't appreciated by their PEERS, such as those of us on the forum.


I think it's a mistaken perception that the general public ever did.


I tend to agree with you D. When I think back to those early days in Rock and roll, (beginning with Elvis) Scotty Moore was that guy behind Elvis that hardly anyone knew his name. Then who knew the name of Keith Richards? Or a lot of others who were the driving force behind the music but no one really knew their name.

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#2975485 - 02/13/19 07:53 AM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: Larryz]
d Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 03/20/01
Posts: 7405
Loc: no longer lexington, Kenfunky,...
Originally Posted By: Larryz
I have no idea as to the criteria for making oneself a star on Instagram.

Posting a lotta stuff that enough ppl like to see & then getting others to chk it out b/c it's reached popular critical mass.


Originally Posted By: Larryz
I love Chuck Berry, but I'm afraid that the "true" title belongs to Elvis...google it. cool


I know yer a fanatic on this EAP vs CEB point, LarZ. so let's not keep on this much more but what would you say abt folks that think Chubby Checker, not Hank Ballard should get credit for "The Twist" ?
Or, in a slightly diff blurred concept, my hero John Lennon rather than The Isleys or Smokey Robinson owns "Twist & Shout" & "You Really Got A Hold On Me" ?
Elvis was really good but he never was a creator.
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#2975492 - 02/13/19 08:53 AM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: p90jr]
Scott Fraser Offline
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Registered: 03/20/05
Posts: 5272
Loc: Los Angeles
Originally Posted By: p90jr
Nels Cline became widely known after 2005, at the age of almost 50, when he joined Wilco. He is a guitar god and he plays for huge crowds in that band.


I've known Nels since the late 70's when we were both slogging around the art galleries of LA & he's always been a guitar god to me. But he had to join a rock band to break out of the avant-garde ghetto & attract wider notice. His own music is much more challenging than the arty rock he's now known for, but thankfully perseverance has paid off for him & he gets to play all sorts of high profile gigs he couldn't get arrested at a dozen years ago. One of the top honors of my life was having Kronos commission Nels to write a piece for my 60th birthday, for Kronos & Nels to play together.
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#2975564 - 02/13/19 03:48 PM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: d]
Larryz Offline
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Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 11771
Loc: Northern California
Originally Posted By: d
Originally Posted By: Larryz
I have no idea as to the criteria for making oneself a star on Instagram.

Posting a lotta stuff that enough ppl like to see & then getting others to chk it out b/c it's reached popular critical mass.


Originally Posted By: Larryz
I love Chuck Berry, but I'm afraid that the "true" title belongs to Elvis...google it. cool


I know yer a fanatic on this EAP vs CEB point, LarZ. so let's not keep on this much more but what would you say abt folks that think Chubby Checker, not Hank Ballard should get credit for "The Twist" ?
Or, in a slightly diff blurred concept, my hero John Lennon rather than The Isleys or Smokey Robinson owns "Twist & Shout" & "You Really Got A Hold On Me" ?
Elvis was really good but he never was a creator.


I'm not fanatic about EAP vs CEB...and I think the answer as to who gets the King title goes to EAP. I really don't care about who did the original vs who had a hit with the same tune. For me, the Twist is better by Chubby Checker, Memphis is better by Johnny Rivers, Roll Over Beethoven is better by George Harrison and the Beatles, Hound Dog is better by Elvis (as were many of his early versions of the old R&B tunes by black artists)...I can see where you would choose John for Twist and Shout and his versions of Smokey Robinson's tune...it's what we like and who gets the credit really isn't what matters.

I was playing a New Years party with my old buds and I did a tune that I said was by Marty Robbins called Singing the Blues. My buddy says it was not Marty Robbins it was by Guy Mitchell....I didn't argue with him even though I knew Marty Robbins did do the tune. I went home and looked it up and I was right. Marty Robbins did the original and Guy did a cover...I don't care for the Guy Mitchell version as I don't like him whistling the lead part...I knew there was a reason I like Marty's original the best, but I had to go back and listen to both.


For me, Elvis and Ray Charles are very creative super stars and I love their versions/arrangements of many tunes better than the originals...they are both Kings in my book and so is Chuck! Nobody has ever exceeded Johnny B. Goode IMHO. I love the guitar kid's story and the music that goes with it... cool


Edited by Larryz (02/13/19 03:52 PM)
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#2975588 - 02/13/19 04:51 PM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: Larryz]
d Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 03/20/01
Posts: 7405
Loc: no longer lexington, Kenfunky,...
Get real, LarZ.
U R an EAP fab deep down & forever-ish / feverish ^ that's OK.
I'm a fan-atic, too.
That's OK but it does apparently keep you from changing yer opinion.

