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#2883996 - 10/09/17 04:12 AM Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO--
whitefang Offline
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While surfing around on the section of channels on my cable TV's "Music Choice" I stopped to listen to the "Solid Gold" channel and after the end of a song I came in at the end of, they started playing one by The Righteous Brothers. When you have any of these channels on, there's a graphic at the bottom of the screen that lets you know the song, artist and year the song was released. To the left(in some cases) is a box called "Did You Know?" where they post bits of trivia stuff of interest, or maybe no interest....anyway....

For one bit of time, this box mentioned that the Righteous Brothers music was known as "Blue Eyed Soul" rolleyes

I always hated that "label". "Blue Eyed Soul". What's THAT supposed to mean? I take it they mean "Soul" music done by white guys. Which in many cases sounds no different than "Soul" music. Stinks of racism to me. I mean, they don't call it "Blue Eyed Jazz", do they? Or "Blue Eyed Blues"? So, if "Soul" is a specific genre, why not just refer to it as THAT? Why differentiate between who does it? After all, Jimi Hendrix wasn't playing "Brown Eyed Rock", was he? Or maybe "Urban" or "Uptown Rock"? wink

I know I'm starting this thread on only that shoestring, but there might be other such "labels" out there that some of you might also think are silly, or just dumb. I'd be interested.
Whitefang
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#2884318 - 10/10/17 05:58 PM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: whitefang]
picker Offline
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Man, why is everybody so obsessed with race these days?
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#2884356 - 10/11/17 04:21 AM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: picker]
Eric Iverson Offline
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Partially, it's the political climate these days, I think.
But I'm perfectly willing to give it a rest for a while.......
Let's talk about science fiction instead. What race of aliens do you like best, Mike? LOL

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#2884357 - 10/11/17 04:36 AM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: picker]
whitefang Offline
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Race "these days"? Yeah, getting to be a drag. But the term "Blue Eyed Soul" has been used for decades. Possibly, but I can't be sure, not meant to be derogatory, but certainly to point out the difference between the black and white performers. Almost like saying, "There's a BIG difference between how WE do it, and how THEY sound, and you all better make a CHOICE!" It harkens back to the days when Elvis was rejected by some listeners and producers/promoters alike because they either thought he "sounded colored" or was doing music they stupidly associated with black people only. And as was pointed out in another thread, Jimi Hendrix was rejected by many African-Americans because they saw him as doing "Honky" music. But wiser heads only heard him doing "Rock" music and freely enjoyed how good it was.

"Bubblegum" is another of those stupid labels, as if it's advisable that ANYONE over a certain age SHOULDN'T bother with listening or liking a particular sound of music.
Whitefang
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#2886402 - 10/21/17 07:33 PM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: whitefang]
hurricane hugo Offline
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There's "Northern Soul," too. Big Northern Soul/Motown convention happening here in Detroit right now, as a matter of fact.
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#2886424 - 10/22/17 04:16 AM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: whitefang]
skipclone 1 Offline
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Anything with `core` as a suffix. Grindcore, Emocore, for that matter hardcore-that may have been what started it. WT physical F is the `core` supposed to mean? Drop it, then step on it.
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#2886428 - 10/22/17 04:52 AM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: skipclone 1]
whitefang Offline
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Well Skip, "hardcore" can have different meanings.....

1. Intensely loyal; die hard.
2. Stubbornly resistant to change. Or...
3. Extremely graphic or explicit.

So "Grindcore" just seems like someone tried to be clever with language. But of course, "trying" doesn't always mean succeeding. wink

While I'm at it I'll add "Smooth Jazz", which sounds a lot like just jazz to me. Imagine these kind of tags slapped on other genres....

