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#2878021 - 09/09/17 12:43 AM D-05 is announced
CEB Offline
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16 voice max polyphony and a sequencer. Not sure why I'm drawn to it but I am. I have the real thing.

It comes loaded with ALL the Roland ROM cards ever.

You can load Sysex files into it so all your old patches..... The entire Valhalla library will load into it.

It is a D-50 pretty much. It has two audio modes. 1) Classic mode that emulates the old D-50 audio output and 2) Clean mode that sterilizes..... I mean creates more pristine audio fidelity.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=TjkFNrdOHMg



Edited by CEB (09/09/17 04:51 AM)
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#2878023 - 09/09/17 01:54 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: CEB]
Analogaddict Offline
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Yay!!! Using this and my Kronos, I can have a DX7, an M1 and a D-50 live..! smile

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#2878041 - 09/09/17 04:34 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: CEB]
Synthoid Offline
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I really might get one of these since I no longer have the original and miss the sounds.

The problem was, I didn't want to lug the old D-50 to a gig just for a few sounds, but the size of the boutique model is perfect! smile

I watched the video. Pizza gogo? facepalm

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#2878049 - 09/09/17 04:53 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: CEB]
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#2878051 - 09/09/17 05:02 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: Synthoid]
ElmerJFudd Offline
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Looks very similar to the VSynth card.
16 voice
64x4 patches
64x8 user patch locations
64 step sequencer is interesting
Can run on rechargeable batteries

So I wonder if price of D-550 rack drops on second hand market?
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#2878054 - 09/09/17 05:17 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: ElmerJFudd]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: Analogaddict
Yay!!! Using this and my Kronos, I can have a DX7, an M1 and a D-50 live..! smile

With an iPad and the iM1 app, yes. Unless I've missed something, there's not much M1 available directly in the Kronos.

Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
Looks very similar to the VSynth card.

Yup.

"Our port of the D50 using DCB technology goes back to the development of the VC1 expansion card for the Vsynth, which was developed in 2004. The D50 plug-in and the Boutique series D-05 port are based on technology that we developed at that time."

Lots of other interesting bits in this video:

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#2878056 - 09/09/17 05:26 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: AnotherScott]
ElmerJFudd Offline
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Well, being a digital boutique of a digital synth it's got the best poly of any of them. The arp and seq are neat. Just like the D-50 ushered in what eventually became the highly successful 1080 - Integra 7 and thevbasis for that digital Roland synth sound. I find this boutique particularly nostalgic having been a sophomore in high school when the D-50 came out.
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#2878058 - 09/09/17 05:31 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: ElmerJFudd]
RABid Offline
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I wish they would go back and upgrade other models to 16 voice.
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#2878061 - 09/09/17 05:52 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: RABid]
ElmerJFudd Offline
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Haha, preach it!
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#2878066 - 09/09/17 06:05 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: RABid]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: RABid
I wish they would go back and upgrade other models to 16 voice.

This is not an upgrade to the ACB tech used in the others, it's a different "engine," DCB. It's a digital re-working of a synth that was digital to begin with, as opposed to a digital emulation of an analog system. Their "analog behavior" stuff remains limited to 4 voice, but who knows, maybe that limitation can be overcome in a future gen of that tech...
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#2878067 - 09/09/17 06:05 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: CEB]
Synthoid Offline
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The Roland boutique synths sure make the Yamaha "Retread" stuff look lame. frown
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#2878091 - 09/09/17 07:41 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: AnotherScott]
ElmerJFudd Offline
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Originally Posted By: AnotherScott
Originally Posted By: RABid
I wish they would go back and upgrade other models to 16 voice.

This is not an upgrade to the ACB tech used in the others, it's a different "engine," DCB. It's a digital re-working of a synth that was digital to begin with, as opposed to a digital emulation of an analog system. Their "analog behavior" stuff remains limited to 4 voice, but who knows, maybe that limitation can be overcome in a future gen of that tech...


