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#2920841 - 04/11/18 12:23 PM Re: SP6 [Re: sleepngbear]
sleepngbear Offline
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Registered: 01/21/15
Posts: 570
Loc: RI
It has arrived. Immediate first impressions after a couple of hours of banging -- nice. The touch was my biggest concern, and it's one of the better stage pianos that I've played. Not quite as good as the CP4, but damn close. Just my opinion, better than the PX-5S.

AP sounds I'm going to need to work on a bit. The one I like the best so far is Punchy Edge -- it's bright and crisp without being painfully bright, and more 'alive' than the others. It's the one that moves me right now.

Navigating around is also going to take some work. It's not too horrible, but basic functions like split and layer are not easily found without the manual. Would also be nice if you could program the Variation button (maybe you can -- I haven't found that yet).

Looks like it has 4 zones available real time, which is already more than the CP4 offered.

Now I just need to get my chops back, because I've been playing on a semi-weighted SP4-7 for the last 4 months, and I'm already feeling it after just a couple of hours.

Long story short, nice sounds, and very nice action for such a lightweight package. If I ever get out gigging again, this is gonna be a dream to lug around.
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#2920913 - 04/11/18 09:26 PM Re: SP6 [Re: sleepngbear]
Dave Weiser Offline
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Registered: 06/30/09
Posts: 1291
Loc: Boston, MA
Originally Posted By: sleepngbear



Navigating around is also going to take some work. It's not too horrible, but basic functions like split and layer are not easily found without the manual.




Just under the screen is a very well labeled SPLIT/LAYER thingy.
Hit that. Then it tells you to hit ENTER for ether split or layer (use +/- to select).
Now you've got a split - just start scrolling through sounds.

The trick with these gadgets is to not tell yourself they're difficult. The UI and manual for this one were created by music guys, not by software engineers. wink If my drug-addled musician brain can get it anyone can!

Be sure to use the PDF version of the manual - it's constantly updated and even better, it's searchable. http://kurzweil.com/product/sp6/downloads/

Also keep the SP6 Knowledge Base page handy. Lots of quick tips, and I expect this will get updated as well. http://kurzweil.com/knowledgebase/sp6/

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#2920935 - 04/12/18 03:24 AM Re: SP6 [Re: Dave Weiser]
ewall08530 Offline
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Registered: 11/09/04
Posts: 692
+1 For going online and having the PDF manual. It really is very good for learning what isn't easily apparent to you.

My background is more with Korg, Roland and Nord. I've always struggled with
Yamaha design, UI's and manuels.

This is my first experience with Kurzweil since the early 80's and I've found the learning curve friendly so far.

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#2921390 - 04/14/18 06:53 AM Re: SP6 [Re: ewall08530]
sleepngbear Offline
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Registered: 01/21/15
Posts: 570
Loc: RI
Question for seasoned SP6 veterans (HA!): is there a way to change the pad/layer sound when the Variation button is active? I see where to change the pad volume in the Edit screen, but can't find anywhere to change what the Variation button does, whether it's a pad layer sound or to add an effect.


Edited by sleepngbear (04/14/18 06:55 AM)
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#2921471 - 04/14/18 07:48 PM Re: SP6 [Re: sleepngbear]
Dave Weiser Offline
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Originally Posted By: sleepngbear
Question for seasoned SP6 veterans (HA!): is there a way to change the pad/layer sound when the Variation button is active? I see where to change the pad volume in the Edit screen, but can't find anywhere to change what the Variation button does, whether it's a pad layer sound or to add an effect.


I suspect that the pad layer is built into the program in cases where a pad is assigned to the Variation button.

Solution: Create a Multi.

While playing your piano sound hit the Split/layer buttons. Select Layer.
Now scroll through the presets until you hit some pads, select the one you like, exit and save. I'm assuming that zone volume can be controlled by one of the knobs. (In a multi, the layers are called zones.)

I'll try to test tomorrow on my own unit.

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#2921537 - 04/15/18 09:42 AM Re: SP6 [Re: Dave Weiser]
sleepngbear Offline
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Registered: 01/21/15
Posts: 570
Loc: RI
Originally Posted By: Dave Weiser
Originally Posted By: sleepngbear
Question for seasoned SP6 veterans (HA!): is there a way to change the pad/layer sound when the Variation button is active? I see where to change the pad volume in the Edit screen, but can't find anywhere to change what the Variation button does, whether it's a pad layer sound or to add an effect.