Like, "Smooth folk", or, "Baroquecore". So, let's all get together and listen to some "Southeastern Blues". wink
Whitefang



Edited by whitefang (10/22/17 05:04 AM)
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#2886468 - 10/22/17 11:16 AM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: whitefang]
Scott Fraser Offline
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Originally Posted By: whitefang
While I'm at it I'll add "Smooth Jazz", which sounds a lot like just jazz to me.
Whitefang


Smooth Jazz actually fairly accurately refers to a pretty specific genre of music, which I would describe as mostly instrumental pop with just a smidgeon of jazz harmony & melodicism, but absolutely none of jazz's characteristic & genre defining triplet based rhythmic propulsion. Among real jazz players 'smooth jazz' is not considered to be a subcategory of jazz.
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#2886500 - 10/22/17 02:43 PM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: Scott Fraser]
whitefang Offline
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"What is jazz" has been debated amongst jazzmen for decades without any group or gathering arriving at any concensus. At different times in it's history, "Bebop", "Cool" and other forms of jazz have been rejected as "real" jazz by top "jazzmen" of the times. I'm not offering any defense of anyone's particular brand of jazz here. Just forwarding an observation.
Whitefang
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#2886528 - 10/22/17 05:19 PM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: whitefang]
Scott Fraser Offline
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Originally Posted By: whitefang
"What is jazz" has been debated amongst jazzmen for decades without any group or gathering arriving at any concensus. At different times in it's history, "Bebop", "Cool" and other forms of jazz have been rejected as "real" jazz by top "jazzmen" of the times. I'm not offering any defense of anyone's particular brand of jazz here. Just forwarding an observation.
Whitefang


Sure, we're not here to debate "what is jazz?" But I just wanted to point out that 'smooth jazz' is not an ill-defined maybe-category. It really is a category. It's just that what defines it largely is outside the definition of the bigger category called "Jazz".
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#2886579 - 10/23/17 04:45 AM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: Scott Fraser]
whitefang Offline
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Almost sounds like you're OK with terms like "Blue Eyed Soul", "Bubble Gum" "Grindcore" and crap like that.
Whitefang
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#2886589 - 10/23/17 06:04 AM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: whitefang]
Happy Birthday Winston Psmith Offline
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My personal favorite is "Psycho-billy", a sub-genre of "Rock-A-billy." If you don't know what it is, you really should find out . . .



Edited by Winston Psmith (10/23/17 06:06 AM)
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#2886626 - 10/23/17 09:28 AM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: whitefang]
Scott Fraser Offline
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Originally Posted By: whitefang
Almost sounds like you're OK with terms like "Blue Eyed Soul", "Bubble Gum" "Grindcore" and crap like that.
Whitefang


I don't know why it would sound like that. Pointing out that 'Smooth Jazz' is in fact an identifiable genre with readily definable characteristics doesn't really have any bearing on anything else I'm "OK with". But I'm pretty sure I could I could identify with 100% accuracy whether a given tune is bubble gum or not. What is truly & fully silly, though, is the attempt to distinguish various flavors of techno into actually definable subgenres.
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#2886642 - 10/23/17 11:00 AM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: Scott Fraser]
whitefang Offline
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All of it; "Folk rock"; "Hard rock";, "Soft rock"; "Bubble gum"; is, as Billy Joel said, "Still rock'n'roll to me." wink

And all these silly labels( "Smooth jazz" included) only attempt to separate differing approaches to presentation of particular songs within the genres rather than a specific genre altogether.

Like Winston's entry up there. I remember those guys. Just another rock'n'roll band with a quirky approach and song subject matter. I remember a CREEM magazine writer, being facetious, referred to the highly sexual content in Tim Buckley's songs in "Greetings From L.A." as being(pardon French please) "f***-Rock". wink
Whitefang (Man, I HATE Otto censor)


Edited by whitefang (10/23/17 11:02 AM)
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#2886676 - 10/23/17 01:55 PM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: whitefang]
Scott Fraser Offline
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Originally Posted By: whitefang
All of it; "Folk rock"; "Hard rock";, "Soft rock"; "Bubble gum"; is, as Billy Joel said, "Still rock'n'roll to me." wink


All dogs, Chihuahuas, Dachshunds, Great Danes are basically the same thing thing, right? No real difference?

Quote:
And all these silly labels( "Smooth jazz" included) only attempt to separate differing approaches to presentation of particular songs within the genres rather than a specific genre altogether.


