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#2931147 - 06/04/18 04:59 PM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: MojoGuyPan]
Adan Online   content
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Originally Posted By: MojoGuyPan
Split the difference and play your brand of jazz on the Prophet X. A happy Adan is a happy life.

There is a certain type of person that buys a Nord. I don't want to get into it here but you know the type. Nord knows how many marks are out their and simply caters to their fetishes in order to take them. They're using Fatar just like everybody else yet their prices are stratospheric. You don't even need to read between the lines here. It is standing right in front of you staring you in the face. Think about it, the very much more capable and much more nicely appointed Kronos 73 is priced at $3400.

That's all I'll say. That's all that needs to be said.


It should also be said that you are possibly the kookiest commentator on this board . . . but I think everyone already knows that.

And yet sometimes you absolutely nail it. Good days and bad days?

Let's get that $2300 monotrimbral Crumar Seven into your living room so you can start really enjoying that Fatar action.

edit: I guess Scott beat me to the irony punch.


Edited by Adan (06/04/18 05:01 PM)
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#2931151 - 06/04/18 05:10 PM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: Adan]
Adan Online   content
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So this thread inspired me to go to GC on my lunch hour. It's next to my bank which I had to go to anyway. It's also just a few blocks from a marijuana dispensary, but that's neither here nor there.

They had a Stage 3 88 and Compact on display. I dunno, after playing my Mojo 61, the B3 and EP emulations on the Nord just don't impress me very much. I still like the APs and think overall it's a very useful tool, but if I want to maximize inspiration on organ or EPs, I'll play the Mojo.
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#2931154 - 06/04/18 05:26 PM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: Adan]
bennyray Offline
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Registered: 12/06/14
Posts: 853
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Adan
So this thread inspired me to go to GC on my lunch hour. It's next to my bank which I had to go to anyway. It's also just a few blocks from a marijuana dispensary, but that's neither here nor there.

They had a Stage 3 88 and Compact on display. I dunno, after playing my Mojo 61, the B3 and EP emulations on the Nord just don't impress me very much. I still like the APs and think overall it's a very useful tool, but if I want to maximize inspiration on organ or EPs, I'll play the Mojo.


Reminds me of Styx song Light Up Adan the Nord deal I went with the RD2000 and a Mojo 61 that is what is best suited for my needs instead of a Nord Stage 3 and couldn't be more satisfied. Money wasn't the deciding factor just a better setup for me.
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#2931157 - 06/04/18 05:55 PM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: cphollis]
kenheeter Offline
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Registered: 03/02/11
Posts: 189
I believe that some folks see the value in the Nord stuff and some don't. Those that don't buy something else. Any one of these instruments isn't as expensive as a high end guitar or any other quality instrument and everyone gets to choose their tools. One of the big features of Nord has been the way that they continously offer new sounds and upgrades, which was virtually unheard of when the Electro first came out. I'm happy to see others following suit these days, which makes it better for everyone. We're all winners here......

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#2931160 - 06/04/18 06:21 PM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: kenheeter]
AnotherScott Offline
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Good point about the upgrades. It wasn't a big factor for me personally, but if you bought a Nord Stage 10 years ago, you can still install the newer Nord piano sounds today. It helps the boards stay "current" longer. Any other piano board you bought 10 years ago, if you want their new sounds, you have to buy a new keyboard. That can change the price calculus.
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#2931162 - 06/04/18 06:26 PM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: kenheeter]
eric Offline
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Registered: 01/25/02
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I have been a Nord user for a very long time, well before the Stage was even a thing. In fact, here's a post I wrote 16 years ago where I wished for something very much like the Stage came to be over the years.

My initial Nord usage was in a multi keyboard rig - triple decker including Roland RD-600 with Hammond or Korg clonewheel and a Nord Lead. Over a few more years, that slimmed down to a longtime double decker including Yamaha S-90 and Electro 2/3. I tried the first Stage and the Stage EX, but they were not good enough to replace my double decker (I used a Stage Compact as my second tier board for a brief period). One of the main Achilles heels of that era was lack of good Nord piano sounds and also still evolving synth capabilities.

