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#2909039 - 02/12/18 01:12 PM Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA
ctothej Offline
Member

Registered: 02/09/17
Posts: 16
Loc: Rapid City, SD
Looking for some advice here on what to do in the not so distant future. My primary objective is small PA for a one man solo gig I have been working on. I record some drum loops from various drum machines onto my computer and play keyboards/synths along with them. Go for funky/grungy/neo soul vibe thing. Lots of synth bass and rhodes with some synth brass stabs mixed in. Moog little phatty, prophet 6 and nord electro 5d.

Also play keys in various bands now and then and wouldn't mind something that will double as either keyboard amplification or monitor - I gig with this one bass player every now and then and he feels one monitor is fine for a band of 4+. I dont really share the sentiment hehe I'm so used to playing with 2 studio monitors facing me in the sweet spot...plus i need to hear what other chord players are doing.

Heres what I have now - 2 Peavy 115 speakers (basic 15' pa speaker) powered by QSC gx5. Had both of these for 10 years or so. I also have a Phil Jones Bass Roadcase bass amp.

The Roadcase is actually pretty sweet. Its kind of like a big ass powered studio monitor...12 5' drivers. I get compliments from other musicians on how it sounds. Its pretty big but not too hard to move around. Plenty loud enough.

Cons - It's pretty mid heavy especially sitting close to it which seems to happen all the time - not enough space to get away from it. Too big to raise up really. Mono - I think a stereo rig for keys would be nice especially for poly synth stuff - just not getting the same "effect" with synth stuff that I am at home.

Also I don't plan to use the amp in my live set - I could run my bass synth through it but then I'd have another separate volume to manage and amp to bring.

What I really need right now is monitors...I could use the Peavy 15's for PA. Ideally I would like to get some Yamaha DXR15's since I would like the low end response and I don't think I can manage a sub. SUV space is getting tight.

So I could get the DXR15's now and use the Peavy's for monitors...Or I could get Yamaha DXR10s for monitors and use Peavy's for PA - also giving me a Stereo Keys rig for when the need arises - or my own monitor (and 1 for a friend) should I need that too.

Orrrrrrrr.....I can get both DXR 15's & 10's - but I'd have to sell the bass amp. Yes I am kinda of partial to the Yamaha's. Just not sure what to do. Thought I'd ask some of you more experienced guys. Solo gig would be small bars/clubs - like 100 people max.

Here is my facebook page with some teaser vids for the music I'm doing if that might help guide your advice.
https://www.facebook.com/ChuckyDsFunkSYNTHphony/
or to cut it down to 1 minute
https://www.instagram.com/chucky.d.funk/

thanks all ya'll
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Nord Electro 5D, Prophet 6, Moog Little Phatty (2) Tempest, Drumtraks, RX5...

And limited playing ability and experience!

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KC Island
#2909042 - 02/12/18 01:18 PM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: ctothej]
J. Dan Online   content
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Registered: 07/25/08
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If it were me, I'd go with smaller active speakers that would work well as monitors, and add subwoofers for using them as PA. Something like a pair of QSC K10.2's with a KSub would work well.
_________________________
Dan

Acoustic/Electric stringed instruments ranging from 4 to 230 strings, hammered, picked, fingered, slapped, and plucked. Analog and Digital Electronic instruments, reeds, and throat/mouth.

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#2909333 - 02/13/18 01:13 PM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: J. Dan]
ctothej Offline
Member

Registered: 02/09/17
Posts: 16
Loc: Rapid City, SD
I could...but 5 speakers is...well 1 more to carry than 4. Plus the cost...I suppose i should rephrase my rambling on to "should I buy 15's for mains now and use my current 15's for monitors, or but 10's for monitors and use my current 15's for mains?
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Nord Electro 5D, Prophet 6, Moog Little Phatty (2) Tempest, Drumtraks, RX5...

And limited playing ability and experience!

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#2909335 - 02/13/18 01:21 PM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: ctothej]
timwat Offline
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Registered: 11/21/01
Posts: 5461
Loc: Concord,CA,UNITED STATES
I'm going to presume new DXRs will sound significantly better than the passive Peavys (I'm also a fan of the Yamahas, and gig two DXR8s).

Therefore I'd choose the DXRs for mains if it were me. As far as monitoring for a 100-person venue, it seems to me using two big cabs is a bit overkill for that size venue - audience will be enjoying as much monitor bleed as what you give them from your mains.

I think if it were me, I'd go DXR12s for mains, IEMs (or a single 8" powered PA speaker) for monitors, and consider schlepping a single powered sub if you really needed it for larger gigs.

