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#2878559 - 09/12/17 06:02 AM Yes Shows Cancelled... Sad Story
Synthoid Offline
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Registered: 12/04/03
Posts: 9669
Loc: Pennsylvania, USA
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#2878564 - 09/12/17 06:14 AM Re: Yes Shows Cancelled... Sad Story [Re: Synthoid]
richforman Offline
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Registered: 02/05/10
Posts: 1078
Loc: Long Island, NY
Yes, besides being sad for Steve, I'm bummed because they were scheduled to play a small theatre 10 minutes from my house next week, I had been planning to snag a single and go check it out. Have seen this lineup a few times before and they're really not my favorite but so close to home I couldn't resist.
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#2878578 - 09/12/17 07:48 AM Re: Yes Shows Cancelled... Sad Story [Re: richforman]
GRollins Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/01/17
Posts: 353
I saw (this lineup of) Yes in early August. It was a good show. I had forgotten how powerful a drummer Carl Palmer is--when he hits a drum, it has been well and thoroughly hit. He still plays 95% as fast as he did when I last saw ELP in the '70s. Impressive. I'd never seen Todd Rundgren before, but enjoyed his set. I hadn't seen Yes since the Relayer tour. I've seen disparaging remarks about Steve Howe on this and other forums (fora, if you prefer), but when I'm wearing my guitarist's hat, he's a hero to me. I thought he played well and was far more physically active than you would expect from a 70 year-old man.

Now, I'll be the first to admit that I'd like to have seen Rick Wakeman on keyboards, as the core of Yes--at least for me--was always Howe, Squire, and Wakeman, but Chris is dead and politics seems to be a problem for the two versions of Yes. There's nothing I can do about that, so I went to see this version.

Incidentally, I thought Jon Davison did a fine job of vocals. I've seen a lot of negative stuff about him, as well. Alan White, it seems, had back surgery and his recovery has been problematic. He played some songs, but not others. Apparently he was in a great deal of pain. Howe's son, whose name escapes me at this moment (not the one who died) played drums when Alan couldn't. The one who was disappointing to me was Billy Sherwood. Much is made of his having been personally chosen by Chris Squire to be his successor. Fair enough. But bass is my "native instrument," so to speak, and Chris Squire was a huge influence on my playing style. I dunno...I just didn't feel that Sherwood had "it," if you follow what I mean. Granted, I was on the opposite side of the stage from him and perhaps I didn't hear everything clearly, but it just didn't seem to me that he was doing what needed doing.

Okay, enough of the rest of the band. This being a keyboard forum, people will want to hear about Geoff Downes. My feeling is that he did a workman-like job of the keyboard parts, but given that they were playing earlier (largely Wakeman era) material, I thought he could have done a better job. For one thing, even when he played the same notes, a lot of the voicings were off, to my ears. If Wakeman played, say, Moog, and Downes played the same riff as an organ voice, for example, it's going to sound wrong. Perhaps it's a rebellious, competitive thing. "I'm not going to sound like 'the other guy' because we're on the outs." I couldn't say.

I'd like to extend my sympathies to Steve Howe and others hurting due to Virgil's death.

Grey
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#2878592 - 09/12/17 08:30 AM Re: Yes Shows Cancelled... Sad Story [Re: GRollins]
richforman Offline
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Registered: 02/05/10
Posts: 1078
Loc: Long Island, NY
I'm surprised you don't consider Jon Anderson part of "the core of Yes"; to me, his voice and spirit is the single most important ingredient to their music's magic. But I do think you should give your guitarist back his hat!
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Rich Forman
Yamaha MOXF8, Korg Kronos 2-61, Roland Fantom X7, Ferrofish B4000+ organ module, Roland VR-09, EV ZLX12P, K&M Spider Pro stand,
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#2878598 - 09/12/17 08:51 AM Re: Yes Shows Cancelled... Sad Story [Re: richforman]
GRollins Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/01/17
Posts: 353
A few unrelated points:

It's nothing against Jon Anderson; it's that Jon Davison does a damned good job of hitting the same notes with the same pitch, inflection, etc. He's also a better showman than Anderson, who always just stood there, either singing or banging on a tambourine.

I've seen things recently that seem to indicate that Yes was "Anderson's band." That strikes me as odd, given that back in the day it was always portrayed as Anderson & Squire with others rotating in and out. Revisionist history? The truth coming out? Was I simply not seeing the same information as others? I don't know. Some the things I've seen indicate that Anderson was (is?) a bit of a prick, even to the point of violence against band members. (He hit Chris after accusing him of hitting a wrong note, amongst other things.) Wow. Never heard that before.

Though I've sung vocals, I don't identify with the whole vocal thing. I'm more instrumentally oriented. That's another part of it. Add to that the fact that I could never make hide nor hair of the lyrics. Eventually, I just started treating the vocals as another instrumental part (like an elaborate Mellotron track).

I don't have a guitarist...that's why I'm having to play guitar (and keyboards, too, for that matter--I'd be glad to turn keys over to a "real" keyboard player if I could only find one). If I find a guitarist who wants to do original stuff, he can have the guitar hat...and vocals, too, if he's up for it. Or she, for that matter. I'm not picky.

