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#2896860 - 12/19/17 03:59 PM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: ElmerJFudd]
slowtraveler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/07/13
Posts: 396
Loc: Boston, MA
Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
“Many cities, even ones that have very large populations, are down to one or two piano stores. They’re the only outlets for new pianos in these cities. The choices for consumers are very limited and dictated by a few very large manufacturers . More outlets in more areas will provide choices for people and, in addition, MI dealers and tech dealers will add to their revenue stream, a win-win situation!” DeFio explains.

The solution to lack of demand is... more supply! Genius. Evidently, that's an insight one can only acquire after 50 years of experience in selling pianos.

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KC Island
#2896861 - 12/19/17 04:07 PM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: slowtraveler]
Wastrel Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 05/13/09
Posts: 2584
Loc: Los Angeles
Originally Posted By: slowtraveler
Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
“Many cities, even ones that have very large populations, are down to one or two piano stores. They’re the only outlets for new pianos in these cities. The choices for consumers are very limited and dictated by a few very large manufacturers . More outlets in more areas will provide choices for people and, in addition, MI dealers and tech dealers will add to their revenue stream, a win-win situation!” DeFio explains.

The solution to lack of demand is... more supply! Genius. Evidently, that's an insight one can only acquire after 50 years of experience in selling pianos.

That was my take on it as well. He's probably a nice old guy who spent a long career rising to prominence in an industry that has for the most part dried up and blown away. I'm sure it's tough to give up the dream or acknowledge that his hard-won expertise really isn't all that relevant anymore.
Whoa. Now I'm bumming myself out...
_________________________
“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it’s time to pause and reflect.”
-Mark Twain

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#2896868 - 12/19/17 04:35 PM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: Wastrel]
CowboyNQ Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 06/14/15
Posts: 785
Loc: Adelaide, Australia
We were touring through a town in regional Australia (pop 28,000) earlier this year.

Our guitarist needed some strings so we wandered into the CBD to find a music store. Happened upon a small piano shop - packed full of pianos of all shapes, sizes and prices.

I asked the proprietor how much business he would be getting selling pianos in such a small town. He told me he was struggling to keep up with demand, and was servicing cities 400Km away interstate out of his little shop.

Interestingly he told me his main business was not coming from home owners but from schools, orchestras, churches, etc.

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#2896869 - 12/19/17 04:39 PM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: Wastrel]
slowtraveler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/07/13
Posts: 396
Loc: Boston, MA
Originally Posted By: Wastrel
He's probably a nice old guy who spent a long career rising to prominence in an industry that has for the most part dried up and blown away. I'm sure it's tough to give up the dream or acknowledge that his hard-won expertise really isn't all that relevant anymore.
Whoa. Now I'm bumming myself out...

I know, right? I get that feeling every time I have to stifle myself to keep from telling an anecdote that begins, "Back in the days of analog videotape..."



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#2896870 - 12/19/17 04:39 PM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: slowtraveler]
ElmerJFudd Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 11/30/14
Posts: 6165
Loc: USA, greater NY area
Originally Posted By: slowtraveler
Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
“Many cities, even ones that have very large populations, are down to one or two piano stores. They’re the only outlets for new pianos in these cities. The choices for consumers are very limited and dictated by a few very large manufacturers . More outlets in more areas will provide choices for people and, in addition, MI dealers and tech dealers will add to their revenue stream, a win-win situation!” DeFio explains.

The solution to lack of demand is... more supply! Genius. Evidently, that's an insight one can only acquire after 50 years of experience in selling pianos.


I don't think he means more supply, but rather out of sight out of mind. If you walk into a, typical big box MI there's plenty of digitals to choose from. No acoustics. Not even ones priced comparably to a Clavinova. You need to go to a specialty shop, an authorized Kawai or Yamaha authorized dealer. That's a different buying experience. Would having a Czech or China built acoustic on MI showroom floors change sales figures? Hard to say until they try I guess.
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#2896875 - 12/19/17 05:00 PM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: ElmerJFudd]
slowtraveler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/07/13
Posts: 396
Loc: Boston, MA
Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
I don't think he means more supply, but rather out of sight out of mind. If you walk into a, typical big box MI there's plenty of digitals to choose from. No acoustics. Not even ones priced comparably to a Clavinova. You need to go to a specialty shop, an authorized Kawai or Yamaha authorized dealer. That's a different buying experience. Would having a Czech or China built acoustic on MI showroom floors change sales figures? Hard to say until they try I guess.

