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#2842272 - 03/16/17 03:04 PM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: area51recording]
El Lobo Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 12/23/14
Posts: 630
Originally Posted By: area51recording
Originally Posted By: lerber3
Originally Posted By: HammondDave
Let's play "Mustang Sally!"


Let's rehearse Mustang Sally.


And take it someplace its never been taken before....
and stick it where the sun don't shine
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KC Island
#2842276 - 03/16/17 03:19 PM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: El Lobo]
Nadroj Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 08/19/13
Posts: 858
Loc: Edinburgh, Scotland
"Just play some 'synth' in the background."

*While talking about a rhodes part* "Isn't that supposed to be a 'hammond' sound?"

*While talking about a staccatto sine lead* "Isn't that supposed to be an electric piano?"

In fact, "isn't that suppoed to be..." anything is a red flag for me. Along with "that's not X, that's Y." I'm all for being given critical feedback and advice and taking it on board, but when the drummer with a bad ear suddenly thinks he's a producer I start to get a twitch.
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#2842282 - 03/16/17 03:26 PM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: Nadroj]
EscapeRocks Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 08/12/03
Posts: 4149
Loc: Texas
Originally Posted By: Nadroj
"
In fact, "isn't that supposed to be..." anything is a red flag for me.


A very long time ago when we were auditioning lead vocalists, I had one come in and tell me I was playing a song wrong using that exact line.

I put him on the spot and played dumb, and asked him to show me. He could play piano. It was a train wreck, not even close to right, and needless to say he did not get the job wink
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Gig Rig: Casio PX-5S | Arturia Keylab 61 Black Edition | Mainstage |


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#2842286 - 03/16/17 03:42 PM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: EscapeRocks]
ITGITC? Offline
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10k Club

Registered: 12/18/02
Posts: 17417
Loc: USA

"Hello. I am the mother of the bride."
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#2842292 - 03/16/17 04:28 PM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: MotiDave]
timwat Offline
Quite wealthy...spiritually
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 11/21/01
Posts: 5200
Loc: Concord,CA,UNITED STATES
Originally Posted By: MotiDave
But then ... then I saw TimW's. I love TimW's plan to have much MORE TIME for new music projects AFTER the marriage the best smile

if any guy can pull that off ... he's the one. I'm not betting against him.


Well, I'm humbled. Thanks so much for the kind words.

And yes, the rest of you guys may be correct with your...hesitation. But this isn't my first rodeo (was married for 19 years...) so I'm not unfamiliar with how married life works. I'm a realist. There is an appointed season for all things, and my beloved is indeed a strong and special lady. We'll see when my project gets recorded; I've waiting this long so I'm not in a rush.

And...you may say I'm a dreamer. But I'm not the only one. I hope one day you will...c'mon, you know the words, sing along...
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#2842333 - 03/16/17 08:46 PM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: timwat]
MathOfInsects Online   content
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 02/04/15
Posts: 2368
Loc: California
This is not as foolproof as some of the others, but: noodling.
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#2842334 - 03/16/17 08:50 PM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: MathOfInsects]
timwat Offline
Quite wealthy...spiritually
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 11/21/01
Posts: 5200
Loc: Concord,CA,UNITED STATES
As far as red flags, perhaps the ONE thing that sets me off more than others is (if this what Math is referring to): meaningless riffing before downbeat.

Soundcheck is one thing, quietly reminding oneself of a lick or two is another...but just wanking away is a sure sign of an amateur.

Don't give everything away. Have the sureness to only play when you need to. For the love of all that is holy, step away from the instrument until you have something intentional to say.

MoI, Is that the noodling you're also referring to?
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#2842335 - 03/16/17 09:01 PM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: timwat]
MathOfInsects Online   content
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Registered: 02/04/15
Posts: 2368
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The very noodles.
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#2842338 - 03/16/17 09:28 PM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: timwat]
EscapeRocks Offline
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Registered: 08/12/03
Posts: 4149
Loc: Texas
Originally Posted By: timwat
As far as red flags, perhaps the ONE thing that sets me off more than others is (if this what Math is referring to): meaningless riffing before downbeat.



Right there with ya!!

For some reason, around here on the occasions I am able to make it out to clubs, it seems it's the keyboard players doing the needless and incessant noodling. It's as if they are trying to impress the people in the place with a so called palette of riffs from any, and every pop song form the last 40 years.

However, to my ear, you can tell, the little snippets they play is probably all they know.
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#2842339 - 03/16/17 09:34 PM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: EscapeRocks]
JimboK Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/04/08
Posts: 326
Loc: California
Best quote on thread thus far:

"Don't give everything away. Have the sureness to only play when you need to. For the love of all that is holy, step away from the instrument until you have something intentional to say. "

Noodlers are more then a red flag however, they are instant deal killers but still an awesome line.
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#2842346 - 03/16/17 10:23 PM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: JimboK]
MathOfInsects Online   content
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Registered: 02/04/15
Posts: 2368
Loc: California
I think it's a pretty reliable barometer, but I know a few great players who also make tubs of noodles all the time, so I'm only willing to put it in the "early warning detection" section, rather than the deal-killer aisle.
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#2842348 - 03/16/17 10:44 PM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: MathOfInsects]
J. Dan Online   content
10k Club

Registered: 07/25/08
Posts: 10617
Loc: St. Louis, MO
One man's noodle is another man's lasagna.
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Acoustic/Electric stringed instruments ranging from 4 to 230 strings, hammered, picked, fingered, slapped, and plucked. Analog and Digital Electronic instruments, reeds, and throat/mouth.