I suspect that the pad layer is built into the program in cases where a pad is assigned to the Variation button.

Solution: Create a Multi.

While playing your piano sound hit the Split/layer buttons. Select Layer.
Now scroll through the presets until you hit some pads, select the one you like, exit and save. I'm assuming that zone volume can be controlled by one of the knobs. (In a multi, the layers are called zones.)

I'll try to test tomorrow on my own unit.

I think you're right, because I can't find a mention of it anywhere, and the Mod wheel just does what it always does with the main program voice. So this will force me to mess with Multi's, which I've been avoiding so far while sampling and practicing all the pianos.

Speaking of which, I am really getting to like the action. It's a tiny bit more 'thumpy', than other stage pianos, but really not bad at all. The thing I'm liking most is that I seem to be able to play faster and more precise than on other boards, evdn the beloved CP4. I'm also getting used to the 9' Grand that's sound more and more pleasing the more I play it and tweak the mixer EQ. Even excluding the price point, this is a very nice board.


Edited by sleepngbear (04/15/18 09:42 AM)
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#2921697 - 04/16/18 09:59 AM Re: SP6 [Re: voxpops]
Toano88 Offline
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Registered: 04/30/10
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Originally Posted By: voxpops
Dirshort, you could try the sax patches from the PC3 objects. I'd recommend downloading it anyway - there are some really useful sounds. It's a pain trying to keep it all straight in the SP6, if you don't know what you'll need beforehand, but worth the effort. You just need to download the last PC3 OS file from Kurzweil, and extract the Objects file.


I can't seem to see any references to show how to do this. Does this require the Desktop editor?
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#2922021 - Yesterday at 12:05 AM Re: SP6 [Re: Toano88]
voxpops Offline
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Registered: 11/30/12
Posts: 676
Originally Posted By: Toano88
Originally Posted By: voxpops
Dirshort, you could try the sax patches from the PC3 objects. I'd recommend downloading it anyway - there are some really useful sounds. It's a pain trying to keep it all straight in the SP6, if you don't know what you'll need beforehand, but worth the effort. You just need to download the last PC3 OS file from Kurzweil, and extract the Objects file.


I can't seem to see any references to show how to do this. Does this require the Desktop editor?


No need for the editor. Just download the V2.21 OS for the PC3 from Kurzweil here and then extract and open the folder. You'll find the Objects folder within. That's what you'll need for loading the files - either via USB stick or direct from your computer. You can choose to load the entire set (within remaining SP6 capacity) or select individual objects.

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#2922071 - Yesterday at 07:31 AM Re: SP6 [Re: voxpops]
Toano88 Offline
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Thanks voxpops I see the "PC3_V221_UPDATE/Object Lists" folder but it just contains 2 sub directories for BASE OBJECTS & KORE 64 OBJECTS. Inside these are just pdf files and an Excell spreadsheet. There are files in the top level PC3_V221_UPDATE/PC3OB212.PC3 & PC3_V221_UPDATE/XKORE225.PC3 can I assume its one of these files? I'm really only interested in the Solo Alto Sax sound.
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#2922082 - Yesterday at 07:56 AM Re: SP6 [Re: Toano88]
hipogrito Offline
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Registered: 05/13/11
Posts: 62
Loc: East Northport,NY
Hi,

If you take objects from the PC3 or KORE64 object files remember to SELECT the programs ONLY without dependents. Do not import the whole file with dependent sample objects because then you you would have those sample objects pointing to where the samples where in the PC3/KORE64 not where they are in the SP6. Those samples are there in the SP6, but in different addresses. So, don't import those sample objects.


Separate NOTE for those who don't know how Kurzweil objects work: sample objects that point to factory samples do NOT carry sample data, just header information.