Maybe. You would think a guy who's been in the business for 50 years might realize how unlikely it is, though. Every market trend, all the economic pressures on the MI retail business, every piece of available information about consumer preferences, suggests that "if you display it, they will come" is a really dumb bet.


Edited by slowtraveler (12/19/17 05:02 PM)
Edit Reason: deleted unwarranted snark

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#2896880 - 12/19/17 05:22 PM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: MathOfInsects]
JCRoswell Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/15/13
Posts: 176
Loc: Atlanta, Georgia
MOI has a good point about the quality. Part of the reason, I think, is that digital pianos sound pretty darned good now. When I was growing up in the 70s and 80s there wasn't even such a beast. And when they did come on the scene they didn't sound all that great. Now they sound pretty authentic for not much money.

As I teacher I generally recommend my students start with a digital piano. It just has so many advantages with the most obvious being price. (More money available to pay me for lessons. laugh) Yes, if they advance to a certain point then an acoustic piano is worth the investment, but by then you know your kid is serious.

And how many people have I met that had a piano in their home that no one could play and was just a piece of furniture? Gad, that makes me so sad that there's a nice piano basically in solitary confinement with no one to love it. I'd rather see no piano than to have one assume the role of coffee table.
_________________________
Live rig: Roland FA-08, Yamaha MOTIF ES 6, laptop for supplemental sounds.

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#2896885 - 12/19/17 05:35 PM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: JCRoswell]
JWhllr Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/30/15
Posts: 151
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
I work in a music shop in Melbourne, Australia, started out as a mum and dad first instrument etc shop, big home organ market, accordions etc. That transitioned into arranger keyboards and home electronic organs fell off the map. Now we're a full range shop, everything from a P45 to a Kronos to a CVP709. We specialise in secondhand Japanese Yamaha uprights and new Kawai uprights and business is steady on the acoustic piano front. We do have some schools that buy pianos from us, but mostly it's the local home market that we sell to. There is a large Asian community of piano owners and piano teachers in our area, so a lot of our business comes from word of mouth through that community. The threshold for high end digital vs acoustic is around about $5-6k. Above that, acoustic is an option, below that, digital. Brilliant condition 70s/80s Yamaha U3 and UX3 (and varients) are generally the most popular acoustics we do and we're fielding multiple enquiries about them every week.
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#2896889 - 12/19/17 05:57 PM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: JWhllr]
cphollis Offline
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Registered: 10/05/13
Posts: 2451
Loc: Massachussets, Florida
Yeah, well it was an article of faith when I pulled the trigger on a high-end AP a few years ago, fully realizing there would be ZERO resale interest down the road.

It's for me. It's not an investment.
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#2896898 - 12/19/17 07:19 PM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: JCRoswell]
Tom Williams Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 01/04/14
Posts: 849
Loc: West Virginia
Originally Posted By: JCRoswell
As I teacher I generally recommend my students start with a digital piano.[...] Yes, if they advance to a certain point then an acoustic piano is worth the investment, but by then you know your kid is serious.

A loud amen to the above.

I often frustrate piano teachers by recommending that their students' parents get a digital piano. I can think of no upright that I would choose over a sub-$1000 digital piano at this point.

And egad, my new PX-5S (a 5-year-old product) inspires me every time I turn it on.
_________________________
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PC361, PX-5S, AX-Synth
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#2896910 - 12/19/17 10:41 PM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: ElmerJFudd]
Mills Dude Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/02/15
Posts: 106
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
Inexpensive acoustic uprights are in reach of the new middle class in China. Many goods out of China are in their next stage of higher quality. I would not be surprised to see a Chinese piano brand someday rival Kawai or Yamaha.

Originally Posted By: cphollis
When I was growing up, almost every home had some sort of piano in it, almost a totem of middle-class success. ... Maybe that movie is playing again in China.