Just my 0.02.
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"I'm not just untalented. I'm multi untalented."

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#2909337 - 02/13/18 01:28 PM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: ctothej]
cphollis Online   content
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Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 2276
Loc: Massachussets, Florida
Saw some of your vids. Interesting act!

First thought -- I think that 15" speakers are way overkill for this sort of thing. Too loud, too directional, too big for tiny postage stamp stages or the odd corner where you'll be playing. Not to mention a heavy schlep, especially with two.

For your solo gigs, you'll basically be acoustic wallpaper. You'll have to play quietly enough that people can have a conversation, waitstaff can take orders, etc. You'll want to fill the room with a nice, even sound so wide dispersion matters as does flat EQ.

Modern self-powered 8s or 10s are more than enough for this sort of gig, with surprising bass response. If you find yourself bass-challenged, I'd go with a small sub and smaller speakers. Better sound for less invested.

Those same modest 8s and 10s do pretty well in a band setting as well. More than enough volume to be heard without FOH if needed.

My current personal favorites in this category would be the recently refreshed QSC K.2 series. I play K8.2s and really enjoy the sound, although I don't hammer bass as much as you do. They or the K10.2s are worth auditioning, and you can find them in many music stores.

As I recall, the K8.2s are mostly flat down to ~50Hz. If you're going lower than that, consider a small sub. More portable, easier to control, etc.

There are some refreshed EVs out there that compare, but I haven't tried them yet. The DXRs are great if you can find them used, as are the legacy K series.

Using 15s for FOH PA is a bit more reasonable, if you're playing outdoors with the crowd directly in front of you and you're supposed to be loud. Otherwise smaller speakers, modest volume, wide dispersion and flat EQ is the way to go.

And if you think you need more bass below 50Hz, bring a sub.
_________________________
Life is too short to be playing bad music.

Keys: NP2, NS3C, NE4D, DeepMind-12
Home: Bosie 200, Yam AG N3
Amps: FA 12acs, RCF TT08as, QSC Ks, SSv3
Stuff: Stay stands, Key Largo, Vent II, X-Air 16

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#2909338 - 02/13/18 01:35 PM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: J. Dan]
Stokely Offline
Platinum Member

Registered: 12/15/12
Posts: 1696
Loc: Florida
Originally Posted By: J. Dan
If it were me, I'd go with smaller active speakers that would work well as monitors, and add subwoofers for using them as PA. Something like a pair of QSC K10.2's with a KSub would work well.


This is what our band does. Small k10.2 for the top mains and one sub per side works for 99% of our gigs. It's actually hard to get quiet enough for many of them, and the k10.2 is very loud for its size. And sounds tremendous.

As far as carrying stuff--if I have a gear regret, it's not getting a rock'n'roller cart earlier. We now have four in the band. Also, our handy bass player worked up a way to rig the subs, mains and 4 lights per side. The other big improvement in our PA setup/teardown time was to snake everything up. Each side gets a big snake with audio/power/light cables. Our setup time went from 1.5 hrs to 30 minutes in a pinch.


Edited by Stokely (02/13/18 01:36 PM)

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#2909364 - 02/13/18 03:01 PM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: Stokely]
rickp Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/17/14
Posts: 266
Originally Posted By: Stokely
Originally Posted By: J. Dan
If it were me, I'd go with smaller active speakers that would work well as monitors, and add subwoofers for using them as PA. Something like a pair of QSC K10.2's with a KSub would work well.


This is what our band does. Small k10.2 for the top mains and one sub per side works for 99% of our gigs. It's actually hard to get quiet enough for many of them, and the k10.2 is very loud for its size. And sounds tremendous.

Couldn't agree more. The K10.2's act like many quality 12's only with better dispersion and they're very clear and precise - and extremely versatile as monitors, amps or mains. Add 1 or 2 KSubs when needed for FOH and you're set for a wide array of venues.

Like Chuck posted above, I play the K8.2's most of the time (and we also use them as FOH in several small to mid-size venues and use them as near-center-fill FOH in larger places); there's something magic about those boxes, they don't know they're small. But, other than some full range AP on some intros, I'm playing LH bass through bass amps 90% of the time, so the K8.2's aren't being asked to do a lot of heavy low end lifting in any of our setups. Still, given their excellent performance (even in lower hz's) for their size and weight, you might like what you hear (and lift) if you check them out.
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Kawai KG-2D / Yamaha CP33 S90ES P105 MX49 CP4 CLP635 / Hammond SK1 / Korg R3
QSC K8s K8.2s K10s K12s KSubs / SoundcraftUi24 / SSv3 / GK MB112 MB115 MB210 Neo410

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#2909535 - 02/14/18 09:52 AM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: rickp]
ctothej Offline
Member

Registered: 02/09/17
Posts: 16
Loc: Rapid City, SD
Folks love those QSC k's huh?