All true, Scott. Although I'd suggest that at this price point it's a conscious effort on Roland's part to limit voice count. Both in keeping a reason to buy their higher end stuff and also their choice of processor (minimal necessary to run the ACB models). But we know from other VAs on the market that today's processors are quite capable of delivering 12, 24 voices.
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#2878099 - 09/09/17 08:19 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: ElmerJFudd]
burningbusch Offline
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Most of these Boutiques are just too f$%#ing small for me, the first synths and stuff. But I just picked up the TR-08. I tried it out first and found it fine. The level/decay knobs on the original 808 are just about as tiny, just more spaced out. The other switches and controls feel just fine. So using it doesn't feel hugely compromised. With their synths, trying to make precise changes to these tiny knobs and sliders just is no fun for me. Drum machines are different, IMO, and are more easily adapted to the smaller form factor. I think I'd be OK with the 09 and 03.

We'll see on the D-05. We're moving out of the old Roland stuff that's priced in the stratosphere in the used market. D50s/D550s regularly pop up on my CL for reasonable prices. I'm not a huge D-50s fan myself. I had the card for the V-Synth but got bored with it and sold it for profit on ebay.

Busch.

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#2878101 - 09/09/17 08:28 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: burningbusch]
Moonglow Offline
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Boyohboyohboyohboyohboyohboy! love love love love love drool drool drool drool drool

Will be preordering later today!

Just preordered. $349.99. Anticipated arrival date to candy store wink is November 1.


Edited by Moonglow (09/09/17 08:56 AM)
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#2878104 - 09/09/17 08:40 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: ElmerJFudd]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
All true, Scott. Although I'd suggest that at this price point it's a conscious effort on Roland's part to limit voice count. Both in keeping a reason to buy their higher end stuff

you could also daisy-chain to double the polyphony.

Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
and also their choice of processor (minimal necessary to run the ACB models).

but the more capable processor would presumably raise their costs. There's nothing wrong or unexpected about a company trying to make a design as profitable as they think they can.

IOW, to flip your premise around, instead of "at this price point it's a conscious effort on Roland's part to limit voice count" it could be "the limited voice count results from a conscious effort on Roland's part to keep costs down." And that's reasonable, especially since you *can* daisy-chain, and you *can* buy higher end models.

It's really hard to say whether or not they made the right choice, from a business perspective. i.e. assuming that it was *feasible* to do 8-voice ACB in the Boutique chassis (I'll get back to that), would they have sold enough more of them to have made that the more profitable decision.

Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
But we know from other VAs on the market that today's processors are quite capable of delivering 12, 24 voices.

Also, though, if Roland's PR is to be believed, what they are doing with ACB is fundamentally different from the approach other VA has taken... i.e. (as I understand it) modeling the components that created the sound, as opposed to modeling the sonic "results" of those components.The point being only that a different approach may make different demands on the processor. Plus there can be the usual considerations when attempting to put a lot into a small box... what fits, how much heat does it generate, etc. So we don't really know if 8-voice ACB in a Boutique was or was not feasible. (Though even if it wasn't when they designed it, that doesn't mean it may not be in the future, as components continue to get cheaper and more efficient.)
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#2878108 - 09/09/17 08:51 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: burningbusch]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: burningbusch
Most of these Boutiques are just too f$%#ing small for me, the first synths and stuff....With their synths, trying to make precise changes to these tiny knobs and sliders just is no fun for me.

I found the knobs on the JX-03 more easy to manipulate than the sliders on the JP-08. (Unfortunately, I just didn't much care for the sound on the JX-03.) The knobs on the SE-02 feel better than the ones on the JX-03. So I guess what I'm saying is, to me, it depends on the particulars. In only cursory use, I'm okay with the operation of the SE-02. One nice thing is that hey enhanced the MIDI functionality, so you can also assign knobs on some other controller to the key SE-02 functions.

The lack of knobs or sliders on the D-05 kind of puts in a whole other category, it will probably essentially be used as a preset-playback sound module, which is kind of how the D50 was often used anyway, and it should be fine for that. (And like the original, people who want to edit will probably look for an outside-of-the-box solution for that.)

Originally Posted By: burningbusch
We're moving out of the old Roland stuff that's priced in the stratosphere in the used market. D50s/D550s regularly pop up on my CL for reasonable prices.

True, but there is a big difference in travel weight! And possibly reliability. And realistically, for a gigging rig anyway, I think most people who would like D50 sounds would rather add them in a little box than to "tie up" an entire "tier" of their rig with a D50.
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#2878111 - 09/09/17 09:02 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: AnotherScott]
burningbusch Offline
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Originally Posted By: AnotherScott
Originally Posted By: burningbusch
Most of these Boutiques are just too f$%#ing small for me, the first synths and stuff....With their synths, trying to make precise changes to these tiny knobs and sliders just is no fun for me.

