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#2726368 - 10/07/15 05:11 PM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: desertbluesman]
desertbluesman Offline
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Bonnamassa plays Blues Deluxe. Definitely a journeyman blues player.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SbUCUjsZm9E

Now that is the blues.
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#2726376 - 10/07/15 06:10 PM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: desertbluesman]
Larryz Offline
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^ He does a great job on that one DBM! I like him when he gets right with the program and skips the long intros...great blues playing that make that LP sing! cool
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#2726379 - 10/07/15 06:16 PM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: desertbluesman]
Griffinator Offline
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Originally Posted By: desertbluesman
...you have to give him credit for being a fully pro guy on stage in his playing, and tone.


I do. I'm just not inclined to go any further than that. Certainly not as far as spending half a hundred to go watch him.

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#2726383 - 10/07/15 06:35 PM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Griffinator]
desertbluesman Offline
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Originally Posted By: Griffinator
Originally Posted By: desertbluesman
...you have to give him credit for being a fully pro guy on stage in his playing, and tone.


I do. I'm just not inclined to go any further than that. Certainly not as far as spending half a hundred to go watch him.


I don't go to places where there are many humans with possible communicable diseases anymore. At my age and the fact I don't get vaccines, a little flue or anything stronger than that could kill me, whereas it would only have made me uncomfortable in the past.

There are very few musicians that I would go pay to see at almost any price these days. The ones I admired are mostly dead or past their prime by a long ways.
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#2726399 - 10/07/15 08:19 PM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: desertbluesman]
Griffinator Offline
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I'll still pay a pretty stiff premium to go see John Petrucci play. wink

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#2726447 - 10/08/15 04:41 AM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Griffinator]
Eric Iverson Offline
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The question arose: can you do anything new in the blues, and still have it be blues?
Well, guys like Clapton, Hendrix, Bloomfield, Beck et al. did EXACTLY THAT back in the day!
Could it be done now? I imagine it COULD... the question is, would it be ACCEPTED??
This is not the '60s, when blues was a new thing to white kids - a "Crusade" (John Mayall titled one of his records that). It's not a crusade anymore - it's not a novelty. There are certainly some young blues fans, the music is surely not going to die any time soon, but it's not where the creative center of gravity is.

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#2726453 - 10/08/15 05:45 AM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: desertbluesman]
Fred_C Offline
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[quote=desertbluesman
The ones I admired are mostly dead or past their prime by a long ways. [/quote]

Agreed. Although there are a lot of old guys who can still play. I hear that Les Paul was still "wearin' it out" in his 90's.

Hell, Buddy Guy is 79 and still killin' it. One of my earliest guitar heroes.

But, yeah. Almost everyone I like is dead.
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#2726455 - 10/08/15 05:54 AM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Griffinator]
Dannyalcatraz Offline
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Originally Posted By: Griffinator
Originally Posted By: desertbluesman
...you have to give him credit for being a fully pro guy on stage in his playing, and tone.


I do. I'm just not inclined to go any further than that. Certainly not as far as spending half a hundred to go watch him.


Keep your eyes & ears open and you won't have to. He does play venues & events that are more affordable- I got to see him for a taping of ACL...when he "opened" for himself by playing an acoustic set with one band, and an electric set with another lineup.

The encore featured all the musicians who participated,


Edited by Dannyalcatraz (10/08/15 05:55 AM)
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#2726475 - 10/08/15 07:20 AM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Eric Iverson]
Griffinator Offline
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Originally Posted By: Eric Iverson
The question arose: can you do anything new in the blues, and still have it be blues?
Well, guys like Clapton, Hendrix, Bloomfield, Beck et al. did EXACTLY THAT back in the day!
Could it be done now? I imagine it COULD... the question is, would it be ACCEPTED??
This is not the '60s, when blues was a new thing to white kids - a "Crusade" (John Mayall titled one of his records that). It's not a crusade anymore - it's not a novelty. There are certainly some young blues fans, the music is surely not going to die any time soon, but it's not where the creative center of gravity is.


