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#2934110 - 06/22/18 01:33 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: djdisbro]
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#2934113 - 06/22/18 02:25 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: djdisbro]
MojoGuyPan Offline
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I can't believe this is really happening! They said it couldn't be done. That Studiologic would go bankrupt trying to pack in so many sounds into a keyboard with this low a price.

Looks like the experts were wrong. Now ask yourself about the price of the Nords and whether or not it is even close to being justifiable.

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#2934117 - 06/22/18 02:42 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: MojoGuyPan]
ElmerJFudd Offline
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I don't recall any MI industry pundits saying any of those things. And since it isn't shipping (in the US at least), there's no way to know what effect it will have on Studio Logic's bottom line for the year. I think you're teasing us, mojoguy.
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#2934266 - 06/23/18 02:39 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: ElmerJFudd]
Radagast Offline
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Makes me wonder what the problem is. I'm glad even more glad I didn't wait for it and bought a Dexibell instead.


Edited by Radagast (06/23/18 02:40 PM)

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#2934274 - 06/23/18 04:42 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: djdisbro]
Copacetic Offline
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Damn, when I called them about it a couple days ago they said there was stock if I put in a preorder. Guess that got eaten up now waiting for the next shipment.


Edited by Copacetic (06/23/18 05:01 PM)

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#2934277 - 06/23/18 05:26 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: Radagast]
HammondDave Offline
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Originally Posted By: Radagast
Makes me wonder what the problem is. I'm glad even more glad I didn't wait for it and bought a Dexibell instead.


Same here... bought a Mojo 61 instead.
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#2934279 - 06/23/18 05:32 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: HammondDave]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: HammondDave
Originally Posted By: Radagast
Makes me wonder what the problem is. I'm glad even more glad I didn't wait for it and bought a Dexibell instead.


Same here... bought a Mojo 61 instead.

If the Mojo61 does what you need, I'm confident it's the better choice! It doesn't do as many things as the NX2X, but the things it does, it almost certainly does better.
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#2934280 - 06/23/18 05:33 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: Radagast]
Copacetic Offline
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Originally Posted By: Radagast
Makes me wonder what the problem is. I'm glad even more glad I didn't wait for it and bought a Dexibell instead.


The dexibell looks like a decent stage piano, completely misses the synth and midi keyboard functionality though so not really a direct competitor. The numa compact 2x seemingly offers a lot of usable sound plus a great midi controller for the same as what you'd pay for a good 88 key midi controller. If this get's on people's radars this thing will sell like hot cakes. I'm holding out.

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#2934286 - 06/23/18 06:09 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: Copacetic]
HammondDave Offline
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Originally Posted By: Copacetic
Originally Posted By: Radagast
Makes me wonder what the problem is. I'm glad even more glad I didn't wait for it and bought a Dexibell instead.


The dexibell looks like a decent stage piano, completely misses the synth and midi keyboard functionality though so not really a direct competitor. The numa compact 2x seemingly offers a lot of usable sound plus a great midi controller for the same as what you'd pay for a good 88 key midi controller. If this get's on people's radars this thing will sell like hot cakes. I'm holding out.


You know... it may end up sounding like shit. If it ever hits the market.
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#2934295 - 06/23/18 07:08 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: HammondDave]
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The latest expected availability date falls conveniently on my birthday.
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#2934299 - 06/23/18 07:42 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: Bobby Simons]
Chromedoggy Offline
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I played one of these today at gear fest. Oddly it sat right next to an NE6. The action and sound seemed adequate, but nowhere near the NE6.
The rep, who's name tag read "Nord technician". Said it was one of 3 in the US that they are using for events.
A Sweetwater SE told me the updated ship date was 8/16

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#2934301 - 06/23/18 07:54 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: HammondDave]
Copacetic Offline
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Originally Posted By: HammondDave
Originally Posted By: Copacetic
Originally Posted By: Radagast
Makes me wonder what the problem is. I'm glad even more glad I didn't wait for it and bought a Dexibell instead.


The dexibell looks like a decent stage piano, completely misses the synth and midi keyboard functionality though so not really a direct competitor. The numa compact 2x seemingly offers a lot of usable sound plus a great midi controller for the same as what you'd pay for a good 88 key midi controller. If this get's on people's radars this thing will sell like hot cakes. I'm holding out.


