franky46 Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 Can registrations be selected in real time from the iPad screen, i.e. to change sounds mid-song? sorry, I made several copy paste and far-too-late-in-the-night errors, the Editor is NOT for iOS (=iPad) but for Win 7-10 and Mac OS-X (and Linux) Unfortunatly the VR does not offer a way to access the onboard registrations from outside. IMHO the only way to switch the registrations is using a hardware foot pedal. That's the reason why the Editor actually uses the 'upg-files' workaround to at least have one method to 'edit' them. One of the planed Editor features is to 'rebuild' the registration thing completely on the Editor (with principally an unlimited number of registrations and a 'nice' intuitive surface that could even include songlists etc) , so you won't use the registrations of the VR any more but those of the Editor. If we succeed to completely decode the upg-file format, it would even be possible to save the Editor-registrations to a upg-file and load into the VR and vice versa. Decoding the upg-format is no miracle but extremely time consuming and rather a future thing. f Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adan Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 Well I finally joined the club and got one of these. Getting back into playing with bands and trying to orchestrate rehearsal logistics with my family demands has been kinda frustrating. I decided I need a rehearsal board and the VR09 is the best option. The weight, decent organ and the ability to cover all other sounds, and even battery power go into making this a useful tool for me. I don't see myself gigging with it, but indirectly it will help me in getting to the gigging stage. I considered the VR730, but the size and weight start to undercut the point of a rehearsal keyboard. Now that I have it, the surprise is that I actually enjoy playing B3 on it, even on the 09 keys. Except for the expression pedal, which I still consider a big weakness. Roland's pedal works badly. I have an FC07, but apparently it needs a modified plug and I don't see an easy solution to that. Poor swell pedal control and the limitations on effects in split mode would be the main things making me want to not gig with it. Quote Gigging: Crumar Mojo 61, Hammond SKPro Home: Vintage Vibe 64 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EscapeRocks Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 Adan, The easiest way to use the FC7 is to get these TRS-TS Y cables Plug the FC7 TRS into the female TRS of the Y. Then, plug the Red Into Black, and Black into red, then plug that whole thing into the VR09 If you're handy with soldering, you can also open up the FC7 and switch the tip and ring wires. Quote David Gig Rig:Depends on the day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EscapeRocks Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 V-Combo Editor Update v1.12.4: + : upg-Registration-Editor: the VR registrations can now be edited using the the upg-files (the files where reg. sets are saved to and load from usb dongle). Registrations can be ordered, renamed, copied and merged with other sets. Nice. I am downloading the update now. Thank you for this. Quote David Gig Rig:Depends on the day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WesG Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 And if you're REALLY handy at soldering, add a 47K resistor in parallel with each half of the pot. The useless section at the back of the throw will be much smaller. Quote Hammond: L111, M100, M3, BC, CV, Franken CV, A100, D152, C3, B3 Leslie: 710, 760, 51C, 147, 145, 122, 22H, 31H Yamaha: CP4, DGX-620, DX7II-FD-E!, PF85, DX9 Roland: VR-09, RD-800 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adan Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 Adan, The easiest way to use the FC7 is to get these TRS-TS Y cables Plug the FC7 TRS into the female TRS of the Y. Then, plug the Red Into Black, and Black into red, then plug that whole thing into the VR09 If you're handy with soldering, you can also open up the FC7 and switch the tip and ring wires. Great, I'm glad there's an off the shelf solution, and even gladder I didn't have to read through 109 pages to find it. Quote Gigging: Crumar Mojo 61, Hammond SKPro Home: Vintage Vibe 64 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nils_O Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 V-Combo Editor Update v1.12.4: + : upg-Registration-Editor: the VR registrations can now be edited using the the upg-files (the files where reg. sets are saved to and load from usb dongle). Registrations can be ordered, renamed, copied and merged with other sets. + VR DRUM section added + improved working area (e.g. indication of sound names in the voice selectors) + improved feedback from VR. + many Bugfixes download: http://ctrlr.org/roland-vr09-vr730-v-combo-editor Great! Absolutely amazing work. Would it in some way be possible to specify different midi channels in for the different parts? Like the 3 organ parts and UM1, UM2, LM1? If it would have been possible then you could as example put upper organ ch1, lower organ ch2, pedal organ ch3 and UM1 also ch1, LM1 ch2 and then have a choice to put UM2 either also on ch1 or ch3 the pedals. ? Actually I guess not? Midi implementation says 2 (Pedal) 3 (Lower) 4 (Upper) I couldn't find anything about changing channels either so my first asumption would be that it is not possible. Wonder if there are any hardware devices that can change the channels to get Upper 1, Lower 2 and Pedal 3? Also seems to be only 2 parts (except for the organ bass) so I guess not possible to split UM1 and UM2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franky46 Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 ... > Would it in some way be possible to specify different midi channels in for the different parts? Like the 3 organ parts and UM1, UM2, LM1? a) you can change the mdi-out signals on the keyboard (onboard menu "MIDI") for upper, lower, pedal and drums. b) You can NOT change the in-channels, they are fixed : CH1 = UM2:voice ('piano dual' in Roland specs) CH2 = pedal CH3 = LM CH4 = UM1 CH11= drums Anyway, the keyboard has to be set to MODE2 to be able to forward midi-in messages to the keyboard sounds and manuals. In MODE1, received midi-messges exclusively trigger the GM2 sound generator > Wonder if there are any hardware devices that can change the channels to get Upper 1, Lower 2 and Pedal 3? c) for controlls, a (programmable) device can transform channel based 'midi CC' to sysex messages and vice versa to control the different parts (UM1, UM2, LM, Organ UM1/2/pedal) d) for note on/off, a (programmable) device could only change (map) the channel number from b). It's not possible to send a note on/off to an exclusive 'organ channel' there is a nice software progam for transforming between channel based CC and sysex: it's "BOME midi translaor". I used it to map the VR hardware drawbars/ontrollers to the software B3-emulation "VB3". > Also seems to be only 2 parts (except for the organ bass) so I guess not possible to split UM1 and UM2. that's right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EscapeRocks Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Franky46! I just want to give you a huge thanks for the latest editor update. While I usually don't use the term, being able to reorder the Registrations is a "game changer" for me in how I will use the VR-09B. I can now easily set up my set list order prior to a show. I tested it last night and it works as advertised. For those watching, you copy your Registrations (.upg) to you Thumb Drive. Then attach the drive to you PC/Mac. Open up CTRL and the VR editor, hit the Registration tab to open the Reg editor, and load the .upg from your thumb drive. You can then change the order, and do other cool things. Save it back to your thumb drive... then load it into your VR. Instant Registration order change. yay!! This is covered in the Youtube video, near the end. Quote David Gig Rig:Depends on the day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nils_O Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 ... b) You can NOT change the in-channels, they are fixed : CH1 = UM2:voice ('piano dual' in Roland specs) CH2 = pedal CH3 = LM CH4 = UM1 CH11= drums I didn't understand UM2 was ch1. > Wonder if there are any hardware devices that can change the channels to get Upper 1, Lower 2 and Pedal 3? d) for note on/off, a (programmable) device could only change (map) the channel number from b). It's not possible to send a note on/off to an exclusive 'organ channel' I meant a channel mapper for Note On/Off that recieve at a channel as ch1 and sends it on a different channel as ch4 to map upper from my organ (that is old and can't be changed from ch1) to UM1, Etc... And even better if it could have been possible to choose to sent out to more than 1 channel (which obviously would be the only way to use UM1 and UM2 at the same time since I now understand they are on different channels.) I search and I could not find such a device. Found a lot of midi devices that did different things but not just changing receive channel to a different transmit channel. Again, thanks for great work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franky46 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 I meant a channel mapper for Note On/Off that recieve at a channel as ch1 ahhh I see, the french would say 'là vous