Fast forward a few more years to the Nord Stage 2, which included the sample loading feature and Nord's piano library was coming around at this time. I went all in on the NS2 as I moved back to a single keyboard rig that has persisted now since ~2011. I've gotten a ton of mileage out of the NS2 and it is competing with the Yamaha S-90 for years of service in my live rig (I used the S-90 live from ~2003-2011 and it still has a proud spot above my Hammond A-101 in my music room).

The NS2 works great for me on many levels and I've invested a lot of time in creating Programs for several bands, so I can quickly load sounds as needed. I have resisted upgrading to NS3.

I am aware of the perception that Nord is catering to some combo of trendy/hipster/wealthy types, but don't really care if anyone wants to characterize me as any of those. My Nords have paid for themselves many times over and they work extremely well for my uses.

The earlier posts have covered most of the reasons why I think the Nord Stage works - great sound, intuitive UI with limited menu diving, frequently evolving library of sounds, several keyboard actions, etc.

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#2931163 - 06/04/18 06:33 PM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: AnotherScott]
GregC Offline
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Registered: 10/26/03
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Originally Posted By: AnotherScott
T

I really like the Kronos, but I consider it the best "call up a preset and play it" board... which of course, is exactly all that many players need. Live, I never touch anything but the keys and the Set List slots. Easy, sounds great. But no tweaking. Even off-line at home, I don't care to tweak much. The interface is cumbersome, the screen is finicky, and I don't set up sliders or knobs to do things because I'll never remember what they do anyway. I don't even set up the pedal to do tricks, because even that is so cumbersome compared to a Nord morph. And as an aside, there should be a law against black buttons on a black background. For anything past patch selection and just playing the keys, Nord's ergonomics are way above Kronos. If I need to create a sound from scratch, it's Nord over Kronos every time. I can do in a few minutes what could take me a whole lot more time on the Kronos, and it's more fun to do, because I feel like I'm working on an instrument, not a computer.


You are correct, Kronos navigation and getting at all the tabs is arcane. I go back to the Triton days and have my Korg ' muscle memory' dialed in.

I can imagine, if you have to do some spontaneous menu diving while on a gig, with Kronos, that might not be fun and/or accurate.

I think Korg/Kronos forced folks to plan more or maybe we can call it automate your work flow on the fly.

And maybe Korg with Kronos wanted to be all things to all people with the w/s. I think it succeeded.

I know comparisons are natural to a thread. But I still contend a musician/keyboardists should define their requirements. The keyboard comparison thing is somewhat secondary if you are clear on your requirements.

Since you brought up Kronos, I am thrilled to use it almost every day but my context is a song writer, not a gigging keyboard player. And digging into the Kronos is immensely rewarding.

Seems to me spending $3000 for something that is mostly used as a preset keyboard is not the best use of a $3000 Kronos.


Edited by GregC (06/04/18 06:43 PM)
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#2931168 - 06/04/18 07:01 PM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: GregC]
RABid Offline
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I opted for a compact when I got a Stage 2 because I would rather play piano on a synth action keyboard rather than play organ on a hammer action keyboard. And THAT highlights the biggest issue I have with the Nord concept. Piano and organ does not belong on the same keyboard.
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#2931173 - 06/04/18 07:28 PM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: RABid]
AnotherScott Offline
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Registered: 10/19/09
Posts: 12322
Originally Posted By: GregC
Seems to me spending $3000 for something that is mostly used as a preset keyboard is not the best use of a $3000 Kronos.
True, but there's probably no better board for a preset jockey than a Kronos. I was actually hoping the Grandstage would let you load in whatever Kronos sounds you wanted, that it would be the Kronos for those who didn't care about programming their own stuff, in a smaller, lighter, simpler, cheaper, more hands-on package.

Originally Posted By: RABid
And THAT highlights the biggest issue I have with the Nord concept. Piano and organ does not belong on the same keyboard.