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#2842354 - 03/16/17 11:51 PM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: J. Dan]
Pete the bean Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/30/11
Posts: 42
Loc: Canada
No flags in this posting!

Older Sensual Female Singer
Hi! My name is Cheryl. I'm an older female singer/writer and I'm looking for a jazzy r&b mellow group to join. My voice has been compared to Sade, Norah Jones and Patti LaBelle. I do write my own stuff as well, and to be honest, most of my best writing is done while I'm on the toilet during prolonged bowel movements. If you feel like jamming or if you'd like to connect for an audition please do reach out. I very much look forward to hearing from you. Please do not use the CL e-mail address to reach me, please use my direct e-mail:
show contact info
. Thank you.
do NOT contact me with unsolicited services or offers
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#2842357 - 03/17/17 12:28 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: Pete the bean]
Dave Ferris Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 03/05/07
Posts: 5312
Loc: Glendale, Ca.
THE singer : I don't really know this song but I got this arrangement off sheet music plus. I hope you don't mind that it's 7 pages long…I did tape it though.
But I don't think it's my key.

Turns out it's a Blues in G. facepalm
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#2842361 - 03/17/17 01:56 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: tarkus]
elsongs Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/15/11
Posts: 231
Loc: Los Angeles, CA, USA
In a cover band situation: When the guitarist plays the EXACT SAME part as you in nearly every song, including rhythm and octave, except MUCH LOUDER. Ugh.

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#2842362 - 03/17/17 02:22 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: elsongs]
RobP2 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/19/09
Posts: 137
Loc: Bedford, UK
One function band that I quickly left -
the guitarist played Johhny B Goode from sheets - yes sheets - on a music stand, complete with short pause to turn the page

And, we rehearsed at the drummer's mother's house (band were all 35+)

Then there was the singer who auditioned for another band of mine. Turned up with girlfriend (both late 50s)
He had leather trousers, white shirt open to the waist....and sounded truly awful. At the end of the first number his girlfriend points to the bass player and says "he played a wrong note in the chorus". Sometimes you wonder if you are on a hidden camera show....
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#2842374 - 03/17/17 04:37 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: RobP2]
DanL Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/22/05
Posts: 3815
Loc: DE
I think angry CL guy at least is being honest about what they want- and like most of us, being on that end of things and trying to find players can be frustrating. Luckily all the players I work with are found via recommendation/word of mouth from others in my circle of musician associates.

Way back at the beginning of our party band we put up a CL ad for a singer. If you watch the Simpsons, there was an episode where they had a heavy set white guy who sang like Michael Jackson- a clone of that guy showed up to audition. It's also the ad where we found the girl who's been with us for the last 9 years- one of the most down to earth, no diva/drama, intelligent, and talented people you'd ever want to meet. She's also the one who sings "Great Gig" in my Floyd band now.

I'm laughing at the sheet music for Blues in G and JBG. I saw a Floyd band where the keys player has this giant rack (it looks like one of those stainless steel kitchen shelves) with 5' long charts of the songs that she read on every song. It was so big and tall that she set up sideways, facing away from the band. How many times do you need to read the chart for Money or Wish You Were Here? That'd be a red flag for me- unless you are doing Real Book stuff, or doing a fill in gig, you should be able to memorize your parts. All of my bands have an unwritten "no charts" rule. The drummer in 1 band uses some cheat sheets for lyrics on songs he sings, but his music stand is stuck in with his drum kit and not really visible. I hate seeing a lead singer or other front players with a giant binder of songs sitting in the middle of the stage.
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#2842384 - 03/17/17 05:44 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: DanL]
stoken6 Offline
Platinum Member

Registered: 05/12/12
Posts: 1413
Flag that turned out not to be red:

New sax player in the soul band I'm putting together with long-time guitar/vocals colleague - starts telling us all about his other project (which is cool) and how that takes up most of his time. (So why are you looking for another band?)

After first rehearsal, he seems much more into it, and says "I've got a great idea for a song". I groan inwardly, and then he follows up with "I've got charts for everyone, and I'll sing it".

I'm sure we all recognise the point when a newbie suggests a song to a long-established covers band. But if you're going to do it, do it this way.

Cheers, Mike.
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#2842385 - 03/17/17 05:46 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: elsongs]
Stokely Offline
Platinum Member

Registered: 12/15/12
Posts: 1390
Loc: Florida
Originally Posted By: elsongs
In a cover band situation: When the guitarist plays the EXACT SAME part as you in nearly every song, including rhythm and octave, except MUCH LOUDER. Ugh.