tombez bien' - that kind of mapper is essential for using the V-Combo editor in "GM2" mode ... For hardware boxes, you have to google/ask for midi router, translator, mapper, patchbay etc e.g Midi Solutions "MIDI Event Processors": http://midisolutions.com/Figure16.jpg map a note on/off from one channel to another. By adding serveral 'rules', CH4 => CH1, CH4 => CH6 etc, you can multiplex the messages. if you can accept a software solution (windows laptop, Ipad etc) the simplest setup is standard midi-usb cable: https://www.thomann.de/de/thomann_midi_usb_1x1.htm plug one midi connector to your organ, the other into the VR and the USB to the PC/tablet, the latter running a midi router/mapper software. The PC receives the note signals from your organ, the software router maps/multiplexes the signals to different channels and sends them to the out which is connected to the VR. The best free software (performant + robust) is: ChopperLan : an amazing piece of 'component connector', super simple initial setup and then works for eternity. TransMIDIfier: configuration of channel mapping is even simpler than ChopperLan, but does not transmit SysEx. Using ChopperLan will allow you to use the V-Combo Editor (at least in the direction EDITOR -> VR09). I'm working on a video that explains a "GM" setup for the VR09+V-Combo Editor. That will give you an idea how those software mappers work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franky46 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Instant Registration order change. yay!! Hi David, thank you for the flowers (jaja, that's german.. ), indeed the kolossal chaos in my upg-files starts to decrease significantly I really appreciate your feedback as this could be important for other potential Mac users (we only avec win and ios at home ) Have fun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomKittel Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Instant Registration order change. yay!! Hi David, thank you for the flowers (jaja, that's german.. ), indeed the kolossal chaos in my upg-files starts to decrease significantly I really appreciate your feedback as this could be important for other potential Mac users (we only avec win and ios at home ) Have fun Hey Franky, Thumbs up! Your 'German engineering' exhausts undreamt-of possibilities of the VR09. If the Roland people were smart enough they would hire you. Thank you for this incredible tool. Keep up the good work! Quote LIFE IS SHORT, GO GET THE GEAR YOU WANT ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EscapeRocks Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Hey Franky, Thumbs up! Your 'German engineering' exhausts undreamt-of possibilities of the VR09. If the Roland people were smart enough they would hire you. Thank you for this incredible tool. Keep up the good work! This! At first I thought the editing capabilities from my Macbook were great. Now with the Registration edit update to the program, it has changed the way, for the better, how I can use my VR09 in my Mainstage rig. Quote David Gig Rig:Depends on the day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franky46 Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 Servus voila the tutorial to setup the 'midi loopback' to play the GM sounds of the VR. At 7:00 three minutes of GM synth sounds - oldschool but 'interesting' to see which princess the VR is to be awaken [video:youtube] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franky46 Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 V1.12(5) important hotfix upate for upg-editor (under certain circumstances, erase could delete multiple registrations) + feature update: all four upper manual voices are now parallel http://ctrlr.org/roland-vr09-vr730-v-combo-editor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nils_O Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 Hi franky46! You don't know if the Pipe and Theater organ drawbar/tabs from the Atelier organ series also happen to be available in VR-09? Vintage Organ Information Address (H) Size (H) Data (H) Parameter Description x...KEYBOARD NUMBER (0-2), Upper Keyboard k = 0 Lower Keyboard k = 1 Pedal Keyboard k = 2 * The AT-300/100/75 do not have Pedal Vintage Organ. 02 0k 00 00 00 01 00-7F VINTAGE ORGAN MUTE 00 (OFF), 7F (ON) * This affects all Vitage Organ regardless of the keyboard number. 