I think there are some very specific genre distinctions, not silly, but real. There are also some attempts at distinction which don't rise to the standard of genre definition.
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#2886689 - 10/23/17 02:53 PM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: Scott Fraser]
whitefang Offline
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Still, it seems like making distinctions between some Americans from others because some might have Italian or German ancestry, but essentially they're ALL Americans.
Whitefang
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#2886702 - 10/23/17 07:14 PM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: whitefang]
Sharkman Offline
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How about my least favorite label, acid rock? I've heard people call Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, and AC/DC "acid rock". I thought to myself "Are you on acid?" How do you define acid rock? Does it even deserve a definition?
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#2886723 - 10/24/17 03:56 AM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: Sharkman]
whitefang Offline
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I first heard "Acid-Rock" in referrence to Jimi Hendrix. And Led Zeppelin along with other groups in their "ilk", were included in one of those old K-TEL (remember them?) LP compilations that was titled "Heavy Metal". The first time I heard THAT term used in reference to some kind of genre. And that was about the early '70's. And not even called that by those who were playing it! grin
Whitefang
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#2886772 - 10/24/17 08:22 AM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: Sharkman]
Happy Birthday Winston Psmith Offline
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Originally Posted By: Sharkman
How about my least favorite label, acid rock? I've heard people call Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, and AC/DC "acid rock". I thought to myself "Are you on acid?" How do you define acid rock? Does it even deserve a definition?


Oh, man, I remember this one. First it was "Acid Rock" (whatever that really was?), then "Hard Rock", and eventually we got to "Heavy Metal". It was less about Musicians defining themselves, than the media looking for labels.

Prog Rock went through the same thing, starting out as either "Art Rock" or "Symphonic Rock", before getting tagged as "Progressive Rock". I also remember people seriously arguing about whether a band was Punk, or New Wave?!?!?!?!

Like I said, it's not about Musicians defining themselves, or their Music, it's about media labels and marketing. "Hey, if you liked X Rock, you'll really love K Rock! Get some today!"

Have any of us ever bought an album, just because it was supposedly whatever flavor or label was being marketed to us at the time, Punk, Prog, Metal, Pop, What-have-you? It's all silliness . . .
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#2886834 - 10/24/17 02:31 PM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: Winston Psmith]
whitefang Offline
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Any of US? I don't know. But I DO know some who would. Even if they grudgingly admitted they liked some song(s) in some other genre or with some other "tag" on them, they'd deny themselves the pleasure of owning the LP of it because they're afraid of what some of their friends might say.

Was a time in my ignorant youth that I thought along the same lines. But with time and age I figured it was better and more satisfying to take music piece by piece and screw the labels. Now mind you, I store my recordings according to genre and whatever, and the result is that I required three shelving units of five shelves each to fit them all.....

And that's not even including the VINYL. wink
Whitefang


Edited by whitefang (10/24/17 02:32 PM)
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#2886837 - 10/24/17 02:42 PM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: Winston Psmith]
Scott Fraser Offline
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Originally Posted By: Winston Psmith
Have any of us ever bought an album, just because it was supposedly whatever flavor or label was being marketed to us at the time, Punk, Prog, Metal, Pop, What-have-you? It's all silliness . . .


No, but I did buy albums based on the cover. "These guys look really cool." I ended up hearing a lot of stuff I would have missed otherwise due to that. Like Spooky Tooth.

The labels can be useful in sorting out just what is being talked about. I frequently am conversing with friends in which a recently heard concert is discussed. "It's kind of like free jazz violin on top of a Celtic tinged blues rock rhythm section." That actually gives me a pretty good idea of what it was & whether I'm interested.
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#2886927 - 10/25/17 05:25 AM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: Scott Fraser]
whitefang Offline
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grin
A few of my still all time favorite LPs were bought because the cover was "cool".

Like SPIRIT's first LP. But over time I found their subsequent LPs in the "Rock and Roll" bins at the store. wink
Whitefang
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#2886973 - 10/25/17 08:13 AM Re: Semi OT: Silly(or just dumb) music "labels" IYO-- [Re: whitefang]
Larryz Offline
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_rock_genres <---here's the list of rock genres... cool
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