Nord will gladly sell you two boards. ;-)

Really, they do make dedicated boards... C2D organ, Nord Piano 3, various synths. But as long as people want to buy all-in-one models, they'll make those too, and you can pick which action you want on them. So they really do kinda cover all the bases.
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#2931188 - 06/04/18 08:25 PM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: Adan]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: Adan
They had a Stage 3 88 and Compact on display. I dunno, after playing my Mojo 61, the B3 and EP emulations on the Nord just don't impress me very much. I still like the APs and think overall it's a very useful tool, but if I want to maximize inspiration on organ or EPs, I'll play the Mojo.

I get that. If all you need is EP and organ, the Mojo is probably a better board at half the price. It's when you want to add a high quality piano and a knobby VA synth wth custom sample loading and aftertouch that the 22 lb Nord starts looking really attractive, compared to, say, adding a Studiologic Sledge and some piano+ board to the Mojo61. (PX560? SP6? MX88/MOXF8?) But travel weight, set-up time, stage footprint, and even price can favor the Nord. This year, the 22 lb NS3 is the heaviest board I've traveled with. But I've thought about wiring up a Gemini module to it, to get those organs and EPs, too... but it's certainly not like the Nord sound aren't good enough to gig with!
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#2931190 - 06/04/18 08:44 PM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: AnotherScott]
ElmerJFudd Offline
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22lbs NS3 Compact is attractive (wish theyíd consider ordering their TP-8Oís with a different gauge or better feeling spring) - but spending $3599 and immediately feeling the desire to get better organs and EPs off an $1149 Gemini to total $4748 is crazy talk (ymmv). Although with extern section I can see the desire to integrate with a MacBook to make up for areas where the Nord is weak (like Orch and Big Band libraries).

The market will dictate what players are willing to pay for a flagship Nord, no matter how staggering it seems to some of us.
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#2931205 - 06/05/18 04:13 AM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: ElmerJFudd]
Markay Offline
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Taking a global perspective Nord can be much more price competitive than the other main contenders.

In Australia the Nord range is available at roughly the US price x exchange rate. Yamaha, Korg, Roland, Casio and the rest are typically priced at double or more the US street price.

So for example earlier in this thread someone compared a Kronos and a Nord Stage.

Here a Kronos 2 88 has an RRP of $AU 7,000, street around $AU 5,500, and a Nord Stage 3 88 is $AU 5,000.

At Sweetwater the Kronos is $US 3,700, the Nord $US 4,500.

So depending on where you are in the world a Nord can be a cheaper option. PS the Nord Stage 3 here is actually $US3,800 at current exchange rates, take 10 % off for our GST if exported, so those in the US should shop for Nords here.

AFIK Nord's policy of fair pricing is also the case in other countries I have visited.

Add in Nord's rep for good sounds, reliability with a similar or lower price and it is no wonder stages out here seem to be red all over.
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#2931209 - 06/05/18 04:32 AM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: RABid]
stoken6 Offline
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Registered: 05/12/12
Posts: 1791
Originally Posted By: RABid
I opted for a compact when I got a Stage 2 because I would rather play piano on a synth action keyboard rather than play organ on a hammer action keyboard. And THAT highlights the biggest issue I have with the Nord concept. Piano and organ does not belong on the same keyboard.


Throw a hammer-action controller under a Stage Compact - it's ideally suited to that approach.

Cheers, Mike.
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#2931211 - 06/05/18 04:34 AM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: MojoGuyPan]
stoken6 Offline
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Registered: 05/12/12
Posts: 1791
Originally Posted By: MojoGuyPan
There is a certain type of person that buys a Nord.
Really? I'm reading this thread, and I'm thinking "there's so many types of people that buy a Nord".

Cheers, Mike.
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#2931217 - 06/05/18 05:19 AM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: stoken6]
Outkaster Offline
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#2931223 - 06/05/18 06:02 AM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: AnotherScott]
GregC Offline
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Registered: 10/26/03
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Originally Posted By: AnotherScott
Originally Posted By: GregC
Seems to me spending $3000 for something that is mostly used as a preset keyboard is not the best use of a $3000 Kronos.
True, but there's probably no better board for a preset jockey than a Kronos. I


Preset jockey ? Thats funny. I had to google the phrase.