02 0k 01 00 00 01 00-7F VINTAGE ORGAN LEVEL 00 - 7F * This has no effect if VINTAGE ORGAN SET is Flute. Use the system parameter VINTAGE FLUTE VOLUME to control it. 02 0k 02 00 00 01 01-03 VINTAGE ORGAN SET 01:Flute 02:Pipe 03:Theater Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franky46 Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 Hello @ Nils: tested it but it does not work, SysEx "02 0k 02 00 00 01 VINTAGE ORGAN SET" is not recognized. @ all : there's a new release v1.12(6) in the making which adds: UPG-Editor: change damper and expression pedal assignments for each registration and save to upg-file UPG-Editor: show all sounds (patches) for avselected registration D-BEAM conrol Master fine tune ANY WISHES ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piattica Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 yes: a way to save in a file or print the list of registration in an UPG thanks !!! Quote VR-09, PX5S, VB3, MrRay, Gemini, K2500R, XStation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franky46 Posted March 23, 2018 Share Posted March 23, 2018 yes: a way to save in a file or print the list of registration in an UPG thanks !!! Hi, done so. I sent you a private message at ctrlr.org with the download link for a prerelease version for approval Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rovito Posted March 24, 2018 Share Posted March 24, 2018 Online store has these for $799.99 and 12 payments. Couldn't pass it up. I got a lot of reading to catch up on. Quote If I listed all of my gear here my wife might see it and start asking questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franky46 Posted March 25, 2018 Share Posted March 25, 2018 Hi folks for update v1.12(6) I made a colour variant, here's a test version: http://ctrlr.org/?ddownload=83065 (this is still v1.12(6) beta!) what's your impression: better/worse than the brown/orange surface? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EscapeRocks Posted March 25, 2018 Share Posted March 25, 2018 Franky. Love it. The new panel colors look GREAT on my Macbook pro Retina. I also really like the new layout (and parameters) on the UPG edit page. Nice work. Thank you! Quote David Gig Rig:Depends on the day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomKittel Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 Hi Franky, Has the VR09 to be connected to the PC to load and edit UPG files? At the moment I don't have my VR09 here at home. I just tried to edit VR09 UPG files which are stored on my PC but nothing happens when I click on 'Load UPG File'. Is there a manual available for your fabulous editor? Many thanks and keep up the great work! Tom Quote LIFE IS SHORT, GO GET THE GEAR YOU WANT ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franky46 Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 Servus > Has the VR09 to be connected to the PC to load and edit UPG files? no > stored on my PC but nothing happens when I click on 'Load UPG File'. Strange! a popup-window should open with a classical file browser. Which Windows version do you use? > Is there a manual available for your fabulous editor? yeah, a text-file for the real hard guys. It's included in zip package of the 'official' releases. But there are video tutorials: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC5kZc3eZtenfkwcAC15siDg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franky46 Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 nothing happens when I click on 'Load UPG File'. Hi Tom, a german guy had the same faulty behaviour but we have no idea why. Anyway the actual beta test seems to be ok: http://ctrlr.org/?ddownload=83155 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vidarf Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 (First post here: hello, fellow keyboard boxers! Love to meet ya all! Greetings from Norway!) Just got my VR-09. Brand new, the first revision with latest firmware. Got a GREAT deal on it (NOK 7995,- down to 5500,- which translates roughly to 700 USD down from about a grand). Since the new version is out, I guess one can get a good deal on the original board these days. I am not a seasoned keyboardist by any stretch of the imagination, but I've played keys (and guitar and a plethora of other instruments) since childhood. I played (pipe)organ for a looong time, until I got my electric piano six years ago. I have NEVER done any public performances until february and march this year, as I joined a small group at my local church. The first gig was a small concert / sing-a-long evening during a local cultural event with about 25 people joining (not bad considering they had to pay about $25 to get in and we competed with a concert at the local waterhole). Then I really got tossed in the deep end, doing a couple of songs on a Gospel consert with Angela Primm and Elsa Harris with over 350 people in the building (which was awesome - we expected max 200). During the last song (when the saints) the band got called up on stage to join in, and I got a finger pointed at med at some point with Ms. Primm yelling "KEYS KEYS KEYS" - solo time! Afterwards, Mrs. Harris