You know... it may end up sounding like shit. If it ever hits the market.


There's no way it sounds like shit. There are already several videos where you can hear what it sounds like.

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#2934302 - 06/23/18 07:56 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: Bobby Simons]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: HammondDave
Originally Posted By: Copacetic

The dexibell looks like a decent stage piano, completely misses the synth and midi keyboard functionality though so not really a direct competitor. The numa compact 2x seemingly offers a lot of usable sound plus a great midi controller for the same as what you'd pay for a good 88 key midi controller. If this get's on people's radars this thing will sell like hot cakes. I'm holding out.

You know... it may end up sounding like shit. If it ever hits the market.

It's not such a mystery. Start with the $499 Numa Compact 2, we already know what that sounds like. For $200 more, you get clonewheel and VA synth engines, with sliders that do triple duty as drawbars, synth controls, and MIDI controllers. It will be a good value. Just based on the demos already up, that's a lot of nice extra usability for that $200. I don't think anyone should be expecting all the sonic horsepower of the $1100 Numa Organ 2 and the $900 Sledge in this $700 keyboard that already does a bunch of other things besides. I think it's a safe bet that this is not going to be a Nord Stage 3 or Mojo 61 killer. But unless it's full of bugs or something, it should be a killer budget board.

To me, if it has an Achilles' heel, it's probably patch selection. They should have a way to repurpose the Sound Banks buttons to function as favorites and/or in some kind of keypad mode. At a minimum, I would hope you could re-define which sounds in each sound bank come up as default.
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#2934307 - 06/23/18 08:54 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: AnotherScott]
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At this price it competes with VR-09b.
That's tough competition sonically.
But it's not hard to beat the VR-09b's action or feel of drawbars.
User interface - we'll see which makes it easier to do what most need to get done.
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#2934326 - 06/24/18 04:41 AM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: ElmerJFudd]
MojoGuyPan Offline
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Studiologic Numa 2x > Roland VR09

I really don't get the hate from Ragast and others on the 2x. 1st we get the vaporware bashing, now we get the it's likely to sound like crap chorus. Both are bogus claims.

Pianos and EPs are what is in the 2. A knownn quantity. The 2x has a couple of demos from shows. The organ sounds decent in those videos. Hard to tell how.the organ and synth will sound in person but seems decent and the Numa 2 we know. Not shit.

Since when has Studiologic been known for vaporware? It's not like they claim that the 2x can do cold fusion. This is a 2 that they threw some drawbars and a couple extra buttons on and a new processor inside. They make the Sledge and Organ 2 so it's not like they don't already have a synth and organ engine to slap in there. They'll need to modify them for the limited controls but it's not exactly like they are starting from square one.

The price is $200 more than the 2 which should cover the more powerful processor and drawbars.

Studiologic has been doing some great stuff. The Organ and Sledge are high end and the Stage and Numa are solid middle-weight stage pianos that punch above their class. I'm optimistic that this will be another good board for someone who wants this all in one package, you do lose a lot of control vs the Organ and Sledge but the sound quality should be there in the 2x.

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#2934334 - 06/24/18 05:44 AM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: MojoGuyPan]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: MojoGuyPan
Studiologic Numa 2x > Roland VR09
...
Pianos and EPs are what is in the 2. A knownn quantity. The 2x has a couple of demos from shows. The organ sounds decent in those videos. Hard to tell how.the organ and synth will sound in person but seems decent and the Numa 2 we know. Not shit.

One place I think the VR09 will sonically beat Numa is in the rompler sounds. As you say, other than organ and synth, we already know how the Numa sounds will compare to Roland's. I think Numa's pianos/EPs are fine, but its other acoustic instrument sounds (strings, brass, winds, etc.) are generally not in Roland's league, IMO. Numa will certainly beat Roland in keyboard/MIDI capabilities (88 better feeling keys, with aftertouch, with 9-slider functionality as a MIDI controller, and I believe with better ability to call up its sounds over MIDI). Roland may still have the edge in general operational ergonomics for live performance, as Elmer alluded to.

Originally Posted By: MojoGuyPan
This is a 2 that they threw some drawbars and a couple extra buttons on and a new processor inside.

We don't know for sure it has a new processor, but it doesn't really matter.