Grey
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#2878610 - 09/12/17 09:40 AM Re: Yes Shows Cancelled... Sad Story [Re: GRollins]
Legatoboy Offline
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Registered: 08/11/06
Posts: 3592
Loc: Huntington Sta., New York (LI)
RIP Virgil.
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#2878626 - 09/12/17 10:36 AM Re: Yes Shows Cancelled... Sad Story [Re: Legatoboy]
richforman Offline
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Registered: 02/05/10
Posts: 1078
Loc: Long Island, NY
GRollins - just to clarify, I was only/totally making a goofy joke about the "guitarist's hat," no actual meaning behind it. You originally said, "but when I'm wearing my guitarist's hat," of course I knew what you meant but just made a silly joke about it. Similarly I've always told myself the same joke in my head every time I've heard Billy Joel sing "...when I wore a younger man's clothes." (Why were you wearing this guy's clothes!)
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Yamaha MOXF8, Korg Kronos 2-61, Roland Fantom X7, Ferrofish B4000+ organ module, Roland VR-09, EV ZLX12P, K&M Spider Pro stand,
Yamaha S80, Korg Trinity Plus


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#2878653 - 09/12/17 01:01 PM Re: Yes Shows Cancelled... Sad Story [Re: richforman]
GRollins Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/01/17
Posts: 353
Rich,
I knew you were joking. My response was in the vein of "woe is me," given that I'm playing at chief cook & bottle washer as I attempt to get this racket in my head out into the real world so it will leave me alone. I'm playing instruments I have no business playing (at least until I've had sufficient time to practice and get better...). No offense was taken.

And I've always loved the "...when I wore a younger man's clothes" line. I don't count Billy Joel as an influence, but he's quiet clever with his lyrics and I adored his '70s era music. The Stranger and 52nd Street would be candidates for desert island music for me. Not a bad track on either album.

I've never thought of that line in the way that you're indicating, but now that you've mentioned it, I'm suddenly thinking "the child is father to the man," which REALLY screws up the imagery. So now he's wearing his father's clothing, which is actually his, except that that was then and this is now, and he's really older than he was, and...aaargh!

I think I just fell down a rabbit hole.

Grey
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#2878751 - 09/12/17 07:16 PM Re: Yes Shows Cancelled... Sad Story [Re: GRollins]
BuckW Offline
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Registered: 06/20/17
Posts: 103
I always preferred Bill Bruford on drums.

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#2878752 - 09/12/17 07:25 PM Re: Yes Shows Cancelled... Sad Story [Re: BuckW]
GRollins Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/01/17
Posts: 353
Me too. Alan White is a straight-ahead 4/4 rock drummer. Bruford always did the unexpected and made it work, although I've read that he was prone to changing things during live shows and throwing everyone off because he decided to change a fill.

Grey
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I'm not interested in someone's ability to program. I'm interested in their ability to compose and play.

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#2878892 - 09/13/17 11:07 AM Re: Yes Shows Cancelled... Sad Story [Re: GRollins]
dje31 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/09/13
Posts: 187
In case anyone is interested, Virgil did the album Remixes, which is a funky compilation and alternate take of the Yes catalog...Yes done in techno, which, IMHO, actually works, surprisingly well.

I've played it for non-Yes fans, who found it interesting, even leading one to then became a fan of the original material.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yes_Remixes


Edited by dje31 (09/13/17 11:17 AM)

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#2878950 - 09/13/17 04:05 PM Re: Yes Shows Cancelled... Sad Story [Re: dje31]
JohnH Offline
Platinum Member

Registered: 05/05/06
Posts: 1299
Unfortunately missed my turn with Wakeman and recently too. Really enjoyed the Yes and Todd Rundgren show I went to in La two weeks ago. I don't know the music well enough to critic the band. I thought it was great. The new singer is amazing. Really hoping I get a chance with ARW, it just hasn't worked out yet. It's really sad for Steve and his family. Terrible shock.

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#2878959 - 09/13/17 05:06 PM Re: Yes Shows Cancelled... Sad Story [Re: GRollins]
Shutoku Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 10/06/12
Posts: 557
Loc: BC Canada
Originally Posted By: GRollins
A few unrelated points:

It's nothing against Jon Anderson; it's that Jon Davison does a damned good job of hitting the same notes with the same pitch, inflection, etc. He's also a better showman than Anderson, who always just stood there, either singing or banging on a tambourine.

I've seen things recently that seem to indicate that Yes was "Anderson's band." That strikes me as odd, given that back in the day it was always portrayed as Anderson & Squire with others rotating in and out. Revisionist history? The truth coming out? Was I simply not seeing the same information as others? I don't know. Some the things I've seen indicate that Anderson was (is?) a bit of a prick, even to the point of violence against band members. (He hit Chris after accusing him of hitting a wrong note, amongst other things.) Wow. Never heard that before.

Grey

I've never heard the story of Anderson hitting Squire, but given Squire was huge and Anderson tiny, I doubt it did much damage if it did happen.

Through Yes's best years, Anderson was the taskmaster. His nickname was little Napoleon. He had the vision, the others had the technical ability to realize Anderson's vision. I think Squire and Howe's contributions are monumental, but ultimately Yes was the vision of Anderson.

As for who in the band is a a prick, I'm sure all of them have sizeable egos, but you don't have to search long to find people with negative stories to tell of meeting Steve Howe. I know a couple people myself who have met him on separate occasions and found him to be a completely petty jerk.
However I think everything is skewed when we meet famous people. If they are a little nice we think they are awesome and if they are having a bad day, they are terrible.

But for fun, look up Steve Howe "I'll kick you in the head" on youtube. grin

All that aside, losing his son has to be absolutely devastating, and Howe's other son was touring with Yes spelling off White. My heart goes out to them.
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#2878960 - 09/13/17 05:19 PM Re: Yes Shows Cancelled... Sad Story [Re: Shutoku]
GRollins Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/01/17
Posts: 353
The story about Anderson hitting Squire came from one of the drummers, Bill Bruford, I think. It's in a video interview on YouTube, but I'm not sure which one. Chris Squire was not huge back in the day--thin as a rail, in fact. All the weight he packed on came much later. (Look at photos in the early album covers. The LPs, that is...CDs ain't got squat.)

Grey
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