Lo and behold snax

http://www.harmonycentral.com/forum/forum/Keyboards/acapella-18/317618-


Edited by GregC (06/05/18 06:04 AM)
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#2931225 - 06/05/18 06:26 AM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: Outkaster]
Al Quinn Offline
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Registered: 08/13/14
Posts: 1055
Loc: Center Moriches, NY
I owned a Stage 2 HA88 for three years and have had an Electro 4D for five years. The reason I bought Nord was the appeal of having an all-in-one board. I've done many single board gigs with the Nords and, no matter how much I wanted to love them, I wasn't happy. Why?

- The APs sound very good but the HA 88 finger to ear connection is mediocre for piano playing and the E4D action is worse
- The B3 doesn't sound authentic and the E4D action is mediocre for organ playing (i.e., too stiff)
- Strings are just OK
- Horns are just OK

So, I reached the conclusion that I need two boards for gigs requiring more than just piano or B3. This is partly because of my desire for an all-on-one board that has the best sounds (which doesn't seem to exist) and partly because a single action is too much of a compromise for playing both piano and organ.

This weekend I have a blues gig and a classic rock gig. I'll use my CP4 and Electro 4D midi'ed to the HX3 expander module for B3. This rig sounds and plays so much better than my previous Nord rigs. As a result I play better and have more fun. Next week I have a jazz organ gig and I'll use my Mojo which sounds and plays so much better than any Nord I've played.

To be fair, I want to add some things I love about Nord:
- the user interface is great! After a small learning curve I could quickly pull together any setup I desired and could musically tweak my sound during performance
- the user manual is written really well
- I don't play much synth these days but when I needed to the Stage 2 played and sounded great
- the APs record really well in the studio
- customer support with Pablo from the Nord forum was great for me when I needed it

Of course much of what I've shared is subjective and I'm sincerly happy for those who love their Nords.
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#2931237 - 06/05/18 07:23 AM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: Al Quinn]
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#2931247 - 06/05/18 07:52 AM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: Stokely]
Outkaster Offline
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I don't think we are that bad Stokely we don't have dozens of pages in music catalogs dedicated to us. The pool is very small comparatively.
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#2931248 - 06/05/18 08:04 AM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: ElmerJFudd]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
spending $3599 and immediately feeling the desire to get better organs and EPs off an $1149 Gemini to total $4748 is crazy talk (ymmv).

It's not a matter of immediately feeling the desire to get better organs and EPs. The organs and EPs are nice and more than usable... I liked them in my NE5D, which I sold to get the NS3. They are not the very best, but they are plenty good enough, and certainly the best you'll find in a 22 lb 7x key board that also includes aftertouch, a knobby synth, and some of the best acoustic piano sounds available!

I'm not suggesting that Nord owners need to buy Gemini modules. But if one does want the very best at the lowest travel weight, budget aside, adding a Gemini module to an NS3 is arguably a way to do it, if you do indeed prefer the EPs and organs of the Mojo.

The other thing about sound satisfaction is that people can be perfectly happy with their sounds, until they hear something better. Lots of people probably thought they'd never need another piano sound once the Korg M1 came out.

For multi-sound (piano/EP/organ/synth/rompler) players, any single board is a compromise. Any pair of boards is a compromise. Heck, I don't think I could come up with a THREE board rig that wasn't a compromise. The question is one of how far you are willing to go to minimize compromises. Admitting that the Nord isn't perfect at everything it does is not a knock on the Nord. Nothing is perfect. For many people, the Nord is simply the least imperfect.