I found the knobs on the JX-03 more easy to manipulate than the sliders on the JP-08. (Unfortunately, I just didn't much care for the sound on the JX-03.) The knobs on the SE-02 feel better than the ones on the JX-03. So I guess what I'm saying is, to me, it depends on the particulars. In only cursory use, I'm okay with the operation of the SE-02. One nice thing is that hey enhanced the MIDI functionality, so you can also assign knobs on some other controller to the key SE-02 functions.

The lack of knobs or sliders on the D-05 kind of puts in a whole other category, it will probably essentially be used as a preset-playback sound module, which is kind of how the D50 was often used anyway, and it should be fine for that. (And like the original, people who want to edit will probably look for an outside-of-the-box solution for that.)

Originally Posted By: burningbusch
We're moving out of the old Roland stuff that's priced in the stratosphere in the used market. D50s/D550s regularly pop up on my CL for reasonable prices.

True, but there is a big difference in travel weight! And possibly reliability. And realistically, for a gigging rig anyway, I think most people who would like D50 sounds would rather add them in a little box than to "tie up" an entire "tier" of their rig with a D50.


I tried the SE-02 and really wanted to like it as I'm a big SE fan, but it is just no fun for me. Just too small for precise moves. Uncomfortable.

I can understand the D-05 for gigging, but that's a small market. And, if you only needed a few D50 sounds, they can be sampled pretty easily. We'll have to see on the interface. That display is really shrunk down from the original.

Busch.

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#2878112 - 09/09/17 09:06 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: AnotherScott]
DarkyLord Offline
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[
Originally Posted By: AnotherScott


Also, though, if Roland's PR is to be believed, what they are doing with ACB is fundamentally different from the approach other VA has taken... i.e. (as I understand it) modeling the components that created the sound, as opposed to modeling the sonic "results" of those components.



Didn't Korg do exactly this with their Legacy software? Only they call it Component Modeling Technology. Now we have Digital Circuit Behavior technology to model digital registers and gates supporting Linear Arithmetic Synthesis.

10 years from now they'll be modeling the model. Where does it end? shocked

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#2878114 - 09/09/17 09:32 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: burningbusch]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: burningbusch
if you only needed a few D50 sounds, they can be sampled pretty easily.

I don't know... don't many D50 sounds evolve over time? Complicates sampling. But I've never owned a D50.

Originally Posted By: Markyboard
[
Originally Posted By: AnotherScott
Also, though, if Roland's PR is to be believed, what they are doing with ACB is fundamentally different from the approach other VA has taken... i.e. (as I understand it) modeling the components that created the sound, as opposed to modeling the sonic "results" of those components.

Didn't Korg do exactly this with their Legacy software? Only they call it Component Modeling Technology.

Ah, yes, you're right. I was thinking about the more typical "third party" VA. What's (semi-)unique in these cases is that Korg and Roland actually have access to all the low level design information of the boards that they are modeling, which would allow them to do this. (Roland even talks about how they get input from the original designers.)

This also makes me think about he difference between the HX3 clone which models the circuitry that generated the Hammond organ sound, as opposed to VB3 which models the sounds it generates, as I understand it.

Getting back to the D-05, in emulating a D50, Roland can use whatever digital code they want from the D50, which no one else can use, even if they had it, since that falls under copyright.
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#2878115 - 09/09/17 09:46 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: DarkyLord]
DicemLabs.com Offline
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They are going to sell a crap ton of these.

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#2878128 - 09/09/17 10:51 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: CEB]
Bucktunes Offline
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Originally Posted By: CEB
16 voice max polyphony and a sequencer...It comes loaded with ALL the Roland ROM cards ever.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=TjkFNrdOHMg


Dang Roland, just take my money already! love
I've never owned a Roland keyboard because there was always something out there by Yamaha, Korg or Kurzweil that I preferred. But I've always admired the D50, so this is downright irresistible to me. The A/B comparisons to the original reveal a few patches that are slightly brighter and/or more resonant on the D05, but that would be easy to tweak. Having all the sound library and polyphony of the original makes this a no brainer for me. I agree they should sell these by the truckload! Bring it, Roland! cool
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#2878131 - 09/09/17 10:57 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: Bucktunes]
Bucktunes Offline
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Also, the "classis/clean" option is interesting. I applaud Roland for recognizing that sometimes imperfect is perfect! smile Still it will be interesting to hear how certain patches benefit from a more modern clean sound. cool
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#2878138 - 09/09/17 11:57 AM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: Bucktunes]
ElmerJFudd Offline
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The D-50 is a really nice sounding engine, even compared to all sorts options we have today.