Been spending 50% of my time in China for the last few years, even have a Chinese girlfriend with 2 kids. In many ways this is correct. Often I think about how China reminds me of the USA 30-40 years ago, in some ways they are far ahead. The middle class is new and exploding, like the post-war boom years in the USA. Along with that comes disposable income and the desire for "totems" coupled with some of that "asian" drive for success that can be seen in Chinese Americans, albeit to a lesser degree as the ones who left China tend to be more affluent or educated.

Just down the road from my office is Shenzhen Book City, with 2 MI shops, both selling acoustic pianos (grands and uprights) along with digitals and other instruments. I don't see much business being transacted there and the prices are sky high for Yamaha acoustics, but they do get a decent amount of foot traffic and have survived the 2+ years I've been here.

There's a multi-level mall, Shenzhen Musical Instrument City, full of acoustic instruments some digital pianos and cheap Yamaha arrangers, mostly geared to the home/student market. I have no idea where to buy professional level keyboards/synths here.

I don't remember any of the Chinese brand pianos, but I've played a few. Don't really like them, but it's not much different than the generation of lesser quality brands and spinets that graced American homes during they heyday.

However, I still think an acoustic is out of reach for much of the middle class here, making digitals appealing. There's also the issue of space. Chinese people don't live in houses like in the USA, they live in multi-rise apartment buildings. Housing in a city like Shenzhen, and all across China, is becoming expensive. Smaller apartments, 400-500 sq ft. are the norm.

With that said, just last Sunday I was invited to dinner at my girlfriends sons Kung Fu coach apartment. There in the living room was an upright, don't remember the brand and needed a tune. Nobody in the house played, but they were very happy to have me play. Much happier when I play a few well-know classical pieces. They didn't care much about the jazz!

So, I'm not sure about the Van Cliburn moment happening in China, but there seems to be a up-tick in getting their kids into piano lessons along with a market for instruments. However, the children there seem to have as much, if not more "screen time" than the kids in the USA.

Even if the Chinese brand of pianos become competitive, will there even be a market in which to compete?
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#2896929 - 12/20/17 04:09 AM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: Mills Dude]
BuckW Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/20/17
Posts: 276
If you want a family piano to hopefully entice a kid why wouldn't you want a digital piano? More sounds, splits, layering, boilerplate sequencing, drum accompaniment. Wouldn't we have all liked to grow up with such in our home?

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#2896933 - 12/20/17 05:24 AM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: Mills Dude]
Synthoid Offline
10k Club

Registered: 12/04/03
Posts: 10256
Loc: Pennsylvania, USA
Originally Posted By: Mills Dude
I don't remember any of the Chinese brand pianos, but I've played a few.





I've played one of these. Just OK... I though the action was a bit soft.
_________________________
To stop the flow of music would be like the stopping of time itself, incredible and inconceivable.
-- Aaron Copland

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#2896937 - 12/20/17 06:06 AM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: Rally]
teashea Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/24/17
Posts: 196
Hammon B3's (and their cousins) are struggling to get sold. People ask $3000 but I don't see many confirmed sales. There are a bunch of them that go for free for maybe just go to the dump. Digital organs are so good now, that apart from the "feel" of a B3 (ie nostalgia and emotional attachment), there is little or no reason to have one.

There is an exception for the very top tier of players like Mitch Towne, Joey DeFranscesco, Pat Bianchi etc, who can appreciate the use of a real B3, that is only a handful. For everyone else, a digital organ is going to sound just as good.

For me, I am very interested in B3's - from a distance. I admire the mechanical and design aspects and enjoy learning about how they work - or don't. However, I have zero interest in owning own and would not take one for free.

As the old guys die off, B3's will fade even faster. There are very few younger players who care anything for a real B3. Look at the members of the B3 groups on Facebook - there are zero young members. The B3 restorers who offer their organs are sucking air - they sell very few. It costs more to restore a B3 than they can be sold for.