Originally Posted By: MojoGuyPan
you do lose a lot of control vs the Organ and Sledge but the sound quality should be there in the 2x.

I will be surprised if the only differences between the $700 NC2X and the $2500 combination of a NC2 plus a Numa Organ plus a Sledge are in the controls (even allowing for the fact that they can eliminate redundancies). I wouldn't count on seeing the rotary sim, overdrive, or alternate organ models of the Numa Organ 2, or all the advanced features of the Sledge (3 oscillators, 2 LFOs with many waveshapes and destinations, PPG wavetables, FM, multimode filter, samples as sound sources, arpeggiator...) - I expect much more minimal sonic functionalities derived from those flagships, with at best some subset of the things I mentioned, which may or may not meet or exceed the organ and synth sections of the Roland. But we'll see. (And that's not a knock. I still think it will be an outstanding board for $700 regardless.)
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#2934336 - 06/24/18 05:48 AM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: Chromedoggy]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: Chromedoggy
I played one of these today at gear fest. Oddly it sat right next to an NE6. The action and sound seemed adequate, but nowhere near the NE6.
The rep, who's name tag read "Nord technician"

Not as odd as it may have seemed. In the U.S., Nord and Numa/Studiologic are distributed and represented by the same company, American Music & Sound.
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#2934338 - 06/24/18 06:13 AM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: MojoGuyPan]
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Originally Posted By: MojoGuyPan
Now ask yourself about the price of the Nords Crumar Seven and whether or not it is even close to being justifiable.

Fixed. ;-)

I originally thought a Korg SV1 was too expensive for a monotimbral instrument with relatively few sounds. Then I bought one.

They're all justifiable if you can afford it and they sound, feel, and operate the way you want in a way that nothing for less does.
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#2934343 - 06/24/18 07:33 AM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: Copacetic]
HammondDave Offline
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Originally Posted By: Copacetic
Originally Posted By: HammondDave
Originally Posted By: Copacetic
[quote=Radagast]Makes me wonder what the problem is. I'm glad even more glad I didn't wait for it and bought a Dexibell instead.


The dexibell looks like a decent stage piano, completely misses the synth and midi keyboard functionality though so not really a direct competitor. The numa compact 2x seemingly offers a lot of usable sound plus a great midi controller for the same as what you'd pay for a good 88 key midi controller. If this get's on people's radars this thing will sell like hot cakes. I'm holding out.


You know... it may end up sounding like shit. If it ever hits the market.


There's no way it sounds like shit. There are already several videos where you can hear what it sounds like. [/quote]

Really? The organ sounds like shit to me.
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#2934346 - 06/24/18 07:59 AM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: HammondDave]
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Originally Posted By: HammondDave
Really? The organ sounds like shit to me.


This is starting to remind me a whole lot of the VR09 thread. facepalm
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#2934353 - 06/24/18 08:33 AM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: Dr88s]
HammondDave Offline
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Originally Posted By: Dr88s
Originally Posted By: HammondDave
Really? The organ sounds like shit to me.


This is starting to remind me a whole lot of the VR09 thread. facepalm


Bring it on, Baby!

Seriously... I ordered a Numa 2x in March for a lightweight rehearsal board. After hearing the organ sim I knew that the 2x would only be serving as a controller for Galilleo with piano sounds from the Korg Module or hopefully from the Numa.

After being lied to by several sources who should have known better (they told me that deliverers would be in March), my patience ran out and I just bought a Mojo 61... and I am glad I did. The Mojo is just as light and can serve as a great organ clone with very good AP and EP, clavinet, etc sounds.

So yes, I still think the 2x organ clone is poor. But for others who primarily need an AP controller. This is a great deal. Just not for me.


Edited by HammondDave (06/24/18 08:36 AM)
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#2934356 - 06/24/18 08:52 AM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: HammondDave]
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I wasn't being confrontational; it's just a similar situation of a much cheaper do it all board being held up to the standards of a much pricier more focused application board.

Like you, I pre-ordered one as a rehearsal board. It's much lighter than my NS2, and at roughly a fifth of the price, I would be OK leaving it in my trunk if I went out for dinner or drinks before or after a rehearsal, which I have never done with my Nord.

I frankly don't expect it to sound as good as a Mojo or even the Numa Organ. It would make no sense for Studiologic to cram all of the technology from three of their more expensive boards into a single cheaper machine.