Regards,
Fran

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#2922093 - Yesterday at 08:19 AM Re: SP6 [Re: hipogrito]
Toano88 Offline
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Registered: 04/30/10
Posts: 2416
Loc: Toano, Virginia, USA
Well that confuses me even more! I guess I will stick my Sonic Cell on top of it! Too bad the SP6 doesn't have a line in. I really only wanted the Kore64 Solo Alto Sax. This is why I never put any PC3LE sounds on my SP4-7 when I had it.
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#2922105 - Yesterday at 09:07 AM Re: SP6 [Re: Toano88]
AnotherScott Online   content
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So much potential in being able to bring PC3 sounds into an SP4, or PC3/Kore64 sounds into an Artis/SP6... but so unnecessarily complicated! They could use some specific documentation for doing these things and/or some youtube video tutorials.
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#2922112 - Yesterday at 09:40 AM Re: SP6 [Re: AnotherScott]
hipogrito Offline
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Registered: 05/13/11
Posts: 62
Loc: East Northport,NY
Hi,

Importing your user PC3 programs is trivial. You have your PC3 file with your PC3 programs, just put them in a thumb drive or virtual PC on your computer and load them in. That's it. So, if you have a PC3 and you have all your programs saved, you can load them into your new SP6. That's the purpose.


What it's described here is a hack. People are going to the PC3 website product in the kurzweil.com website and getting the object set that can only be installed on the PC3 and then trying to load them on the Forte, Forte SE or SP6. Which is something those files were never intended to be (heck, they are older than those products!).

So, if a hack is cumbersome, which isn't that much, only open the file and select the programs (not too difficult), it's because it's a hack nonetheless. That's why there isn't any Kurzweil documentation to do anything like that because that wasn't the intention of those files.

Regards,
Fran

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#2922125 - Yesterday at 10:27 AM Re: SP6 [Re: hipogrito]
Toano88 Offline
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Posts: 2416
Loc: Toano, Virginia, USA
Thanks Fran, I guess I will just request the sound on ksetlist from someone who has a PC3 with KORE64. Hopefully someone can help me.
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#2922128 - Yesterday at 10:41 AM Re: SP6 [Re: Toano88]
hipogrito Offline
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Registered: 05/13/11
Posts: 62
Loc: East Northport,NY
I'll upload that sound in there.

Regards,
Fran

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#2922132 - Yesterday at 10:52 AM Re: SP6 [Re: hipogrito]
Toano88 Offline
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Registered: 04/30/10
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Thank you very much!!
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#2922145 - Yesterday at 11:38 AM Re: SP6 [Re: hipogrito]
AnotherScott Online   content
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Originally Posted By: hipogrito
What it's described here is a hack....That's why there isn't any Kurzweil documentation to do anything like that because that wasn't the intention of those files.

Okay, but I think it's too bad Kurz treats it as a hack instead of as a feature.
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#2922238 - Yesterday at 06:49 PM Re: SP6 [Re: AnotherScott]
Dave Weiser Offline
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Registered: 06/30/09
Posts: 1291
Loc: Boston, MA
Originally Posted By: AnotherScott
Originally Posted By: hipogrito
What it's described here is a hack....That's why there isn't any Kurzweil documentation to do anything like that because that wasn't the intention of those files.

Okay, but I think it's too bad Kurz treats it as a hack instead of as a feature.


As someone who used to work at Kurz R&D, I would humbly submit that maybe there's a better way to look at it. I see functionality like this and don't think "it's too bad". I'd characterize it as a freaking *miracle* that Kurz allows this kind of stuff at all and that it works as well as it does. smile

They're a tiny engineering group that's very overworked, in a crap low-volume industry that makes no money, putting in extra time, often working late nights to add extra features and perks in places where larger companies would not.

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#2922259 - Yesterday at 08:24 PM Re: SP6 [Re: Dave Weiser]
ElmerJFudd Offline
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And they thrive on the notion that they’re building $£!+ musicians would want to play. And nothing gives them more personal satisfaction than seeing that happen.
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#2922283 - Today at 02:12 AM Re: SP6 [Re: Toano88]
voxpops Offline
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Registered: 11/30/12
Posts: 676
Originally Posted By: Toano88
Thanks voxpops I see the "PC3_V221_UPDATE/Object Lists" folder but it just contains 2 sub directories for BASE OBJECTS & KORE 64 OBJECTS. Inside these are just pdf files and an Excell spreadsheet. There are files in the top level PC3_V221_UPDATE/PC3OB212.PC3 & PC3_V221_UPDATE/XKORE225.PC3 can I assume its one of these files? I'm really only interested in the Solo Alto Sax sound.