So let's assume that your favorite pianos are Nord, your favorite organs/EPs are Mojo (which again, does not mean the ones in the Nord aren't "good enough," they're just not your favorites), and you want a knobby synth with aftertouch and custom sample loading. Turning the premise around, instead of starting with the Nord and thinking about ideally adding Mojo calibre organ and EP via the Gemini, let's start with the Mojo 61. What do you add to get what you're now missing by not having gotten the Nord? A Sledge gives you back the knobby synth with aftertouch and sample loading, at reasonable price. Now where do you get your Nord-caliber acoustic pianos driven from a board with more than 61 keys? Well, you still need a Nord of some sort (since our goal is to get this set of common favorite sounds, i.e. Nord-calibre piano and Mojo-calibre organ and EP). But it doesn't have to be a Stage, it can be a cheaper Nord. Still, the cheapest 7x key Nord plus a Sledge plus a Mojo61 comes to $4,900. That's more expensive than adding the Gemini module to the NS3, and a bunch more travel weight, setup time, and stage footprint. And, btw, we're still missing a quality rompler. I add that as a second tier with the NS3. In this alternate scenario, that becomes a fourth board!

The more practical way to build this system around a Mojo61 and Sledge would probably be to add a laptop, and some inexpensive 73+ board you can use as a controller. The laptop could give you the best in piano and rompler sounds, while this combo still leaves you with dedicated hardware for the stuff that's hardest to do through software (knobby synth and drawbar ergonomics, and VB3 sound that beats their VST equivalent). You're still at three boards, though, and it's still not cheap, and will require a bunch of effort to make it all work smoothly.

Bottom line, I do find the NS3 good enough for everything I need it for, but if I want to get closer to perfection, it's much easier to add Mojo organ/EP to an NS3 than to add the rest of what an NS3 does to a Mojo61.

(I'm not actually sure how seamlessly one could get that to work, though. Driving the Gemini through the EXT function is a logical and easy way to add an external sound source, but drawbars don't transmit through the EXT function. Driving the module from the Nord's Global channel will give you all the front panel organ control, but complicates integrating internal and external sounds. I have some ideas on how it could be done, but that's a topic for another thread at another time, and it's nothing I'm imminently pursuing anyway)
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#2931252 - 06/05/18 08:41 AM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: AnotherScott]
jeffinpghpa Offline
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Registered: 05/22/07
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What I really liked about Nord Stage and Nord Electro was that I was able to get my sounds into a band mix almost instantly to get my tones and EQ tweaked so easily.

While my patches for pianos and electric pianos are sonically better on the Kurzweil Forte, and the Dave Weiser sounds have some ideal EQ for live band mixes, I still feel like my Kurzweil Forte gigs have had some trial and error in this, and the Nord got me dialed in much faster.

Something to think about, too.
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#2931263 - 06/05/18 09:41 AM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: stoken6]
AnotherScott Offline
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Registered: 10/19/09
Posts: 12322
Originally Posted By: stoken6
Originally Posted By: RABid
THAT highlights the biggest issue I have with the Nord concept. Piano and organ does not belong on the same keyboard.
Throw a hammer-action controller under a Stage Compact - it's ideally suited to that approach.
Originally Posted By: Al Quinn
I've done many single board gigs with the Nords and, not matter how much I wanted to love them, I wasn't happy. ... I reached the conclusion that I need two boards for gigs requiring more than just piano or B3. This is partly because of my desire for an all-on-one board that has the best sounds (which doesn't seem to exist) and partly because a single action is too much of a compromise for playing both piano and organ.

Yes, a lot of this thread has focussed on how the NS3 is, for many people, about the best single-board solution, but picking up from my previous post, every single-board solution is a compromise. I find the NS3 works great as part of a pair. (In fact, if I had to gig with just one board, I'd probably take my Kurzweil Artis7, not my NS3!) As I mentioned, I pair the NS3 with a rompler (and being the keyboard junkie I am, it could be a Kurzweil, Roland DS, Yamaha MOXF, or Kronos... all great boards, all with different compromises, and none of which give me much of what's in the Nord). Still, I'd rather gig with three than two. If I could deal with the weight, my ideal rig would probably be a Korg SV1, Nord Stage 3-73, and Kronos 61.