complimented me and said "I heard the organ" with a BIG grin! During the gospel concert, the Nord was my piano controller and the VR-09 the sound source. I played accoustic piano, FM EP and of course organ. Not a single hiccup. Just MIDI the boards together and play. Having read the whole thread, this is my verdict: +Great sounds for a band mix +mindnummingly simple to use in a live setting, even for an unexperienced fella like me +incredible fun to use and to tweak sounds +live performance controls is a breeze to use +Lightning fast response on organ setting, can fire off a salvo of B3 goodnes like a machine gun! -Effects on only one part of a layer -Switching sounds with vastly different effects settings is NOT recommended. The base sound may carry over, but the effects change immediately. Does not sound good. -AP piano is almost good, but the short looping spoils it. Roland dropped the ball on that one! The AP should've been a lot better with "ROLAND" printed on the back! Other aspects has been thoroughly covered, so I will not bore you with repetitions. These are just a few points of mine that I feel is the most important. The keyboard and the keybed / action: Light, plasticy feeling - but GREAT for gigs. For rehersals, I only bring my VR-09. I don't lug the Nord around unless I have to or need better action for piano parts. Feels solid enough, though. I may not go Jerry Lee Lewis on the thing, but apart from that I don't think the quality is an issue at all. Key action is light. Very light. Synth keys for sure. Slightly smaller keys than I am used to, but easy to adapt (playing a lot of different pipe organs over the years got me used to different keyboards). For me, the VR-09 is totally useless for any piano performance what so ever. I am used to the keyboard of my Casio AP-450 which is fantastic. I cannot get any consistent expressive result out of it. That being said, I also struggle with the Nord Stage Rev.B, althoug it is far better. For me, the VR-09 is a great top tier board and a rehearsal toss-in-the-backseat workhorse. I will allways have a better 88 graded hammer action with superior AP sounds as my bottom tier (the Nord will at some point be swapped with something else, maybe the Casio PX-5s. I love the action and AIR piano sound). For my use, the sounds residing in the VR-09 (and especially all the "hidden" sounds now accessible thanks to CTRLR and Franky46) will serve me well. To summarize: Good organ, good sounds for a band mix, incredible easy to use for live performances, good action sans piano performance (where expressiveness is required), great value and a light instrument for rehearsals. I highly recommend it as you get a LOT of value for your money. (on a side note: I love that the in/outputs has the labels printed on top of the thing. Makes it incredibly easy to reach back to work on the plugs if needed. I allways search for the on/off button on my Nord Stage - never so on the Roland. Quote Gig setup: Nord Stage rev.B, Roland VR-09, double braced X-stand w/attic for the VR. Home key situation: Casio Celviano AP450, Homebuilt digital pipe organ w/Hauptwerk software Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brenner13 Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Wow! Fantastic review. Congratulations on the new board and the wonderful gigs. It sure sounds like you are having a blast. Oh, and welcome to the forum. You so eloquently share your experience, I'm inspired to go practice some more. Cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nils_O Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Hello @ Nils: tested it but it does not work, SysEx "02 0k 02 00 00 01 VINTAGE ORGAN SET" is not recognized. @ all : there's a new release v1.12(6) in the making which adds: UPG-Editor: change damper and expression pedal assignments for each registration and save to upg-file UPG-Editor: show all sounds (patches) for avselected registration D-BEAM conrol Master fine tune ANY WISHES ??? One idea could have been to make a virtual registration memory with a couple of registrations buttons on PC screen perhaps 8. Then you could possibly have an unlimited number of registration files with 8 registrations to recall on PC and then when pressing a registration button the PC should set up the intrument. But that might be tricky and perhaps no wishes for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nils_O Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Doesn't the VR:s have the possibillity to add som sustain to the organ bass? This is a normal feature of Hammond clones but can't find it anywhere here. Is this important feature missing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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