I am most interested in the audio over USB feature, to supplement any shortcomings in the sound engines with iOS apps. Personally, I don't like Galileo but perhaps the newer version is better...
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#2934359 - 06/24/18 09:25 AM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: Dr88s]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: HammondDave
After hearing the organ sim I knew that the 2x would only be serving as a controller for Galilleo

I think that might be premature. If you judge both by some of their online demos, either can disappoint. Galileo is cool, but not the highest bar, I don't think we can be sure that this won't be better.

Originally Posted By: HammondDave
After being lied to by several sources who should have known better (they told me that deliverers would be in March)

I wouldn't assume anyone lied to you, especially if you did not speak to anyone in Italian. More likely, they were repeating what they had been told. Whether someone lied to them, who knows. As as has been said, it is very hard to make predictions, especially about the future. Often all you can get is something on the continuum between "best guess" and "hope." I should have known when our last album was going to be out. I was wrong. ;-)

Originally Posted By: HammondDave
The Mojo is just as light

Liar! ;-) Really, roughly 25 lbs vs 15 is not just as light.



Edited by AnotherScott (06/24/18 12:14 PM)
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#2934377 - 06/24/18 11:43 AM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: Copacetic]
Radagast Offline
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Originally Posted By: Copacetic
Originally Posted By: Radagast
Makes me wonder what the problem is. I'm glad even more glad I didn't wait for it and bought a Dexibell instead.


The dexibell looks like a decent stage piano, completely misses the synth and midi keyboard functionality though so not really a direct competitor.


True but I wanted it primarily for the piano sound and the 88 keys. I already have a VR-09. I was going to sell it but now I have it and a superior piano.

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#2934379 - 06/24/18 11:53 AM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: MojoGuyPan]
Radagast Offline
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Originally Posted By: MojoGuyPan
Studiologic Numa 2x > Roland VR09

I really don't get the hate from Ragast and others on the 2x. 1st we get the vaporware bashing, now we get the it's likely to sound like crap chorus. Both are bogus claims.



My criticism comes from the repeatedly missed delivery dates. It makes it look like they don't know what they are doing. They've had a prototype at shows since January. Why can't they get it to market? I'm almost ready to start throwing stones at Dexibell too because they keep pushing the release of the new S9 later and later. Studiologic and Dexibell both have been showing prototypes of their respective new keyboards since the January NAMM show. Did both companies not know what needs to be done to manufacture these two items? Is it because they just don't have software programmers up to the task? Is there a quality control problem with their facilities or with their parts suppliers? Something is wrong here.

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#2934382 - 06/24/18 12:25 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: Radagast]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: Radagast
[My criticism comes from the repeatedly missed delivery dates. It makes it look like they don't know what they are doing.

They kinda don't. This isn't news... they have a long history of buggy software and questionable hardware QC. And it really is very hard to predict when software will be done (suitably stable for release). If it's taking them longer to get it right (or close enough), that's better than shipping something with significant usability issues. Really, I think their mistake was probably offering any date at all. They could have shown it as a prototype/concept, with no announced availability. Korg showed the Vox Continental for years that way.
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#2934393 - 06/24/18 01:29 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: AnotherScott]
ElmerJFudd Offline
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The Numa Compact 2x doesn't appear to be crap, serviceable organ, piano, EPs. Sonically with what's on board it isn't going to best the VR-09b in any category (YMMV). It's real benefits are going to be price, weight, action, range after touch, and MIDI controller functionality.

Start at 4:35


One might also consider the Casio MZ-X300
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#2934427 - 06/24/18 04:58 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: ElmerJFudd]
Radagast Offline
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Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd


The Numa Compact 2x doesn't appear to be crap, serviceable organ, piano, EPs. Sonically with what's on board it isn't going to best the VR-09b in any category (YMMV). It's real benefits are going to be price, weight, action, range after touch, and MIDI controller functionality.

Start at 4:35


One might also consider the Casio MZ-X300


One must wonder then, why they can't get it into stores. From now on I'm not getting excited about anything they show at NAMM or other shows until it's available to purchase. It's like Behringer showing all the concept synthesizers and never bringing any to market. What's so cool about that if you will never be able to own one? It's like the a**holes at GM allowing Buick to show the Avista show car and then saying they're never going to build it. I don't want to see a concept that never sees the light of day. That's like musical Onanism.