True enough.

And even if someone DID try and reinvent the blues by adding some other components to it, someone would slap a new subgenre label on it just so it wouldn't be called "the blues" anymore.

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#2726477 - 10/08/15 07:21 AM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Fred_C]
CEB Online   content
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Originally Posted By: Fred_C
Originally Posted By: CEB


I don't really give jack about the guitar chops. I like the vibe of the rhythm section and the work as a whole.

when Chubby plays that sliues.



Hey CEB,

I agree. I really enjoy inserting hip chord phrases into my Blues.

In the last few years I've gotten away from a scalar approach to soloing. I am now playing blues using "Chord Tone Soloing". I think it sounds super cool and since your thinking about chord shapes, it's easy to insert some cool rhythmic ideas. A nice, Jazzy sound.

BTW: What do you mean by New York style" Blues? I'm not familiar with the term. Could you post an example?

Be well and Play well.



Real NY Blues tends to be horn based and guitar is often part of the rhythm section. It is a lot like Jump Blues. A better label for this blues where the guitar takes more of a lead role is probably Up Town Blues. Think more dimished scales and more of a Jazzy sound and less dependency on pentatonic or 6 tone blues scales.

The guys to me that are the pinnacle of that style are players like Robben Ford, Larry Carlton, Poppa Chubby goes there sometimes.





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#2726508 - 10/08/15 08:24 AM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: CEB]
Larryz Offline
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@ CEB, Bob James does a really great job on piano, playing with Larry Cartlton...you can tell Bob has been around for a long time. Very cool! cool
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#2726559 - 10/08/15 11:10 AM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Larryz]
SEHpicker Offline
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Registered: 05/16/02
Posts: 1662
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Mr. 335 has been a staple in my music library for many decades. He can create awesome tonal and melodic lines - and he's got that cool Dumble amp thing going on. I even like his Christmas albums.
From what I've heard he is very friendly and humble.
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#2727852 - 10/14/15 02:18 AM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: SEHpicker]
skipclone 1 Offline
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Posts: 8140
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I have a `free` CD from Joe that I have not listened to, it`s still in the wrapper. It was advertised on FB and still is-except it`s not free. I would have to dig out the invoice but, aside from shipping there was some bogus charge that was slapped on-got on my nerves.
I thought, Joe, gimme a break. You don`t need this nonsense.
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#2727957 - 10/14/15 11:06 AM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: skipclone 1]
Delta Offline
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Registered: 08/18/10
Posts: 279
Loc: Ormond Beach, FL
As far as Joe's recorded work I really like Sloe Gin, The Ballad of John Henry and Different Shades of Blue along with his work with Black Country Communion. I agree that there are a lot of influences that you hear in his playing, but is that necessarily a bad thing? Being original in Blues oriented material is a tall order. I haven't a seen a lot of his live footage. I know he played in my area a few months ago at a small college concert venue. I wasn't willing to pay $150 for a decent seat.
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#2728038 - 10/14/15 08:11 PM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Fred_C]
Caevan O'Shite Offline
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Originally Posted By: Fred_C
I really enjoy inserting hip chord phrases into my Blues.

In the last few years I've gotten away from a scalar approach to soloing. I am now playing blues using "Chord Tone Soloing". I think it sounds super cool and since your thinking about chord shapes, it's easy to insert some cool rhythmic ideas. A nice, Jazzy sound.


Yeah, phrases made up of intervals and chord/arpeggio fragments, instead of focusing on scalar runs, sound cool, interesting, personal, and authentically Bluesy. Good stuff, and it can help make you stand out and not sound just like everybody else. I like to use double and triple stops here and there, as well; sometimes on adjacent strings, sometimes skipping strings in-between across the fretboard; sometimes with bends and oblique-bends, too. Nothing difficult to do, just needing a little creative thought.

Originally Posted By: CEB
The guys to me that are the pinnacle of that style are players like Robben Ford, Larry Carlton, Poppa Chubby goes there sometimes.


