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#2857995 - 05/29/17 02:01 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: ElmerJFudd]
Delaware Dave Offline
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Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
Typically how do you guys attach the extra drawbars? Voce, DB-1. I would imagine the matching Mojo version may dream up something Mojo61 specific. Otherwise Velcro?
several ways, velcro is one i don't do but probably the easiest. I attached a thick mousepad to the bottom of the voce, it pretty much doesnt move when I lay it on the keyboard. For metal keyboards i attach it to a magnetic vent cover and then put that on the keyboard.
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#2858138 - 05/30/17 09:46 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Kurt W]
Joe Muscara Offline
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Originally Posted By: Kurt W
Originally Posted By: ElmerJFudd
Would the Ocean Beach DB-1 work? I'm thinking yes, since the Gemini card takes CC's for drawbars.

Yes it works. I use the DB-1 to control the lower manual drawbars on the Mojo 61. The DB-1 also have a programmable pushbutton which I use to turn on/off the lower manual V/C. The DB-1 really is a swiss knife, it also handles Kronos sysex drawbars.
How did you configure this? Did you use the DB-1 Configurator and set the drawbars on the DB-1 to the CC numbers of the VB3 in the Mojo61?

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#2858153 - 05/30/17 10:38 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Joe Muscara]
Kurt W Offline
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Registered: 02/02/12
Posts: 194
Originally Posted By: Joe Muscara
How did you configure this? Did you use the DB-1 Configurator and set the drawbars on the DB-1 to the CC numbers of the VB3 in the Mojo61?

Exactly, I used the configurator and matched the drawbars and the single programmable pushbutton to the midi controllers defined in chapter 20 of the Mojo 61 user manual.

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#2858159 - 05/30/17 10:49 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Kurt W]
Joe Muscara Offline
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Originally Posted By: Kurt W
Originally Posted By: Joe Muscara
How did you configure this? Did you use the DB-1 Configurator and set the drawbars on the DB-1 to the CC numbers of the VB3 in the Mojo61?

Exactly, I used the configurator and matched the drawbars and the single programmable pushbutton to the midi controllers defined in chapter 20 of the Mojo 61 user manual.
thu

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#2858166 - 05/30/17 11:47 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Jazz+]
DaBous Offline
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Registered: 05/22/12
Posts: 237
Originally Posted By: Jazz+

The Piano is evolving and getting better and better, it has the sound I like for live performance: clarity. The 1.5 ms clip was a great idea. Go Crumar!


Apologize if this is a dumb question or if I missed the discussion about this. The AP sample in the Mojo 61 is different from the one in the Gemini expander correct?


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#2858193 - 05/30/17 02:27 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Kurt W]
Joe Muscara Offline
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Originally Posted By: Kurt W
Originally Posted By: Joe Muscara
How did you configure this? Did you use the DB-1 Configurator and set the drawbars on the DB-1 to the CC numbers of the VB3 in the Mojo61?

Exactly, I used the configurator and matched the drawbars and the single programmable pushbutton to the midi controllers defined in chapter 20 of the Mojo 61 user manual.
Is your DB-1 the smaller series II model? I had my Series I all configured (though I couldn't get the button to work and I had to set it to Fader mode instead of Drawbar for each one) but then when I disconnected it from the MIDI to USB interface for my computer and connected it directly to the Mojo61, it seemed like there wasn't enough bus power for it to work as the LED didn't blink at all. frown

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#2858195 - 05/30/17 02:57 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Joe Muscara]
Kurt W Offline
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Registered: 02/02/12
Posts: 194
Yes I have the series II. Are you sure you have a powered midi out from a controller connected to the DB-1 midi in? If not I think the series I need a wall wart DC supply. The series II can be powered by an internal 9 volt battery. The manuals also describe that some controllers provide to little DC via midi to power the DB-1. That's why the adapter or battery may be needed even if the DB-1 is having a midi in connection.

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#2858199 - 05/30/17 03:15 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Kurt W]
Joe Muscara Offline
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Originally Posted By: Kurt W
Yes I have the series II. Are you sure you have a powered midi out from a controller connected to the DB-1 midi in? If not I think the series I need a wall wart DC supply. The series II can be powered by an internal 9 volt battery. The manuals also describe that some controllers provide to little DC via midi to power the DB-1. That's why the adapter or battery may be needed even if the DB-1 is having a midi in connection.
Right, that's what I'm thinking. I remember the original Electros that Dave designed the DB-1 had 5V on the MIDI bus, but the later ones or other models went down to 3.3V. I'm guessing the Mojo61 has less than 5V. Oh well.