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#2934429 - 06/24/18 04:59 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: ElmerJFudd]
Copacetic Offline
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I hear ya, being really excited about something and expecting it to be available by a certain date only to have that date pushed back and pushed back is frustrating. Now seems like because that happened to you, you're trying to sling some crap at the company.

Yeah probably they should have just said "It will be available when it's available", but the salesman and marketers and fans hate that. We want to know when exactly we can get it, but the engineers, programmers, suppliers, etc only have an estimate of when that will be, kinda just depends what happens. That's just the way it is, especially with smaller companies and new products. If you can expect that then maybe you won't get so pissed when it happens.

Far as I can tell the sounds they have incorporated from the organ or the sledge are the same sounds, just there's a lot less of them and less functionality to modify those sounds.

This is exactly the kind of sacrifice for a cheaper price I'm totally willing to make. Less content but the content that is there is of equal quality.

Anyway personally, for me, anything by Roland isn't even in the running. I like their synths but I have always found their pianos to sound too muffled and like it's coming from a piece of plastic**. The next most likely contender is probably something from Yamaha (the MX88) or maybe Nord (Stage ... but that's just too much money I don't have).

Just gave the pianos another listen just to confirm... Man the Numa piano sounds really great to me. I actually think I might prefer it to the Yamaha, It's not as warm as Yamaha, but it just sounds so natural and expressive. What an awesome job they did sampling here.

Piano starts at 4:03


Piano at 1:22


And if you want to compare a similar price range and featured Roland to the Yamaha:


** Ok I need to correct myself here. The high end stuff from roland (like the FA08) or other boards with supernatural, or whatever, sound real nice, but I really don't like the piano sounds in their low-to-middle range models.


Edited by Copacetic (06/24/18 10:17 PM)

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#2934451 - 06/24/18 08:49 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Compact 2x [Re: ElmerJFudd]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
The Numa Compact 2x doesn't appear to be crap, serviceable organ, piano, EPs. Sonically with what's on board it isn't going to best the VR-09b in any category (YMMV).

MMV, in that I think the EPs that begin at about 6:10 in that Numa demo beat the EPs in the VR09B demo (and I felt the same about the EPs in the current NC2 vs. the original VR09, both of which I have first hand experience with). I also prefer Numa's acoustic piano.

That's another underwhelming NC2X organ demo, though. The overdrive is decidedly awful, sounds like a carryover from the NC2 and nothing like what's in the Numa Organs. Rotary effect is okay, but again, not Numa Organ 2 calibre from what I've heard so far.

There's still nothing to make me think Numa could compete with the Roland in strings/brass and such.

But you know... $700... 88 keys... aftertouch... gotta cut it some slack. And its MIDI functionality should make it easier to supplement its sounds with an iPad or whatever compared to some other boards.

Really good call on throwing the Casios into the mix, I always forget about the MZ-X. The 300 is $100 cheaper than the VR09B, and I think has way more features/capabilities overall, except for not having a VA synth section. I'm not sure how it compares sonically, but from the demo, it at least seems competitive. Roland came out with a 7x version of the VR, I'd love to see a 7x MZ-X of some sort.

MZ-X300 lags behind NC2X with just 61 keys, no aftertouch, lesser MIDI functionality, no VA synth, and a $200 higher price tag. But at least based on youtube, I think its "rompler" sounds are better and I'm not yet seeing any superiority in he NC2X's organ. The Casio has better screen/interface, pads, better speakers, the ability to pan sounds (you should be able to effectively put a Vent or other rotary/overdrive on it and still do splits and layers, unlike the Numa and Roland), much better patch recall than the others (12 banks of 8 registrations, all selectable from buttons), custom sample loading, audio and MIDI recording, and all the arranger features. Oh, and it's actually shipping. ;-)

To me, the really unique benefits of Numa (whether Compact 2 or 2X) is being a lightweight board with more than 61 keys and aftertouch. At the moment, unless I'm forgetting something, you don't get that from anything else except a Nord Stage 3 at $3600. So that's kinda huge. But if you don't need that, in every other respect, it has perfectly viable competitors that aren't too exorbitantly priced, even if they aren't quite at Numa's bargain level.
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