However we needa get outta the fan-attic eventually....
Any honest evaluation of an artist might look at such things as whether they were good ?
[EAP = Oh def !!!!!!]
did they advance an art ?
[EAP = yep, in popularity]
what did they create & how far did that move the art ?
[EAP = uh...............ZERO].

All that other comparison stuff between diff versions of songs/recs, while it takes the wrong channel from what I posted earlier, is just sideareally off...
which is/was kinda my point.
LenMac started as imitators but quickly became more.
There are all kindsa ways to compare art but a creator always outranks an imitator.
EAP simply imitated & extrapolated but he never created anything.
You may never agree to that basic tenet but...


IF YA CAN'T SAY SUMPIN', uh, GNU MOVE ON....
cause, Cuz,
tha past is not our fave do-loop but it's worth takin' a gander at what then closest to the real think.
.

EAP was a great interpretive performer
& vital in changing the culture we live in
but he was not on the level of the ppl who inspired him
nor some of those whom came in his wake.

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#2975666 - 02/14/19 03:29 AM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: d]
whitefang Offline
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Registered: 05/13/02
Posts: 11406
Loc: Lincoln Park, MI, UNITED STATE...
What's better, the original, or the "cover"?

Heh.... depends on not only the TUNE, but WHO did the "original" and who did the "cover".

AND---

Whom formed the opinion. wink Like, for me----

ANY cover of "You Really Got A Hold On Me" will (to ME) ALWAYS fall short of Smokey and The Miracles. wink But then too, that doesn't really mean I don't LIKE the "cover", just not as much. wink
Whitefang
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I started out with NOTHING...and I still have most of it left!

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#2975694 - 02/14/19 07:02 AM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: whitefang]
Larryz Offline
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Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 11771
Loc: Northern California
@ d, "I know yer a fanatic on this EAP vs CEB point, LarZ. so let's not keep on this much more"...we will never agree on EAP=zero on creativity for the reasons I have already covered. cool

@ Fang, I usually love the cover and the original if the cover is not just a copy and includes some creativity LOL! Sometimes I like one or the other more. Like Brian Setzer's cover of Sleep Walk... cool


Edited by Larryz (02/14/19 07:03 AM)
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#2975752 - 02/14/19 11:31 AM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: timtheshredder]
surfergirl Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/12/17
Posts: 143
Loc: Waialua, Hi
Originally Posted By: timtheshredder
I don't think it's an argument of people being good guitarists. It's the idea that there aren't any "guitar gods" of this generation. That includes skill, popularity, and recognition. Who would you place as a "guitar god" post 2005?


I do not really give much thought to "guitar gods", but if I had one it would be my Grandpa.
My Mom is my "surf goddess".
They taught me and I am what I am because of the.


Edited by surfergirl (02/14/19 11:36 AM)

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#2975768 - 02/14/19 12:50 PM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: surfergirl]
DocPate Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 01/11/16
Posts: 900
Loc: Virginia
Originally Posted By: surfergirl
Originally Posted By: timtheshredder
I don't think it's an argument of people being good guitarists. It's the idea that there aren't any "guitar gods" of this generation. That includes skill, popularity, and recognition. Who would you place as a "guitar god" post 2005?


I do not really give much thought to "guitar gods", but if I had one it would be my Grandpa.
My Mom is my "surf goddess".
They taught me and I am what I am because of the.


Try this young guy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ueit7shd-_Y

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#2975844 - 02/15/19 04:19 AM Re: Is The Guitar World Dead hi [Re: d]
whitefang Offline
10k Club

Registered: 05/13/02
Posts: 11406
Loc: Lincoln Park, MI, UNITED STATE...
Originally Posted By: d
Originally Posted By: Larryz
I have no idea as to the criteria for making oneself a star on Instagram.

Posting a lotta stuff that enough ppl like to see & then getting others to chk it out b/c it's reached popular critical mass.


Sorry, but in checking out a few of those Instagram "stars", their "stardom" has NOTHING TO DO with much of anything. Mostly skateboarding tricks, or walking around talking and other general time-wasting shit.

I suppose what MAKES one a "star" on such medium is simply having and/or knowing nothing better to do than posting a LOT of whatever, and nothing to do with substance.
Whitefang
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