When I talk about issues carrying stuff...its also about fitting it all into 1 car...in my situation there are no "team lifts." Yeah I could/probably will get a cart...or lift more weights hehe.

As far as volume is concerned the venues where I anticipate playing often have 3-5 piece bands with amps miked kick/snare run through what appears to be the standard 12's plus sub so I figure that'd be what I have to match volume wise.

My old peavy's are sounding a bit dull. I've used them as DJ monitors since back when DJ's played records!

So maybe 12'a & 8s and a sub later on if need be....hmmm. appreciate all the insights.
_________________________
Nord Electro 5D, Prophet 6, Moog Little Phatty (2) Tempest, Drumtraks, RX5...

And limited playing ability and experience!

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#2909585 - 02/14/18 12:28 PM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: ctothej]
rockinroller Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/05/04
Posts: 198
Loc: Motown
I play LH bass in most of my live performing and use a single Yamaha DXR12 as my only output in small to medium venues, and as an on-stage monitor with the line-out to the mains and monitors in outdoor and larger performance venues. I've never had issues with the bass distorting the other sounds of my boards and continue to be impressed with Yamaha's quality and ability.
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Kurzweil Artis 7 (2)
Yamaha DXR 12 Powered Speaker
Alto TS210 Powered Speaker
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#2909587 - 02/14/18 12:38 PM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: ctothej]
ITGITC? Offline
Grand Poobah of Posting
10k Club

Registered: 12/18/02
Posts: 17467
Loc: USA

Ya know... cphollis is modest as...

WAIT! What am I saying? Is the crazy starting to show? crazy wink

(Hi Chuck!) cool

He writes a great blog on his experiences playing in bands, his equipment, and why he chose the pieces he did.

It's in his profile, but I don't know why he didn't include the link in the body of his post.

So I'll do it for him: http://chucksblog.typepad.com/late_bloomer/

BTW, I've got a pair of QSC K10. They get the job done. I like 'em.

We discuss this topic A LOT. However, things change and it's good to get a refresh every now and then.

For example, a lot of folks here are just now getting into IEMs - and love them! Although they're not for everybody, I think the pros certainly outweigh the cons. Chuck has recently written about his experience with them.

By the way, Chuck has spent the money to purchase some really nice speakers... so I didn't have to. Thanks Chuck! smile

Just look at this list:

FA 12acs http://fulcrum-acoustic.com/products/fa-portable/

RCF TT08as http://www.rcf.it/products/touring-and-theatre/tt08-a

QSC Ks https://www.qsc.com/live-sound/products/loudspeakers/powered-loudspeakers/qsc-k2-seriestm-new/

SSv3 http://aspenpittmandesigns.com/spacestation-v3/


I think his advice and experience go a long way... second to none. So, when you have a few minutes, click on the link and read his blog.

But ctothej, keep this between you and me, OK? We don't want Chuck to think he's a rock star. He'd write another blog and call it, "The Keyboard Corner forum? Yeah, I knew them when..." laugh

Tom
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"Music expresses that which cannot be put into words and that which cannot remain silent.Ē - Victor Hugo

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#2909611 - 02/14/18 01:58 PM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: ITGITC?]
cphollis Online   content
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 2276
Loc: Massachussets, Florida
You're too kind blush

Also, there's this pair of QSC K153 towers, and this nifty 1000w RCF small sub. Just to be complete, don'tcha know ...

Had I known then what I know now, I'd have gone in a different direction. So I do what I can to share what I've learned (in my context) with others who are on similar journeys.
_________________________
Life is too short to be playing bad music.

Keys: NP2, NS3C, NE4D, DeepMind-12
Home: Bosie 200, Yam AG N3
Amps: FA 12acs, RCF TT08as, QSC Ks, SSv3
Stuff: Stay stands, Key Largo, Vent II, X-Air 16

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#2909724 - 02/14/18 08:18 PM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: cphollis]
ctothej Offline
Member

Registered: 02/09/17
Posts: 16
Loc: Rapid City, SD
Cool blog chuck! Fun and funny stuff there.

I guess I've grown accustomed to having 15's since I've always had a pair around...oh the times are a changing.

I dont play much acoustic piano but I did notice my bass amp really failed there on my nord electro...so I feel cphollis on how they can be hard to amplify. Synth stuff too.

Rockinroller - appreciate response on the DXR use. When you play left hand bass, what kind of sounds are you playing?