Check out Ronnie Earl and the Broadcasters; great classy, somewhat Jazzy, uptown Blues. cool
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#2729094 - 10/20/15 05:13 AM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Caevan O'Shite]
CEB Online   content
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Thanks.
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So can a auto Mechanic." - Stokes Hunt

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#2729173 - 10/20/15 09:58 AM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Caevan O'Shite]
Fred_C Offline
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Registered: 06/12/10
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Originally Posted By: Caevan O'Shite
Originally Posted By: Fred_C
I really enjoy inserting hip chord phrases into my Blues.

In the last few years I've gotten away from a scalar approach to soloing. I am now playing blues using "Chord Tone Soloing". I think it sounds super cool and since your thinking about chord shapes, it's easy to insert some cool rhythmic ideas. A nice, Jazzy sound.


Yeah, phrases made up of intervals and chord/arpeggio fragments, instead of focusing on scalar runs, sound cool, interesting, personal, and authentically Bluesy. Good stuff, and it can help make you stand out and not sound just like everybody else. I like to use double and triple stops here and there, as well; sometimes on adjacent strings, sometimes skipping strings in-between across the fretboard; sometimes with bends and oblique-bends, too. Nothing difficult to do, just needing a little creative thought.

Originally Posted By: CEB
The guys to me that are the pinnacle of that style are players like Robben Ford, Larry Carlton, Poppa Chubby goes there sometimes.


Check out Ronnie Earl and the Broadcasters; great classy, somewhat Jazzy, uptown Blues. cool


I agree Caev. It's not difficult, it's intuitive. You do need an understanding of where the scale tones are inside the chord shape. I like it because it's so melodic. It makes me think of Louie Armstrong or Bennie Goodman playin' Blues. Also, there's no rule that says you can't insert your favorite minor/major pentatonic ideas where appropriate, as long as you resolve to a chord tone.


I am reminded of a Charlie Parker quotation. He said, "I realized that I could play any note I wanted, as long as I resolved to a chord tone".
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#2729207 - 10/20/15 12:17 PM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Fred_C]
Griffinator Offline
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IDK, in my adventures in chromatic licks, I've discovered that resolving to a tone that so much as harmonizes agreeably with the chord works pretty well too.

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#2729230 - 10/20/15 01:36 PM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Fred_C]
Caevan O'Shite Offline
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Originally Posted By: Fred_C
Originally Posted By: Caevan O'Shite
Originally Posted By: Fred_C
I really enjoy inserting hip chord phrases into my Blues.

In the last few years I've gotten away from a scalar approach to soloing. I am now playing blues using "Chord Tone Soloing". I think it sounds super cool and since your thinking about chord shapes, it's easy to insert some cool rhythmic ideas. A nice, Jazzy sound.


Yeah, phrases made up of intervals and chord/arpeggio fragments, instead of focusing on scalar runs, sound cool, interesting, personal, and authentically Bluesy. Good stuff, and it can help make you stand out and not sound just like everybody else. I like to use double and triple stops here and there, as well; sometimes on adjacent strings, sometimes skipping strings in-between across the fretboard; sometimes with bends and oblique-bends, too. Nothing difficult to do, just needing a little creative thought.

Originally Posted By: CEB
The guys to me that are the pinnacle of that style are players like Robben Ford, Larry Carlton, Poppa Chubby goes there sometimes.


Check out Ronnie Earl and the Broadcasters; great classy, somewhat Jazzy, uptown Blues. cool


I agree Caev. It's not difficult, it's intuitive. You do need an understanding of where the scale tones are inside the chord shape. I like it because it's so melodic. It makes me think of Louie Armstrong or Bennie Goodman playin' Blues. Also, there's no rule that says you can't insert your favorite minor/major pentatonic ideas where appropriate, as long as you resolve to a chord tone.


I am reminded of a Charlie Parker quotation. He said, "I realized that I could play any note I wanted, as long as I resolved to a chord tone".


cool

Originally Posted By: Griffinator
IDK, in my adventures in chromatic licks, I've discovered that resolving to a tone that so much as harmonizes agreeably with the chord works pretty well too.