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#2858566 - 06/01/17 02:02 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Joe Muscara]
OB Dave Offline
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Registered: 04/25/09
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Loc: San Diego CA, US
Sorry, late to the party as usual. But yes, you're on to something. While the Series I and II units are functionally equivalent, the Series II DB-1 draws less current and will run fairly reliably off a 3.3v MIDI bus. It was much more of a crapshoot with the Series I units.

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#2858609 - 06/01/17 08:06 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: OB Dave]
Joe Muscara Offline
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Thanks, Dave. Is there any way to tell for sure of the MIDI Bus voltage, short of asking the manufacturer? I guess the pin outs are documented in general but I thought I'd ask in case there's more to it than that.

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#2858628 - 06/01/17 09:54 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Joe Muscara]
Music*aL Offline
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Just joined the club!! The Mojo 61 arrived yesterday, and I've been enjoying it immensely. My favorite tonewheel set so far is Mitch's 1959 B3. Still tweaking though. The sim is very good and all the available parameters make the instrument a joy to tweak and play.

Quick question about the C/V. Is the C/V the same for all tonewheel models or does it vary per model? I thought it sounded different from model to model but my ears could be playing tricks on me!!

aL
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#2858631 - 06/01/17 10:12 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Music*aL]
mate stubb Offline
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Originally Posted By: Music*aL

Quick question about the C/V. Is the C/V the same for all tonewheel models or does it vary per model? I thought it sounded different from model to model but my ears could be playing tricks on me!!

aL


It's the same, but different drawbar balances in the models can make it sound different. You may want to adjust the balance or depth slightly after switching.
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#2858634 - 06/01/17 10:26 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: mate stubb]
Music*aL Offline
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Thanks Mate!!
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Gear: Mojo 61, NP2 HP, MOXF8, NS2 73, Numa Organ, PC361, An1x, NS 88 classic, C. Bechstein baby grand.

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#2858677 - 06/01/17 01:05 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Music*aL]
LX88 Offline
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Registered: 10/16/10
Posts: 1746
So.... for now I am deciding to keep both the Mojo and HX3.

There are some issues I am having with the Mojo. I know some of you die hard Crumar guys probably don't like "whining " but here goes....

First of all I don't find the sound with leslie sim off that significantly different than the Numa. I don't see where the upper octave cuts all that more or any of that.

I am having a bit of a time getting the bass levels up on the Mojo.

Just as with the Numa, I am finding that running a full range speaker with no horn drivers or crossovers gives me the best sound. When I use powered P.A. cabs, I get way too much percussion in the upper octave. I do use slow decay, so it really makes that show up.

I had the same issue with the Numa. I am testing with one JBL 12 inch D140 and a home stereo power amp with EQ. So far running mono only and CV... third percussion.

I have no wifi at home and at the present time am not able to edit. If there is a way to have wifi editing without internet, I would like to hear about it.

I would much prefer plugging in a computer monitor, as I think the original Mojo had for editing.

I would like to know if there is a percussion volume adjustment on the Mojo that is separate from the wifi editor. As I recall, Guido showed me something at NAMM, but I don't know what it is.

My contribution to the Numa is that a percussion volume control was implemented via the pedal drawbars and one shift function. Both the Numa 1 and 2 have it, although on Numa 1 it has to be altered via a software update.

Percussion volume is one way to compensate for different speaker characteristics ( particularly powered 2 way type) and can also give you more bass if the upper manual drawbars are pushed in and percussion is turned down a bit. Then you can get a better balance between upper and lower manuals.

I am getting pretty close to getting a great sound from the Mojo... I just need to learn a bit more about it. I will say that the percussion sound is excellent also. On slow decay you can really hear the character of the percussion. If you see the Tony Monaco Mojo demo, he uses slow decay quite a bit. I also saw Joey D. using slow the last time I heard him play a Key B at NAMM a few years ago.

I am not super crazy about the EP's...the Wurli comes off best ( to me) but having tremelo in stereo?.... I don't quite get that one.