The clones have won overwhelmingly.
_________________________
Thomas Shea
Nebraska

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#2896942 - 12/20/17 06:57 AM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: teashea]
tarkus Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 05/04/04
Posts: 2116
Loc: MIAMI, Fl
I recall in the 1980s and early 90s that the Digital Piano and Sampled Piano were far from perfect. Digital sounded like a DX7 bell piano and sampled pianos sounded ok at middle C. Even the multi sampled zones were not very good. Panchromatic ambiance of an AP could not be faithfully reproduced. I was studying analog synthesis in college as an elective. My teacher used to work for Korg and other companies on the programming and performance aspects. We used to speculate as to when the acoustic piano would be faithfully replicated by digital.
My brother bought a clavinova grand (you put the discs in it) and it had some digital voices available to pair up with the acoustic piano. Very cool for its time. It just seemed that nobody was getting it right.
25 to 30 years later technology has surpassed expectations.
While I agree the acoustic piano similar to the parlor organ was a status symbol from the 1950's until the 1990s.
In my condo community one of the old folks heard I played and asked how I got the piano in the apartment. When I told him I had a synths and workstations he was like "wow... times have changed".
Most of the "old folks" were entering the workforce when Bob Moog split the music atom and 70s rock was acidic to their ears.

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#2896943 - 12/20/17 06:58 AM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: BuckW]
ElmerJFudd Offline
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Registered: 11/30/14
Posts: 6165
Loc: USA, greater NY area
The benefits of the digital piano are there, no doubt. But as mentioned earlier, there are some shortcomings, especially in "affordable" models. Actions are not of the same quality and the amp and speakers they include just can't compare to the sound of a harp, string and sound board.

Also, digital pianos are great in performances that include a PA system - modern mixed band settings. But they are pretty bad for acoustic performances with an unmic'd singer or choir - traditional classical settings where the music is meant to be made acoustically. Same for traditional jazz duo, combo settings. A grand, baby grand, full height studio upright just sounds right.
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#2896963 - 12/20/17 08:24 AM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: ElmerJFudd]
Joe Muscara Offline
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Registered: 02/21/05
Posts: 19591
Loc: Heaven, Hell, or Houston
There's a whole market for the modern version of player pianos. My wife works with a woman who owns one of these, and where she lives and all that takes into consideration space for the piano. If you get marketing from Steinway at all or subscribe to their YT channel, they are pushing their Spirio system. One skill piano techs need nowadays is the ability to install these kinds of systems.

Maybe this is why grands are selling steady or even slightly increasing. The other non-player reason is that if you're going to buy it as furniture or art, you're going to buy the grand. I've spoken with sales people who told the buyer, "don't forget the first tuning is free," and the buyer replied, "don't worry about it, no one is going to play it." Sad for the piano, but I figure if it helps keep the industry going, so be it. Also, maybe one of us can get it at a good price in a few years.

Another place I see pianos is hospital lobbies. I also see them in various "elder care" facilities.

The acoustic piano isn't dead. It's not everywhere I want it to be, nor everywhere they used to be, but they're out there.
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We are the music makers, and we are the dreamers of dreams — Willy Wonka

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#2896970 - 12/20/17 08:38 AM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: Joe Muscara]
Wastrel Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 05/13/09
Posts: 2584
Loc: Los Angeles
Originally Posted By: Joe BrokeIt
Another place I see pianos is hospital lobbies. I also see them in various "elder care" facilities.

Typically with a small plaque affixed saying "Donated by..."
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“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it’s time to pause and reflect.”
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#2896976 - 12/20/17 09:06 AM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: Wastrel]
Rusty Mike Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 10/05/10
Posts: 815
Loc: Central NJ
I think that, as a consumer, the acoustic piano represents a bit of a conundrum. They tend to be a "once in a lifetime" purchase due to their high cost. They each have a sound profile, and once they are in your home, your ability to change that sound profile is rather limited. And once you've bought it, your kind of stuck with it unless you want to take a loss.

The electronic instruments, as stated above, can make more than one sound, and quite often more than one type of acoustic piano sound. You can dial in what pleases your ear and playing style. If I want a brighter piano sound on my Roland RD-800, I turn a knob or press a button. Agreed, we are not 100% there yet with true emulation, but we are pretty darn close. And, if we want to move on to something else, and electronic instrument can be sold more quickly.

I've had a bit of a love/dislike relationship with my Pramberger PS-157 since I bought it 6 years ago. I love the ambience it brings, and the feel of the keys, but I'm not always happy with the sound. It's simply not dark and warm enough for me. I have it tuned at least once a year, and it's been voiced three times to kill some of the brightness. I tend to like it more right after the voicing, but it won't keep that warmer tone for long.

I guess I had a different set of ears when I bought it. I enjoy playing it, but I'm not inspired by it.