Actually I'm curious about that all around - I see the term LH Bass thrown around all the time but don't have a good understanding of what that means...I assume playing bass lines in absence of bass player? But on what kind of sounds? Organ, synth, sampled bass? Or just the low register on whatever keyboard sound you happen to be playing at the moment.

I feel like I have even more things to research now then I did before hand. My local shop might have the cheapest line of a couple brands so maybe go take a listen.
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Nord Electro 5D, Prophet 6, Moog Little Phatty (2) Tempest, Drumtraks, RX5...

And limited playing ability and experience!

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#2909748 - 02/15/18 01:08 AM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: ctothej]
Darcity Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/18/00
Posts: 433
Loc: Atlanta, Ga
Iíve just gone through that. Since no one has mentioned them, have you considered the Turbosound iQ12? I was about to purchase 2 QSC K12.2 until the salesperson asked me to consider them. When I heard them A/Bing against the QSCs I was blown away! I said that they mustíve done something to get them to sound that good. So I left and after extensive research, I found out they got a lot of praise. It wasnít just me. Give them a listen.
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Privia PX-5S, Korg Kronos 2 61, Yamaha Motif Rack XS, Hammond B3, Novation 61SL MKII, Impulse 61, Roland D-550, Proteus 2000, etc......to name a few.

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#2909910 - 02/15/18 01:49 PM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: Darcity]
cphollis Online   content
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 2276
Loc: Massachussets, Florida
Lots of folks like the Turbosound, but not as well known. Certainly in the same league as the QSC K.2s. Lots of good choices these days!
_________________________
Life is too short to be playing bad music.

Keys: NP2, NS3C, NE4D, DeepMind-12
Home: Bosie 200, Yam AG N3
Amps: FA 12acs, RCF TT08as, QSC Ks, SSv3
Stuff: Stay stands, Key Largo, Vent II, X-Air 16

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#2909921 - 02/15/18 02:33 PM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: cphollis]
MotiDave Offline
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Registered: 12/04/12
Posts: 1642
Loc: San Diego, CA USA
Anyone have much experience yet with the ELX200-10P? It popped up briefly when the line was announced, haven' seen much since.
I like the bluetooth ability to adjust via phone/app (and its $100 cheaper than QSC - though thats not a reason i'll buy). I like my ELX112P but i'm looking to downsize to a 10 - I only use it as a stage monitor.

I'm sort of leaning K10.2 vs ELX200-10P, so if anyone has A-B comparison experience, I welcome expert evals... KC guys are wicked smart.
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#2909942 - 02/15/18 04:25 PM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: MotiDave]
cphollis Online   content
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 2276
Loc: Massachussets, Florida
The ELX units haven't been getting much traction. Don't know why that is, as EV builds great products, maybe poor marketing?

A lot of us have zeroed into the K.2 units. They don't suck. I too would welcome an A/B comparison. Not religious.
_________________________
Life is too short to be playing bad music.

Keys: NP2, NS3C, NE4D, DeepMind-12
Home: Bosie 200, Yam AG N3
Amps: FA 12acs, RCF TT08as, QSC Ks, SSv3
Stuff: Stay stands, Key Largo, Vent II, X-Air 16

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#2909979 - 02/15/18 10:38 PM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: J. Dan]
hardware Online   content
Platinum Member

Registered: 03/04/14
Posts: 1175
Loc: Las Vegas
Originally Posted By: J. Dan
If it were me, I'd go with smaller active speakers that would work well as monitors, and add subwoofers for using them as PA. Something like a pair of QSC K10.2's with a KSub would work well.


I bought K12s originally for keyboards but converted sidefills.
Ended up with QSC KW Series Mains.
181s on bottom 153s on top.
Bought it used for 3,000, just beat these cabinets severely and they sound really good.
Outdoors or 300 seaters we use the Subs, smaller gigs the 151s only, and even smaller gigs the K12s.
Really impressed with their sound and build quality.
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Magnus C350 + FMR RNP + Realistic Unisphere Mic

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#2910050 - 02/16/18 06:58 AM Re: Another "What speakers to get" Thread. Mostly for PA [Re: hardware]
ctothej Offline
Member

Registered: 02/09/17
Posts: 16
Loc: Rapid City, SD
So at the moment Im leaning towards a set of K8.2 for monitors/keys rig & DXR12s for mains.

Hmm so which to buy first now. DXRs I think.

Although maybe I could get by with just a set of mains behind me...though problem I have now with the 15ís is that on stands they are too high above my ears its all woofer.
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Nord Electro 5D, Prophet 6, Moog Little Phatty (2) Tempest, Drumtraks, RX5...

And limited playing ability and experience!

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