Overall , the 61 gives great bang for the buck. And now we will be able to have single/ dual manual options.... now, that is great.


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#2858688 - 06/01/17 01:33 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: LX88]
davedoerfler Offline
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Registered: 12/27/12
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Loc: thin ice
Originally Posted By: LX88
So.... for now I am deciding to keep both the Mojo and HX3.

cool
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'88 Kawai 52" Upright,'61 Hammond A100,'81 Rhodes 88 Mark II Stage,'71 Wurlitzer 200, Clavinet E7, Moog Voyager, Leslies 142/Studio 12, Yamaha CP70, DSI Prophet 08, Arp Solina, Yamaha CP4, Crumar Mojo

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#2858692 - 06/01/17 01:48 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: davedoerfler]
kenheeter Offline
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Registered: 03/02/11
Posts: 106
I think you can have wifi with just a router, no internet required.

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#2858709 - 06/01/17 02:44 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: kenheeter]
bjosko Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 130
Loc: Denmark
Why wifi ? Do you not have an computer, phone or tablet with built in wifi ? It is all you need to access your Mojo. The Mojo have it's own wifi, so you should find it on your IT device and connect to it, then use your internet browser on your device to adjust all parameters you need.
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#2858718 - 06/01/17 03:35 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: bjosko]
Mitch Towne Offline
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Registered: 01/26/07
Posts: 935
You definitely do not need internet access to edit the Mojo61. All you need is any device (computer, phone, tablet) that has WIFI access. The device connects directly to the Mojo61. No internet is in the mix.

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#2858723 - 06/01/17 03:56 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Mitch Towne]
kenheeter Offline
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Registered: 03/02/11
Posts: 106
Of course, that's correct.

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#2858739 - 06/01/17 06:42 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: kenheeter]
Delaware Dave Offline
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Registered: 04/21/11
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Other than my Voce V5+ which has no adjustments to adjust, the Gemini module is probably the least tweaked of all of the Hammond clone modules I've ever used. The only adjustments I've made was to tweak the leslie speed, the rotor balance and decreased the treble on the EQ. The other thing I did was adjust the drawbar trim on each of the 9 drawbars so that the loudness individually matched my '57 B3. That's it. The sound, the percussion and the C/V are there. I'm not sure what sound you are trying to match. My Gemini matches the sound of my B3, but it sounds as though that you are trying to get the Mojo to match the sound of your Numa, rather than a real B3. Trust me, the Mojo needs very little tweaking. Have you even tried the other 21 Hammonds that have been delivered? My guess is that you haven't. Answer this question: of all of the hammonds that you've played what was your favorite sounding one? If it is a early 60's A100 series there is one delivered in the Mojo ('61 A101). He has A100 series, B series, C series, L series, 50's, 60's and 70's. Try the different organs until you get one that you like, you'll find that you'll have to tweak it less.

If you own a cell phone turn Wi-Fi on on the phone. Check the list of wifi devices your phone can "see" and one of them will be the Mojo. Choose it and connect to it, it will prompt for a password which should be '00000000'. It should authenticate you and 'connect' to the Mojo. Now open up a browser on your phone, like google chrome. Type in "192.168.1.1" in the search bar and hit enter. The mojo editor should appear on your phone.

I would also whole heartedly disagree with your EP assessment. Having owned a 200a and Rhodes many years ago they are pretty authentic in sound and more importantly in how they react when playing. The only caveat would be that to get the bellish tine on my rhodes i really had to strike the keys very hard; the gemini gets you to the bellish sound without as much difficulty. Other than that i think they are close to authentic in sound and behaviour.
_________________________
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#2858752 - 06/01/17 07:56 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Mitch Towne]
drawback Offline
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Registered: 05/11/04
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Loc: Victoria, BC Canada
Originally Posted By: Mitch Towne
You definitely do not need internet access to edit the Mojo61. All you need is any device (computer, phone, tablet) that has WIFI access. The device connects directly to the Mojo61. No internet is in the mix.


And I humbly suggest LX88 1. read the manual, 2. open the editor and 3. make the adjustments on the parameters you're having trouble with.