The point of it is that I simply have to live with it. I'm not willing to trade up to something else, as the cost would be significant. And if I do get to that point, there are always plenty of nice looking pianos on Craigslist to consider before going to a store. And it's really the glut of available for-sale-by-owner pianos that will keep me out of a store.

Of course, for someone looking for a nice piece of furniture, none of this matters.
_________________________
Mike from Central NJ
Tools: Ten fingers, two feet, middle-age brain, questionable judgement and taste
Toys: More gear than I could afford when I had talent and did this for a living

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#2896996 - 12/20/17 11:24 AM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: Rusty Mike]
JazzPiano88 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/16/15
Posts: 390
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Rusty Mike
I think that, as a consumer, the acoustic piano represents a bit of a conundrum. They tend to be a "once in a lifetime" purchase due to their high cost. They each have a sound profile, and once they are in your home, your ability to change that sound profile is rather limited. And once you've bought it, your kind of stuck with it unless you want to take a loss.

The nice thing about buying a used grand is that you can pick out a superb instrument that most people are assuredly going to be happy with for less than the price of a new car (assuming most new cars cost > $20k).
Mine may or may not be a once in a lifetime purchase. I'm really smitten by the Yamaha CX series and could easily do something I regret when I visit the showroom again smile.
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#2897000 - 12/20/17 11:37 AM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: teashea]
Outkaster Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 02/25/06
Posts: 6098
Loc: Rochester, NY
Originally Posted By: teashea
Hammon B3's (and their cousins) are struggling to get sold. People ask $3000 but I don't see many confirmed sales. There are a bunch of them that go for free for maybe just go to the dump. Digital organs are so good now, that apart from the "feel" of a B3 (ie nostalgia and emotional attachment), there is little or no reason to have one.

There is an exception for the very top tier of players like Mitch Towne, Joey DeFranscesco, Pat Bianchi etc, who can appreciate the use of a real B3, that is only a handful. For everyone else, a digital organ is going to sound just as good.

For me, I am very interested in B3's - from a distance. I admire the mechanical and design aspects and enjoy learning about how they work - or don't. However, I have zero interest in owning own and would not take one for free.

As the old guys die off, B3's will fade even faster. There are very few younger players who care anything for a real B3. Look at the members of the B3 groups on Facebook - there are zero young members. The B3 restorers who offer their organs are sucking air - they sell very few. It costs more to restore a B3 than they can be sold for.

The clones have won overwhelmingly.


That's just not correct? First of all spell Hammond correctly. I have been on music message boards since they practically started and I don't one person that wouldn't want a B-3. They don't go to the dumps also except in a few cases. When that happened it was because the military threw out a bunch of model G's from NCO clubs. Or people didn't know what they had other times. and that's not often. When you start making generalized statements be careful unless you have the background some of us have here. How do you know what they cost to repair? Are you a tech? Clones haven't won that's why their called clones.


Edited by Outkaster (12/20/17 08:20 PM)
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#2897006 - 12/20/17 12:14 PM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: Outkaster]
MathOfInsects Online   content
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 02/04/15
Posts: 3301
Loc: California
Originally Posted By: Outkaster
Originally Posted By: teashea
Hammon B3's (and their cousins) are struggling to get sold. People ask $3000 but I don't see many confirmed sales. There are a bunch of them that go for free for maybe just go to the dump. Digital organs are so good now, that apart from the "feel" of a B3 (ie nostalgia and emotional attachment), there is little or no reason to have one.

There is an exception for the very top tier of players like Mitch Towne, Joey DeFranscesco, Pat Bianchi etc, who can appreciate the use of a real B3, that is only a handful. For everyone else, a digital organ is going to sound just as good.

For me, I am very interested in B3's - from a distance. I admire the mechanical and design aspects and enjoy learning about how they work - or don't. However, I have zero interest in owning own and would not take one for free.

As the old guys die off, B3's will fade even faster. There are very few younger players who care anything for a real B3. Look at the members of the B3 groups on Facebook - there are zero young members. The B3 restorers who offer their organs are sucking air - they sell very few. It costs more to restore a B3 than they can be sold for.

The clones have won overwhelmingly.


That's just not correct?