And then *if* I wanted the Mojo sounds (more tempted by the hype than anything else at this point), I'd probably add the Gemini, because a 4th board is cumbersome, and a Mojo61 can't effectively replace any of the other three. The SV1 has the hammer action and just a great playability vibe (partially the tube?), the Nord has the best piano sounds and the knobby synth, the rompler fills in all the gaps, and the Mojo61 couldn't do any of those things. So either the Mojo61 would have to be a fourth board or I'd have to integrate a laptop/ipad/module to take over rompler duties. But alas, it's moot because I'm not even willing to gig with the weight of the SV1. (Though I am still considering a lighter weight version of this 3-board rig - a Casio 88, the NS3-73, and one of the lighter romplers.)

I have thought about using an iPad for rompler sounds, which would give me more flexibility in what I could pair the NS3 with, but I'm content with my current pairing options at the moment. I'm also reserving judgment on just how happy I can be with the Nord's SW action until I have the time to try the alternate springs I got. Which brings me to...

Originally Posted By: Al Quinn
- The APs sound very good but the HA 88 finger to ear connection is mediocre for piano playing and the E4D action is worse
- The B3 doesn't sound authentic and the E4D action is mediocre for organ playing (i.e., too stiff)
...
Next week I have a jazz organ gig and I'll use my Mojo which sounds and plays so much better than any Nord I've played.

I know you installed alternate springs in your E4D, and you used your Mojo action as reference when selecting the springs, and you seemed pretty happy with the feel at the time. In the end, were you just not able to get it as close as you wanted to the feel of the Mojo? Or was the remaining dissatisfaction more about the sound then the feel?

I do feel the Nord SWs have more pushback than I'd like, but I was pleasantly surprised that the NE5D and NS3 handled piano better than the NS2 and NE3 did (I never played the NE4), and it does cross my threshold for "playable" if one must play from a non-hammer action. I still prefer the Artis7 with its alternate springs and am hoping for a similar improvement on the Nord. But I do find it pretty playable as it is.

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#2931268 - 06/05/18 09:53 AM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: AnotherScott]
Daniel71 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/27/11
Posts: 115
Loc: Rimouski Canada
I love my Nord Stage but I still use one of them with a motif xf7 for my rock band and Iím planning to use my other stage with a mojo 61 for my blues band.

I use my Nords mostly for the piano and electric pianos. Donít like the organ but useable. The synth section had been improved in the NS3.

Regards

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#2931272 - 06/05/18 10:00 AM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: Daniel71]
AnotherScott Offline
10k Club

Registered: 10/19/09
Posts: 12322
One other thing I'll mention regarding complaints that the Nord organ lags the best of the dedicated clones... the NS3 lets you easily route the organ to its own output, where you can attach a Vent.

Yes, that's another not cheap solution. But as I said, pricey as it may be, compare what it costs to get the organ sound you're happy with out of an NS3 to the cost of getting everything else the NS3 gives you out of a Mojo, Legend, whatever.
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Maybe this is the best place for a shameless plug! Our new video at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ZRC3b4p4EI is a 40 minute adaptation of T. S. Eliot's "Prufrock" - check it out!

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#2931278 - 06/05/18 10:23 AM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: Stokely]
GregC Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 10/26/03
Posts: 5440
Loc: Discovery Bay, California
Originally Posted By: Stokely
Look out guitar players, keyboard players can be gear-judgemental douches too! We're coming for your crown! Geez....



I think you are joking mostly. The gear analysis threads are fun.
( correct me if I am misunderstanding).

Imagine, Nord can did this up in a minute and have instant product assessment at a customer level. For free.

I think almost every post is fact based . opinions, preferences for sure but backed up with fact.

Folks here have excellent product knowledge. They are dedicated and serious about their craft.

I also enjoy joking around. Just wanted to give my input as a non-Nord person.


Edited by GregC (06/05/18 10:25 AM)
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#2931289 - 06/05/18 12:06 PM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: kbrkr]
MojoGuyPan Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/30/08
Posts: 418
Loc: Mainland Florida
Originally Posted By: kbrkr
I'm a Stage 3 Compact owner, and I don't think it is worth the money. I also have a Kronos 2 76. The chief attraction to me was the weight and a "Swiss Army Knife" approach. Meaning, I can bring a piano, organ, Synth to a gig/rehearsal without killing myself.