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#2858755 - 06/01/17 08:42 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: drawback]
wd8dky Offline
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Registered: 03/06/06
Posts: 868
Loc: Chicagoland
Originally Posted By: drawback
Originally Posted By: Mitch Towne
You definitely do not need internet access to edit the Mojo61. All you need is any device (computer, phone, tablet) that has WIFI access. The device connects directly to the Mojo61. No internet is in the mix.


And I humbly suggest LX88 1. read the manual, 2. open the editor and 3. make the adjustments on the parameters you're having trouble with.



I hope he does, or I'll be sending him some cheese to go with his whine.

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#2858757 - 06/01/17 08:56 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: wd8dky]
mate stubb Offline
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From his previous posts, I don't believe LX is chasing an authentic Hammond tonewheel sound like most of the rest of us. At one point he was wanting the leslie speed to be way slower than normal.

Which is why I asked him to post a clip when he gets it where he wants it so we can hear what his ideal is.


Edited by mate stubb (06/01/17 08:58 PM)
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Jazzooo: "Yes, there is an appeal to having your entire catalog on a few little pieces of dark plastic that are easily lost under the seat."

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#2858758 - 06/01/17 08:58 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Joe Muscara]
OB Dave Offline
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Registered: 04/25/09
Posts: 847
Loc: San Diego CA, US
Originally Posted By: Joe Muscara
Thanks, Dave. Is there any way to tell for sure of the MIDI Bus voltage

Yeah, it's pretty easy with a DMM. Measure the voltage between pins 2 and 4 of the MIDI OUT jack. Unfortunately there's not much actionable information you'll get from this. If the DB-1's not happy running off this MIDI bus, it's not happy running off this MIDI bus, and your easiest remedy with a Series I unit is to use the wall wart power supply.



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#2858763 - 06/01/17 09:37 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: mate stubb]
davedoerfler Offline
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Registered: 12/27/12
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Originally Posted By: mate stubb
From his previous posts, I don't believe LX is chasing an authentic Hammond tonewheel sound like most of the rest of us. At one point he was wanting the leslie speed to be way slower than normal.

Which is why I asked him to post a clip when he gets it where he wants it so we can hear what his ideal is.


which he has already stated he is unable to do. So we will never know. snax
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#2858764 - 06/01/17 09:40 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: drawback]
RedKey Offline
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Registered: 05/20/09
Posts: 1267
Loc: Chicago
Originally Posted By: drawback
And I humbly suggest LX88 1. read the manual, 2. open the editor and 3. make the adjustments on the parameters you're having trouble with.


Or just let yourself into the room with the assistance of housekeeping, sit in the chair, and watch...

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#2858794 - 06/02/17 04:59 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: OB Dave]
Joe Muscara Offline
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Originally Posted By: OB Dave
Originally Posted By: Joe Muscara
Thanks, Dave. Is there any way to tell for sure of the MIDI Bus voltage

Yeah, it's pretty easy with a DMM. Measure the voltage between pins 2 and 4 of the MIDI OUT jack. Unfortunately there's not much actionable information you'll get from this. If the DB-1's not happy running off this MIDI bus, it's not happy running off this MIDI bus, and your easiest remedy with a Series I unit is to use the wall wart power supply.
I agree. It would just be to confirm that the problem is that and not something else I might be doing wrong. Thanks for the info!

(Also, I don't know if I have the wall wart...)

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#2864821 - 07/06/17 01:55 PM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Joe Muscara]
OB Dave Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 04/25/09
Posts: 847
Loc: San Diego CA, US
Originally Posted By: Joe Muscara
(Also, I don't know if I have the wall wart...)


Ah, well that part is easy at least. It will run off any wall-wart that puts out between about 7 and 12 volts DC, center terminal positive. The plug is 2.1mm/5.5mm, which is the most common size for this type of barrel connector.

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#2865785 - 07/10/17 07:54 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: OB Dave]
Dave Bryce Administrator Offline
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Took a Mojo61 over to brother Derek on Saturday.



dB

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Professional affiliations: Amphion Loudspeakers • Cloud Microphones • Crumar/GSi • elysia GmbH • Roswell Pro Audio • TK Audio...and Electronic Musician

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#2865792 - 07/10/17 08:12 AM Re: Crumar Mojo 61 Review - (LONG) [Re: Dave Bryce]
davedoerfler Offline
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Registered: 12/27/12
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Loc: thin ice
short clip but he seemed to like it.
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