Heads-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back

[Raymb1]

The SS may not be for everyone but out of everyone, (hundreds-thousands?), who has bought one, Aspen has said the return rate has been a single digit percentage. That is pretty good customer satisfaction.

[HammondDave]

The SS may not be for everyone but out of everyone, (hundreds-thousands?), who has bought one, Aspen has said the return rate has been a single digit percentage. That is pretty good customer satisfaction.

 

I think this is due to the great amount of information that this thread has generated. With few exceptions, from reading this thread people who purchase this speaker know what they are getting in advance. They know the advantages and disadvantages up front. Some have realized that it's not a perfect solution for every gig, so they have multiple sound reinforcement systems and use them according to the room and style of music they are playing that night. A very few have tried one and returned it. This could be said for most musical equipment.

 

 

[cdom]

Hi, Reezekeys. For what's it's worth...

 

My previous live rig was a pair of K10s, then K8s (easier on the ears AND back). I play a variety of keyboard parts using a Nord Stage 2 in a VERY loud cover band. I purchased the SSv3 sight-unseen/sound-unheard primary based on the opinions of the fine folks here on this forum.

 

I also use a Ventilator with the B3 organ output from the NS2. Coupled with the SS3, you would swear there's a spinning horn in an old wooden box, back there. The Nord Silver Grand is stunning. The rhodes/wurlies sound authentic. And, the real surprise for me, the string/brass programs are significantly more lush and believable in the live mix.

 

I couldn't be happier. Sound nirvana.

 

 

[SK]

... when I play a real acoustic piano, the sound is produced pretty close to my ears. I need a sense of "immediacy" for me to feel right as I'm playing. I'm not sure that having to listen to an amp that's more than a few feet from me, with the stereo spatial effect coming from sound bouncing off walls, is going to give me the immediacy that I need.

As a pianist first, I understand your concerns. I was skeptical too before I'd played through it.

 

Sound is impossible to describe, but the thing is the sound coming from the inside of a grand piano is not focused into a stereo sweet spot. It's a mass of frequencies that goes into the air - you hear it everywhere in "3D." That's really what this amp does. And sure, it will sound a little different if you're too close to it, but it still sounds present and clear everywhere, even when you're too close.

[Raymb1]

The SS may not be for everyone but out of everyone, (hundreds-thousands?), who has bought one, Aspen has said the return rate has been a single digit percentage. That is pretty good customer satisfaction.

 

I think this is due to the great amount of information that this thread has generated. With few exceptions, from reading this thread people who purchase this speaker know what they are getting in advance. They know the advantages and disadvantages up front. Some have realized that it's not a perfect solution for every gig, so they have multiple sound reinforcement systems and use them according to the room and style of music they are playing that night. A very few have tried one and returned it. This could be said for most musical equipment.

 

I have not seen them being used here in the LA rock/blues club/concert scene. Not to say the there aren't any being used, I just have not personally seen any. The keyboard players I have seen are still using powered monitors like EV, etc... Or going into FOH and monitored on stage. I know that there are musicians who will claim "I play hard rock and use one". Let's just say if I am playing with a guitar player with a Marshall cranked to "11", the SS would not be my personal choice.

 

However, if I was playing a casual on a deep stage with reasonable bandmates at moderate volume levels, a SS with a sub may just be the ticket.

 

You're right. 99% of my gigs are jazz and standards, with no need for alot of volume. For the occasional gigs where I need more volume I use QSCs. Ray

[Bill Spencer]

http://aspenandassoc.com/buy.php The cover is on this page.

 

Thanks!

 

Mine arrives Thursday ("demo" model from Sweetwater for $674). First gig will be at Monterey Aquarium on Sat- should be ideal venue for it. Rest assured I'll add my 2¢. God forbid this thread should slow down.

[zaphod betamax]

One suggestion on the CPS. Have the power switch above the inputs at the back, and not below the inputs. Makes it a bit tough to turn off and on with the input plugs in the way.

Very minor point. Does not affect its awesome sound!

[Doug Robinson]

"One suggestion on the CPS. Have the power switch above the inputs at the back, and not below the inputs. Makes it a bit tough to turn off and on with the input plugs in the way."

 

I would second this, especially if one uses the amp on its side at an angle near the floor as some do (including me).

[JohnSC]

The marketing of Spacestation v.3 on this forum should be a case study at every business school in the land. I recall Aspen struggling with his initial posting on this forum. He has been an information tour de force and a model of transparency. What fool said kids own social media? And, oh, by the way, it's a helluva little speaker, isn't it.

[Aspen]

The marketing of Spacestation v.3 on this forum should be a case study at every business school in the land. I recall Aspen struggling with his initial posting on this forum. He has been an information tour de force and a model of transparency. What fool said kids own social media? And, oh, by the way, it's a helluva little speaker, isn't it.

 

Thanks Professor John, and yes...it has been a hellava ride for me, and a case study on teaching old dogs new tricks!

 

I used to feel the need to "chime in" more often in the beginning (Season 1 & 2) but now it seems there's always a helping hand to do that for me...so thanks to you all.

 

For those who wish they could hear one before they buy I must apologize, my fault! Because as unique as my center point stereo transmission technology is, so also has been my approach to marketing it; not available in stores but only on line from A&A and my exclusive dealer partner Sweetwater Sound.

 

This certainly handicaps my sales potential, although I do not think I could build these much faster! But it does allow me to focus on building more products and giving my end users a better value, as I have nearly zero overhead in a "sales team", advertising campaign, field reps and "trainers", etc...so that means I can sell it for less to you...and also put all my profits back into customer support, and developing other new and interesting products for APD (Aspen Pittman Designs)...of which CPS is just one division.