Got to agree, this doesn't really ring true to me.
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#2897007 - 12/20/17 12:15 PM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: Wastrel]
MathOfInsects Online   content
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 02/04/15
Posts: 3301
Loc: California
Originally Posted By: Wastrel
Originally Posted By: Joe BrokeIt
Another place I see pianos is hospital lobbies. I also see them in various "elder care" facilities.

Typically with a small plaque affixed saying "Donated by..."


The residents or the piano?
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#2897038 - 12/20/17 03:43 PM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: MathOfInsects]
Wastrel Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 05/13/09
Posts: 2584
Loc: Los Angeles
Originally Posted By: MathOfInsects
The parlor piano died when Baldwin started using their factory to make coffins during WWII.

I'd heard they had a reputation for stiff action.
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“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it’s time to pause and reflect.”
-Mark Twain

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#2897062 - 12/20/17 06:09 PM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: Wastrel]
Ledbetter Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/26/14
Posts: 251
Loc: California
I bought my K. Kawai 6' from a doctor who spent the day with his church's choir master in L.A. Picking the best one he could find. It's from the late 70's, but plays like new. The dampers still have that crisp "new" sound. In his fifties, he planned to learn for the first time, and sold it when he and his wife moved into retirement housing.

I expect that the slowdown in new piano sales is related to the number of fine pianos available on the used market. They are a once for n a lifetime purchase and if taken care of, this one will outlive me, I'm sure. I already feel like I'm taking care of it for the next owner.
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Kawai KG-2C, Nord Electro 4D, 5D and Lead 2x, Moog Voyager, Some Slim Phatties, Roland Lucinda, Hohner Piano Melodica, Spacestation V3

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#2897068 - 12/20/17 07:11 PM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: Ledbetter]
BuckW Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/20/17
Posts: 276
We all get a little stiff once we quit breathing.

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#2897105 - 12/21/17 04:16 AM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: Wastrel]
Synthoid Offline
10k Club

Registered: 12/04/03
Posts: 10256
Loc: Pennsylvania, USA
Originally Posted By: Wastrel
Originally Posted By: MathOfInsects
The parlor piano died when Baldwin started using their factory to make coffins during WWII.

I'd heard they had a reputation for stiff action.


People were just dying to get a job with Baldwin.
_________________________
To stop the flow of music would be like the stopping of time itself, incredible and inconceivable.
-- Aaron Copland

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#2897110 - 12/21/17 04:47 AM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: Synthoid]
PianoMan51 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/02/10
Posts: 980
Loc: Cabin In The Woods
Originally Posted By: Synthoid
Originally Posted By: Wastrel
Originally Posted By: MathOfInsects
The parlor piano died when Baldwin started using their factory to make coffins during WWII.

I'd heard they had a reputation for stiff action.


People were just dying to get a job with Baldwin.


Can we shut the lid on this kind of talk, and just bury it?

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#2897119 - 12/21/17 06:06 AM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: PianoMan51]
Strays Dave Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/06/16
Posts: 100

I don't understand the obsession with acoustic pianos over digital pianos - if the digital piano is high quality. I keep making the point (when this issue comes up) that acoustic pianos are virtually never kept tuned often enough. And not keeping them tuned gives us that "mushy" (technical term) piano sound we've all heard so many times.

If you're puzzled about what that "mushy" sound is, compare virtually any acoustic piano with a digital. I expect digitals will get incrementally better over time. Two years ago I paid $5K for a Yamaha F01 - it was new but the model life was 7-8 years old. I bought it because it sounded like an authentic piano to my ears.

I play a lot of jazz piano, in addition to other styles. Those chord voicing with minor 2nds and diminished triads clustered against contrasting diminished triads (i.e. jazz piano chord voicings) sound as intended. Can't do that on most acoustic pianos - they sound like mush.
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#2897121 - 12/21/17 06:19 AM Re: The Great Piano Pushback [Re: PianoMan51]
Synthoid Offline
10k Club

Registered: 12/04/03
Posts: 10256
Loc: Pennsylvania, USA
Originally Posted By: PianoMan51

Can we shut the lid on this kind of talk, and just bury it?


Not until I get my new slab piano. laugh
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To stop the flow of music would be like the stopping of time itself, incredible and inconceivable.
-- Aaron Copland

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