Sorry, I should have said Objects file (not folder): PC3OB212.PC3

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#2922306 - Today at 06:39 AM Re: SP6 [Re: Dave Weiser]
AnotherScott Online   content
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Registered: 10/19/09
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Originally Posted By: Dave Weiser
Originally Posted By: AnotherScott
Originally Posted By: hipogrito
What it's described here is a hack....That's why there isn't any Kurzweil documentation to do anything like that because that wasn't the intention of those files.

Okay, but I think it's too bad Kurz treats it as a hack instead of as a feature.

As someone who used to work at Kurz R&D, I would humbly submit that maybe there's a better way to look at it. I see functionality like this and don't think "it's too bad". I'd characterize it as a freaking *miracle* that Kurz allows this kind of stuff at all and that it works as well as it does. smile

They're a tiny engineering group that's very overworked, in a crap low-volume industry that makes no money, putting in extra time, often working late nights to add extra features and perks in places where larger companies would not.

I'm sorry if I wasn't clear, I'm not saying "too bad" about the functionality, I'm talking what they (don't) do with it. Even without doing any more engineering, the functionality actually already exists, and works in the vast majority of cases, so I think it's a shame that from a marketing point of view, Kurz seems to have decided that this should not be an official feature, not mentioned on the products' web pages or in their manuals, not used as a selling point to help sell more boards (as opposed to Nord and Roland/Axial who make a big deal of being able to load in additional factory sounds), and not documented in any official manner which could make it easier for people to do. (There could still be disclaimers about what is known to work well vs. areas that are not officially supported or might need further user tweaking, if need be). So, I think it's too bad they look at this existing useful function as a hack and not a feature, because I think the other approach could make current owners happier AND help Kurz sell more boards, without requiring additional engineering, just some documentation and web site updating.
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#2922314 - Today at 07:38 AM Re: SP6 [Re: AnotherScott]
Dave Weiser Offline
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Registered: 06/30/09
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Originally Posted By: AnotherScott
Originally Posted By: Dave Weiser
Originally Posted By: AnotherScott
[quote=hipogrito]What it's described here is a hack....That's why there isn't any Kurzweil documentation to do anything like that because that wasn't the intention of those files.

Okay, but I think it's too bad Kurz treats it as a hack instead of as a feature.

As someone who used to work at Kurz R&D, I would humbly submit that maybe there's a better way to look at it. I see functionality like this and don't think "it's too bad". I'd characterize it as a freaking *miracle* that Kurz allows this kind of stuff at all and that it works as well as it does. smile

They're a tiny engineering group that's very overworked, in a crap low-volume industry that makes no money, putting in extra time, often working late nights to add extra features and perks in places where larger companies would not.

I'm sorry if I wasn't clear, I'm not saying "too bad" about the functionality, I'm talking what they (don't) do with it. Even without doing any more engineering, the functionality actually already exists, and works in the vast majority of cases, so I think it's a shame that from a marketing point of view, Kurz seems to have decided that this should not be an official feature, not mentioned on the products' web pages or in their manuals, not used as a selling point to help sell more boards (as opposed to Nord and Roland/Axial who make a big deal of being able to load in additional factory sounds), and not documented in any official manner which could make it easier for people to do. (There could still be disclaimers about what is known to work well vs. areas that are not officially supported or might need further user tweaking, if need be). So, I think it's too bad they look at this existing useful function as a hack and not a feature, because I think the other approach could make current owners happier AND help Kurz sell more boards, without requiring additional engineering, just some documentation and web site updating. [/quote]


"Load programs from the Forte, Forte SE and PC3 family" is in the second bullet point on the SP6 main page on their website.

One thing they've done that I really like is the Sound Banks section on the Forte page. http://kurzweil.com/product/forte/downloads/
They've been taking small subsets of the large PC3 sound set, packaging and releasing them in groups of 10 or so. Much easier to digest and deal with than a huge file with 1000+ presets.

It makes sense that they would start this sort of thing first with the flagship Forte and not the $1300 stage piano. But in time I hope to see this sort of thing done for the SP6. In the meantime I believe the Forte Sound banks should load nicely into the SP6 as none of them use the larger "Forte-only" samples.