However, there are many drawbacks to the Nord as follows:
* It's not as well made as you might think. The Mod wheel on my kb was not working out of the box and has intermittent functionality.
* Sonically, it comes nowhere close to the Kronos.
* Some base sounds (Wurly's, Clavs, etc.) are weak.



Now we need to hang. The Nord Stage isn't a bad board at all. I've played them when backlined or when subbing and have liked them but buy one? No way they are waaaay overpriced for what you get. Especially when a Kronos 73 blows it out of the water sonically and wrt flexibility and overall capability.

I have no problem with the Fatar keybed and you know if the Nord Stage 3 was priced the same as a Crumar Seven, I'd definitely consider getting one but it is twice the price of a Seven.

Like other have said, With a 61 and Seven you're still $1250 less than the Stage and you have an optimal keybed for organs and a sweet hammer action keybed for piano and EPs. You need a synth? Bring a Sledge and you still have cash in your pocket for night of fun.

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#2931292 - 06/05/18 12:36 PM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: AnotherScott]
Al Quinn Offline
Platinum Member

Registered: 08/13/14
Posts: 1055
Loc: Center Moriches, NY
Originally Posted By: AnotherScott
I know you installed alternate springs in your E4D, and you used your Mojo action as reference when selecting the springs, and you seemed pretty happy with the feel at the time. In the end, were you just not able to get it as close as you wanted to the feel of the Mojo? Or was the remaining dissatisfaction more about the sound then the feel?

After swapping the springs the action on the E4D is great for organ (very close to the Mojo action). My remaining dissatisfaction is with the B3. I now use the E4D exclusively as a 61-key midi controller with drawbars, and knobs and buttons which are labeled nicely. Iíve used it on occasion with a laptop but most often use it with the HX3 module. It was a twisted path that got me here (i.e., I initially had high hopes for the E4D) but since Iím happy with my gear Iím not motivated to make changes now. Since swapping springs isn't for everyone I left that detail out of my previous post and just commented on the stock E4D.
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#2931295 - 06/05/18 12:51 PM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: MojoGuyPan]
AnotherScott Offline
10k Club

Registered: 10/19/09
Posts: 12322
Originally Posted By: MojoGuyPan
With a 61 and Seven you're still $1250 less than the Stage and you have an optimal keybed for organs and a sweet hammer action keybed for piano and EPs. You need a synth? Bring a Sledge and you still have cash in your pocket for night of fun.

That's a nice combo, but your math is off (at least in the U.S.), it's still $4700 ($2309+$1499+899). No cash in your pocket, it's more expensive than any NS3, sometimes by quite a lot ($3600 for the SW 73, $4200 for the 76 TP100, $4500 for the 88 TP40). And you still don't have a really high quality acoustic piano sound in your rig. You could make an argument for superior sounds in your rig (other than piano) and the benefit of multiple actions, but it's a pricier way to go. Plus you've got a much higher travel weight, longer setup time, bigger stage footprint, no master patch selection system, and reduced MIDI functionality. So there are still trade-offs.

Originally Posted By: MojoGuyPan
a Kronos 73 blows it out of the water sonically and wrt flexibility and overall capability.

...but not in immediacy of operation, ease of use and "fun" for anything beyond selecting a patch and playing it. Which may be all someone wants, but as I've said, my Kronos is great, but for most stuff, I'd rather use my NS3. And if you read this thread, you'll see I'm not alone. It's not like all these Nord players have never heard of a Kronos. Of course Kronos is more capable. But I don't need a sequencer or Karma, or a keyboard that samples (I use the computer), or to be able to simultaneously split and layer 16 sounds. I get much more benefit from instant, simultaneous control of drawbars and a full complement of VA synth and effects controls. And I can add some big Kronos advantages to a Nord with some iPad apps (i.e. better orchestral sounds, set list management), but I can't add the Nord ergonomic advantages to the Kronos. Of course, it's best to have both. ;-) BTW, one more perk of the Nord, I don't have to wait 2+ minutes for it to start up!
_________________________
Maybe this is the best place for a shameless plug! Our new video at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ZRC3b4p4EI is a 40 minute adaptation of T. S. Eliot's "Prufrock" - check it out!