In a way, you're both essentially saying the same thing; by default, a large number of available note-choices can and will function in extended or added harmony for the given 'chord of the moment, even though that particular chord-voicing isn't immediately presented by anyone else at that moment.

Sometimes, it's hard to explain just how and why a good player can pull off using a 'wrong' note or odd timing or timbre, where another, lesser player might sound awful using the exact same notes, etc. But it happens! crazy
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#2729234 - 10/20/15 02:02 PM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Griffinator]
Fred_C Offline
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Griff,

I agree. However, I think that these tones that "harmonize agreeably with the chord" would be extensions (9th,11th,13th) and/or alterations (#5,b5,#9,b9,#11) and would therefore qualify as chord tones for these extended and altered chords.

BTW: are you enjoying the book?

Regards.
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#2729241 - 10/20/15 02:11 PM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Fred_C]
Griffinator Offline
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Originally Posted By: Fred_C
Griff,

I agree. However, I think that these tones that "harmonize agreeably with the chord" would be extensions (9th,11th,13th) and/or alterations (#5,b5,#9,b9,#11) and would therefore qualify as chord tones for these extended and altered chords.


A fair point, for sure. Caeven basically said the same thing, and I think I basically misread "chord tone" as "root" as I scanned the original quote, because I'm basically saying the same thing.

Quote:
BTW: are you enjoying the book?


Absolutely. Lots of cool concepts in there to build out my phrasing vocabulary. Worth every second I've invested in it so far.

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#2729242 - 10/20/15 02:26 PM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Caevan O'Shite]
CEB Online   content
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Originally Posted By: Caevan O'Shite
....
Sometimes, it's hard to explain just how and why a good player can pull off using a 'wrong' note or odd timing or timbre, where another, lesser player might sound awful using the exact same notes, etc. But it happens! crazy


Intent.

_________________________
"It doesn't have to be difficult to be cool" - Mitch Towne

"A great musician can bring tears to your eyes!!!
So can a auto Mechanic." - Stokes Hunt

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#2729246 - 10/20/15 02:44 PM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Griffinator]
Fred_C Offline
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Griff,

Glad to hear that you're enjoying it.

Regards.
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#2729315 - 10/20/15 07:57 PM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: CEB]
Caevan O'Shite Offline
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Loc: The Great Spirit's Handprint o...
Originally Posted By: CEB
Originally Posted By: Caevan O'Shite
....
Sometimes, it's hard to explain just how and why a good player can pull off using a 'wrong' note or odd timing or timbre, where another, lesser player might sound awful using the exact same notes, etc. But it happens! crazy


Intent.



Good call! cool
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#2729388 - 10/21/15 07:45 AM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Caevan O'Shite]
SEHpicker Offline
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John Candy on guitar? grin
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#2729398 - 10/21/15 08:00 AM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: SEHpicker]
Dannyalcatraz Offline
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Who killed John Candy
In the battle of sinners and saints
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#2729483 - 10/21/15 12:07 PM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Dannyalcatraz]
Danzilla Offline
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Registered: 01/09/04
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Originally Posted By: Dannyalcatraz
Who killed John Candy
In the battle of sinners and saints


I see what you did there. thu rawk
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#2929898 - 05/29/18 10:56 AM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: Caevan O'Shite]
d Offline
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Originally Posted By: Caevan O'Shite
Originally Posted By: Griffinator
I've checked out some of his live material, and I'm just not getting what the buzz is about this guy. Okay, so he opened for BB when he was 12. And he's released 15 studio albums, but the hour or so worth of material I've listened to so far (a live performance) sounds all pretty much the same.

He's got solid derivative (SRV/Beck) chops, but his solos lack direction, and he loves pedaling on one chord too much.

Someone please enlighten me here...


He's got considerably better than competent chops, plays with style and taste, and has great tone; but, he also doesn't seem (to me) to be inventing or even re-inventing anything. Honestly, I think most of us are in that same (latter) boat, really.