Yes...a couple bands ago our lineup had two guitarists. One who played open chords rhythm with a capo if necessary (which made him out of tune). The other guy was the "lead player" and by God there was a lead going on all the time...He noodled during verses, he noodled during choruses. I had a couple tunes with prominent, if easy, keyboard parts...one was New Years Day by U2. Well, he decides he's now going to double the freaking electric grand "lead" I do on that song....not like that song is not packed full of guitar, give me my 10 seconds of fame pal!

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#2842396 - 03/17/17 06:27 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: RobP2]
tarkus Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 05/04/04
Posts: 2054
Loc: MIAMI, Fl
Originally Posted By: RobP2

Then there was the singer who auditioned for another band of mine. Turned up with girlfriend (both late 50s)
He had leather trousers, white shirt open to the waist....and sounded truly awful. At the end of the first number his girlfriend points to the bass player and says "he played a wrong note in the chorus". Sometimes you wonder if you are on a hidden camera show....

This conjured up an image of the Great Tony Rolletti

(bonus: Tom Waits at the 36 min mark during Tony Rolletti's Wedding)

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#2842402 - 03/17/17 06:58 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: ITGITC?]
Wastrel Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 05/13/09
Posts: 2283
Loc: Los Angeles
Originally Posted By: ITGITC?

"Hello. I am the mother of the bride."


God yes. The queen for a day syndrome. How I have suffered at the hands of evil MOTBs.
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#2842405 - 03/17/17 07:04 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: tarkus]
Wastrel Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 05/13/09
Posts: 2283
Loc: Los Angeles
Originally Posted By: tarkus
Originally Posted By: RobP2

Then there was the singer who auditioned for another band of mine. Turned up with girlfriend (both late 50s)
He had leather trousers, white shirt open to the waist....and sounded truly awful. At the end of the first number his girlfriend points to the bass player and says "he played a wrong note in the chorus". Sometimes you wonder if you are on a hidden camera show....

This conjured up an image of the Great Tony Rolletti

(bonus: Tom Waits at the 36 min mark during Tony Rolletti's Wedding)

He (Bill Kirchenbauer) is one Funny dude. He was a friend of the singer in my band back in the '70s and I saw him a couple of times at the Comedy & Magic Club. Laughed so hard and long I injured myself.
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#2842445 - 03/17/17 10:10 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: Wastrel]
MathOfInsects Online   content
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Registered: 02/04/15
Posts: 2368
Loc: California
As I get older, I find other older players not wearing ear plugs to be a red flag. I figure there is no way they can hear well enough, to play well in a group. It's pretty reliable.
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#2842446 - 03/17/17 10:12 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: Wastrel]
MathOfInsects Online   content
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 02/04/15
Posts: 2368
Loc: California
Originally Posted By: Wastrel
Originally Posted By: MathOfInsects
Name-dropping.

I'd forgotten that one. Right on.

Originally Posted By: Wastrel
He (Bill Kirchenbauer) is one Funny dude. He was a friend of the singer in my band back in the '70s and I saw him a couple of times at the Comedy & Magic Club. Laughed so hard and long I injured myself.

Red flag!!!

poke
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#2842447 - 03/17/17 10:18 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: MathOfInsects]
David Loving Offline
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Registered: 12/11/00
Posts: 4858
Loc: Texas
Guitar/ bass play seated; They play any "Guess Who"
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#2842449 - 03/17/17 10:34 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: MathOfInsects]
DanL Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/22/05
Posts: 3815
Loc: DE
Originally Posted By: MathOfInsects
As I get older, I find other older players not wearing ear plugs to be a red flag. I figure there is no way they can hear well enough, to play well in a group. It's pretty reliable.


I rarely use them. Not with any of my regular bands but there are a couple fill ins and some other shows that are these rotating players every song/ensemble type things where I wear them- especially back stage while I'm waiting for my next turn on keys.
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#2842450 - 03/17/17 10:35 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: DanL]
DanL Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 09/22/05
Posts: 3815
Loc: DE
On that note, our new guitar player in the party band kept commenting about how in control our volume is at rehearsal and on stage.
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Toys: Novation Ultranova, Moog LP, Roland SP-404SX, Roland JX10,Emu MK6
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#2842454 - 03/17/17 10:42 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: DanL]
timwat Offline
Quite wealthy...spiritually
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 11/21/01
Posts: 5200
Loc: Concord,CA,UNITED STATES
What?
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#2842456 - 03/17/17 10:46 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: MathOfInsects]
El Lobo Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 12/23/14
Posts: 630
Originally Posted By: MathOfInsects
As I get older, I find other older players not wearing ear plugs to be a red flag. I figure there is no way they can hear well enough, to play well in a group. It's pretty reliable.
I have custom ear plugs but I never use them because the bands I play with keep the volume to mid-level so the plugs aren't necessary. My red flag is bands that play so loud that ear plugs are required. That means they're amateurs who don't know how to control volume and don't know how to use their gear.
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#2842458 - 03/17/17 10:48 AM Re: Red Flags--What Are Yours? [Re: El Lobo]
Morizzle Offline
Platinum Member

Registered: 08/06/08
Posts: 1159
Loc: a planet
Piano ties. Treble clef ties. Any music related ties.
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