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#2931297 - 06/05/18 01:02 PM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: GregC]
Stokely Offline
Platinum Member

Registered: 12/15/12
Posts: 1837
Loc: Florida
Originally Posted By: GregC
Originally Posted By: Stokely
Look out guitar players, keyboard players can be gear-judgemental douches too! We're coming for your crown! Geez....



I think you are joking mostly. The gear analysis threads are fun.
( correct me if I am misunderstanding).

Imagine, Nord can did this up in a minute and have instant product assessment at a customer level. For free.

I think almost every post is fact based . opinions, preferences for sure but backed up with fact.

Folks here have excellent product knowledge. They are dedicated and serious about their craft.

I also enjoy joking around. Just wanted to give my input as a non-Nord person.


Yeah I was joking and didn't mean to sound so over-the-top, there were a few posts sprinkled in that seemed a bit weird in a brand-snob way (like guitarists!) but overall there's a lot of great info in here.

AnotherScott has me looking into the Gemini, for instance! I sure wish the Mojo 61 had those extra engines...

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#2931300 - 06/05/18 01:11 PM Re: Nord Stage Keyboards; The $3400 to $4500 decision [Re: AnotherScott]
Fusker Offline
Platinum Member

Registered: 04/20/09
Posts: 1408
Loc: Raleigh, NC
Originally Posted By: AnotherScott
Originally Posted By: MojoGuyPan
With a 61 and Seven you're still $1250 less than the Stage and you have an optimal keybed for organs and a sweet hammer action keybed for piano and EPs. You need a synth? Bring a Sledge and you still have cash in your pocket for night of fun.

That's a nice combo, but your math is off (at least in the U.S.), it's still $4700 ($2309+$1499+899). No cash in your pocket, it's more expensive than any NS3, sometimes by quite a lot ($3600 for the SW 73, $4200 for the 76 TP100, $4500 for the 88 TP40). And you still don't have a really high quality acoustic piano sound in your rig. You could make an argument for superior sounds in your rig (other than piano) and the benefit of multiple actions, but it's a pricier way to go. Plus you've got a much higher travel weight, longer setup time, bigger stage footprint, no master patch selection system, and reduced MIDI functionality. So there are still trade-offs.

Originally Posted By: MojoGuyPan
a Kronos 73 blows it out of the water sonically and wrt flexibility and overall capability.

...but not in immediacy of operation, ease of use and "fun" for anything beyond selecting a patch and playing it. Which may be all someone wants, but as I've said, my Kronos is great, but for most stuff, I'd rather use my NS3. And if you read this thread, you'll see I'm not alone. It's not like all these Nord players have never heard of a Kronos. Of course Kronos is more capable. But I don't need a sequencer or Karma, or a keyboard that samples (I use the computer), or to be able to simultaneously split and layer 16 sounds. I get much more benefit from instant, simultaneous control of drawbars and a full complement of VA synth and effects controls. And I can add some big Kronos advantages to a Nord with some iPad apps (i.e. better orchestral sounds, set list management), but I can't add the Nord ergonomic advantages to the Kronos. Of course, it's best to have both. ;-) BTW, one more perk of the Nord, I don't have to wait 2+ minutes for it to start up!


Agree with all this, and when talking the compact, the price is quite a bit lower, and it goes without saying, 22 lbs. is a huge factor, for me at least. Always a question of what to compromise on for a stage rig. 22 pounds and a compact footprint. Can't say it enough. Also, the connotation that people like Nords because they want to be seen playing a Nord is a fairly huge generalization. The mileage I've gotten out of my NE3 is incredible. Time for it to retire, but after having used it since 2011, I can't imagine not having a Nord in the stable.

Glad to see the Crumar mentioned though. I haven't been patrolling these boards much the less couple years (due to job change and cross country move) so was completely ignorant on this front. Obviously never seen one at a Guitar Center, looks very cool.


Edited by Fusker (06/05/18 01:14 PM)
Edit Reason: English
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