I'd certainly take him over a LOT of what's out there, and I can't help but think that he seems to be a really nice guy, who's also sort of bearing the torch for better playing and music- particularly fairly traditional Trad/Classic Blues/Rock- in beleaguered times. Much more so than, say, "Kenny G" allegedly did for Jazz, for example, who I don't care much for, to say the least. But I also have never owned any of Joe's recorded works in any format. I almost feel kinda bad about that. Almost, just a little...


I once felt same as Professor Griff, maybe more-so. I equated JB w/a less sweatified George Thorogood, i.e., all form, little function... but recently I came across this, which didn't just stop me but stomped me in my tracks.
All the emotive power I thought he lacked (ably effected, as well by Haynes) + a greater set of skills.
Dig this perf which I find electrifrying, strangely helped by the drumist & bassolator rimshot thinking they're playing Steve Miler's "The Joker". grin facepalm rawk
Intro = 0:20~1:15
1st verse = dig the "Hammond + Leslie" tone Haynes uses for a couple licks
1st break = 2:38~4:13 / bends @ 3:08 & 3:39 & the throaty octave drop @ 4:09 !!! JB be's fonky!
2nd break = 5:35~11:11 (ain't that a time ?!) / If the interplay between JB & WH don't get you the Debbil will !


I stand coverted.
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#2929910 - 05/29/18 11:27 AM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: CEB]
p90jr Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 3061
Originally Posted By: CEB
Originally Posted By: Caevan O'Shite
....
Sometimes, it's hard to explain just how and why a good player can pull off using a 'wrong' note or odd timing or timbre, where another, lesser player might sound awful using the exact same notes, etc. But it happens! crazy


Intent.



Loose as a goose, yet tight as a duck's butthole!!!

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#2929913 - 05/29/18 11:35 AM Re: Joe Bonamassa... what am I missing? [Re: d]
p90jr Offline
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Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 3061
Originally Posted By: d
Originally Posted By: Caevan O'Shite
Originally Posted By: Griffinator
I've checked out some of his live material, and I'm just not getting what the buzz is about this guy. Okay, so he opened for BB when he was 12. And he's released 15 studio albums, but the hour or so worth of material I've listened to so far (a live performance) sounds all pretty much the same.

He's got solid derivative (SRV/Beck) chops, but his solos lack direction, and he loves pedaling on one chord too much.

Someone please enlighten me here...


He's got considerably better than competent chops, plays with style and taste, and has great tone; but, he also doesn't seem (to me) to be inventing or even re-inventing anything. Honestly, I think most of us are in that same (latter) boat, really.

I'd certainly take him over a LOT of what's out there, and I can't help but think that he seems to be a really nice guy, who's also sort of bearing the torch for better playing and music- particularly fairly traditional Trad/Classic Blues/Rock- in beleaguered times. Much more so than, say, "Kenny G" allegedly did for Jazz, for example, who I don't care much for, to say the least. But I also have never owned any of Joe's recorded works in any format. I almost feel kinda bad about that. Almost, just a little...


I once felt same as Professor Griff, maybe more-so. I equated JB w/a less sweatified George Thorogood, i.e., all form, little function... but recently I came across this, which didn't just stop me but stomped me in my tracks.
All the emotive power I thought he lacked (ably effected, as well by Haynes) + a greater set of skills.
Dig this perf which I find electrifrying, strangely helped by the drumist & bassolator rimshot thinking they're playing Steve Miler's "The Joker". grin facepalm rawk
Intro = 0:20~1:15
1st verse = dig the "Hammond + Leslie" tone Haynes uses for a couple licks
1st break = 2:38~4:13 / bends @ 3:08 & 3:39 & the throaty octave drop @ 4:09 !!! JB be's fonky!
2nd break = 5:35~11:11 (ain't that a time ?!) / If the interplay between JB & WH don't get you the Debbil will !


I stand coverted.


That was very good, indeed. He should play with Haynes more often... it seems to bring out the "soul" in him.

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