It's such a great mimic of acoustic instruments, it can be analog synthy sounding, it can be FM-like sounding, it even does a respectable organ ftw, and that joystick gives it some motion fading between parts. If you do cover work, there are already a lot of great patches for recognizable timbres. 16 voices ain't too shabby. The arp and seq are useful.

The 05 looks like fun - I'd really rather have a V-Synth rack with the VC-1 card - BUT the downside to that is that you cant mix and match, I believe you have to boot into the D-50 emulation at start up. So it's either or, not both.

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#2878139 - 09/09/17 12:29 PM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: ElmerJFudd]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
The 05 looks like fun - I'd really rather have a V-Synth rack with the VC-1 card - BUT the downside to that is that you cant mix and match, I believe you have to boot into the D-50 emulation at start up. So it's either or, not both.

I think the V-Synth XT rack has the D50 built in and doesn't require a separate boot. Maybe someone else can confirm...
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#2878140 - 09/09/17 12:35 PM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: ElmerJFudd]
count doerflera Offline
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Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
it even does a respectable organ ftw,


you know them's fighting words around these parts. bang grin
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#2878142 - 09/09/17 12:48 PM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: count doerflera]
Bill H. Offline
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Apparently redefining the future also means renewing my bifocal prescription.

I dunno... the only boutique I'm really attracted to is the SE-02, which (correctly IMO) devotes the front panel entirely to functions you'd normally see on a front panel.

These things are just too small to be cramming pitch and mod ribbons in there too.

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#2878144 - 09/09/17 01:06 PM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: AnotherScott]
ElmerJFudd Offline
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Originally Posted By: AnotherScott
Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
The 05 looks like fun - I'd really rather have a V-Synth rack with the VC-1 card - BUT the downside to that is that you cant mix and match, I believe you have to boot into the D-50 emulation at start up. So it's either or, not both.

I think the V-Synth XT rack has the D50 built in and doesn't require a separate boot. Maybe someone else can confirm...


I'm referring to this from soundonsound, "Selecting the VC1 immediately disables all the XT's V-Synth functions, so you can't (for example) play a D50 patch through the V-Synth XT's COSM processors or output effects." Not sure if I am understanding that correctly.

Some commentary on the D-05 from Peter over at createdigitalmusic... "I just doubt that the D-05 will see anywhere near the popularity of the Juno and Jupiter remakes, let alone the wildly popular 909, 808, 303, and now 101. If I had to buy two boxes right away, Id opt TR-08 and SH-01A, no question, for playability, sonic distinctiveness, and interesting step sequencing possibilities."
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#2878150 - 09/09/17 01:41 PM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: ElmerJFudd]
burningbusch Offline
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I have the original TR-606 (the TB-303 is the exact size) and size wise it's identical in width to the Boutiques and about 20% deeper, so it's close. The TR-909, TR-808 and TB-303 have some small knobs. The two drum machines had vast unused panel space, so cramming those devices down to the Boutique I think is OK. But synths are another matter, IMO.

Busch.

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#2878152 - 09/09/17 01:46 PM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: ElmerJFudd]
burningbusch Offline
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Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd

Some commentary on the D-05 from Peter over at createdigitalmusic... "I just doubt that the D-05 will see anywhere near the popularity of the Juno and Jupiter remakes, let alone the wildly popular 909, 808, 303, and now 101. If I had to buy two boxes right away, Id opt TR-08 and SH-01A, no question, for playability, sonic distinctiveness, and interesting step sequencing possibilities."


I agree. If the D50 was that sought after it would be reflected in higher prices in the vintage market.

Busch.

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#2878159 - 09/09/17 02:13 PM Re: D-05 is announced [Re: burningbusch]
dazzjazz Offline
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30 years ago (Jesus!) I gigged with a D50 then, as I didn't like the action, switched to the D550 rack driven by a KX76, which was heaven. I still have the Sysex for all my patches, so would be keen to connect with those again.

I made some gorgeous analog strings on the D50 - they'd always get compliments...so maybe I'll buy one of these suckers...
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