In addition to the Forte Sound Banks, I always point Kurz users to the Ksetlist.com site, an entire website set up by the Kurz guys to be a repository of free sounds for users to download and swap. It's a perfect example of a small company adding value for customers by enabling/empowering their own user community.


Edited by Dave Weiser (Today at 07:40 AM)

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#2922323 - Today at 08:16 AM Re: SP6 [Re: Dave Weiser]
AnotherScott Online   content
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Originally Posted By: Dave Weiser
"Load programs from the Forte, Forte SE and PC3 family" is in the second bullet point on the SP6 main page on their website.

Ah! Yup there it is, complete with the reasonable disclaimer, "*(some restrictions apply)". So then maybe it is a feature and not a hack... which brings me back to thinking it should be better documented, rather than using as an excuse for no documentation that it's a hack and not a feature. Unless I missed something, nothing on the SP6 downloads or support tabs nor in the SP6 manual tells you where to find these programs, the exact procedure for selecting and loading the desired sounds, or what kinds of restrictions one might run into.

I agree the packaging of intelligently grouped subsets is a nice enhancement to the idea. And that ksetlist is another good resource, though I suspect that most purchasers are unaware of it.
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#2922329 - Today at 08:39 AM Re: SP6 [Re: AnotherScott]
Toano88 Offline
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Registered: 04/30/10
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I found ksetlist to be quite useful and the file than Fran posted worked perfectly. As did Dave W's sounds. I'm quite happy for now. I haven't gigged with it yet. But plan on using it for some gigs in the next couple weeks. I think as the SP6 is new there will eventually be more sounds ready to go. Kurzweil did put additional sound banks for download on their site for the SP4-7. Which by the way wasn't a bad board. I just didn't get along with the triple strike piano and preferred a fully weighted action. The only piano on the SP4-7 I could stomach was the Horowitz Grand.


Edited by Toano88 (Today at 08:40 AM)
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#2922335 - Today at 09:02 AM Re: SP6 [Re: Toano88]
AnotherScott Online   content
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Originally Posted By: Toano88
the SP4-7. Which by the way wasn't a bad board. I just didn't get along with the triple strike piano and preferred a fully weighted action.

The SP4-7 had a great form factor, and--once they got away from the shaper edged keys--a surprisingly decent action (better than the comparably priced semi-weighted boards from Korg, Roland, or Yamaha; and 76 keys besides). It would be nice to see an updated SP4-7 with maybe Artis-level sounds and some improvements to the interface, where I think it fell down a bit. (Nice patch selection scheme, though.)
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#2922342 - Today at 09:15 AM Re: SP6 [Re: AnotherScott]
Toano88 Offline
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Originally Posted By: AnotherScott
The SP4-7 had a great form factor, and--once they got away from the shaper edged keys--a surprisingly decent action (better than the comparably priced semi-weighted boards from Korg, Roland, or Yamaha; and 76 keys besides).


I wish my VR-09 had those keys! I haven't owned any high-end boards generally 1500 is about my limit. so I can safely say the SP4-7 has best semi-weighted action I have played. I was also looking at the Grand Stage, when I ordered the SP6. I just couldn't justify the price on the meager gigs I have been getting lately! The SP6 filled a sweet spot for weight, sounds & price!
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#2922388 - Today at 11:47 AM Re: SP6 [Re: Toano88]
Marillo Online   content
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Registered: 01/04/05
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As well as the older Triple Strike, the other thing the SP4-7 was weaker on was its leslie implementation on the KB3. The SP6 really does smoke it in all areas.

I agree the form factor of the SP4-7 was great though, and since the SP6 is apparently one of Kurzweil's best-ever selling keyboards, perhaps they'll eventually produce a 76-key version?

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#2922394 - Today at 12:31 PM Re: SP6 [Re: Marillo]
MAJUSCULE Offline
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Registered: 06/10/09
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Still waiting for canadian availability... sleep

Edit: Not yet listed on L&M's website, but apparently the distributor has received some and it's in the internal system. Could potentially get one within a couple weeks of ordering... HMMMMM. snax snax snax


Edited by MAJUSCULE (Today at 12:42 PM)
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