 

In past, when I had Groove Tubes for 30 years, w/ 35 employees, 2,000 dealers and 5-6 trade shows around the world, I spent like 65% of my budget on salaries, trade shows, advertising...and maybe 10% on new product development. Also, I traveled 5-6 months a year and had no TIME to work on new projects or TALK TO MY CUSTOMERS!...the two things I love MOST about this business!

 

And then that life style almost killed me, so everything changed for me overnight. After I sold GT and went into a one year life saving treatment...I realized I could never let my life get that crazy again, should I ever decide to get back into developing products. Hence the new "less stress" approach to the APD line. For me, less is more as I focus on The One Thing!

 

So, after a year+ of wood shedding developing the Spacestation Version 3 out of my old MK2 Spacestation (off the market 8 years!), and then 10+ months on this forum after it relaunched last October (well most guys didn't get theirs until well after Christmas with our long back order condition)...this whole experience has just been pure heaven!

 

So many helpful comments and ideas from my early adopters (CPS faith partners!) on this forum have expanded the applications for the SS3 as I never imagined. I never would have imagined my little SS3 could hang so well in the medium to larger venues until I heard some of these wonderful gig reports...and until I went out to some these gigs and heard it for myself! We've got the SS3 at Disney Hall and at the Hollywood Bowl!

 

I always had faith in my technology, but I never felt I had hit the right design or the right marketing formula...until the SS3 and my partnership with the folks at Eminence USA, who really deserve the credit for the high quality build and amazing reliability, and the folks at Sweetwater who serve as my sales force and customer support arm. Now I am released to do what I love, and do best; develop new products!

 

We have come a long way in these few months, and converted a lot of musicians to enjoying the full spectrum of stereo performance that their instruments have always been capable of...but I truly believe we have just scratched the surface! The word is spreading!

 

However, I do apologize to those who would like to hear it first, so I am trying a new idea to overcome that hurdle; I just launched a new program that will allow you to "try before you buy". Check out our new "Rent a SS3" rebate program...coming soon to a rental house near you: http://www.centerpointstereo.com/rental.php

 

We just started this and I need to add more rental houses across the country. So if you have a favorite local rental house, please ask them to contact me and I'll get them set up ASAP.

 

Thanks again to all my SS3 family for your support and comments here...I am really enjoying these last 3-4 pages as you respond to the curious...as it is REALLY hard to describe the "intangibles" to someone who's never heard their KBs in 3D stereo...like trying to describe color TV to the blind...but you are doing a darn good job!

[jimkost2002]

Bless you, Aspen.

You are the best, man!

SS v3 has been a life saver for me and I am a true believer!

I will be getting a Vintage Vibe Piano in the fall and will post a report once I have put the VV/SSv3 through its paces.

[VanDerGraaf]

Well, last week I decided to join this party.

Ordered my SpaceStation from Thomann last Monday.

Feeling that I needed backup (I play in a rocking wedding band with teeth), I ordered an HK 210A sub to go with it...things that attracted me to that were 600W RMS, 2x10" (a better keys fit than 1x12"?), and built in variable crossover. Tiny vertical footprint too. Laid horizontal in the picture below, it has feet on the side and bottom- nice touch).

 

No-one has mentioned this one before but I thought it might well be an ideal companion so took the plunge.

 

I was delighted when all of the stuff turned up before this weekend's gigs.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v667/VanDerGraaf1974/90823075-cc7d-4086-ab33-a25de56f1619.jpg

Took a risk and decided to leave my usual rig of 2 QSC K12's in the warehouse storage. Leap of faith.

 

Well, I can safely say that those QSC's will be going up for sale soon.

 

I am so much happier overall wth the presentation of my live sound through the SSV3. So much more detail, not to mention the spread effect, that width control really can change things tonally and I can see that there is some experimentation yet to be done to get the best from this thing.

 

One thing also that I noticed is the timing. First night playing through it, I just felt that my time was a little off. The snappy response of the smaller speakers let me know more accurately where I am in the music.

2nd night, became used to it and felt right back in the groove.

I wonder if the DSP calculations going on inside the K12 induces the merest delay, and maybe makes them feel less connected when I play...?

 

Conclusion- this little box is not only sounding better than the K12's but is also making my playing more accurate and tighter.

 

And lastly...I'm having a lot more FUN! Because I love the sound I'm getting! With the sub taking the strain at under 110Hz (will experiment with that crossover point), I've got all the power I need from this combo. High notes with fast Leslie from my Numa Organ 2 just sing out like never before! It all makes me feel more alive on stage and a real part of the music.

 

The other guy in the band who has ears and gives a crap agrees that it sounds a lot better too.

 

Thanks Aspen for designing this (BIG-sounding) little thing! It's changed gigging for me overnight. I wonder if I'm the first adopter in Scotland? It's nice being a pioneer!

 

Rohan

 

[hardware]

Thought somebody used my room in between gigs while I was gone.

Exact powered K12s I had before the SSv3 too, room colors kind of caught my eye though.

 

FWIW don't sell the QSC K12's.

They are excellent dual wedge vocal monitors when set on their sides.

 

Don't use a sub though.

Sucks too much gain from my chain...

Fortunate for me I work with some skillful Bassists.

On occasion a low Tom Saywer-ish drone reminds them

that I can easily silence them whenever I want.

Little 8 inch woofer from Kentucky has heart...

 

http://s15.postimg.org/cehfihqt7/IMG_0743.jpg

image upload no limit

[Bill Spencer]

I did some research and learned that the same technology was used in the Fender "SFX" kybd amp a while back. Any of you ever gig with one of those?

 

I actually tried one and didn't care for the sound, plus it was noisy.

 

I trust the SS is better. (mine arrives tomorrow!)

[Raymb1]

I did some research and learned that the same technology was used in the Fender "SFX" kybd amp a while back. Any of you ever gig with one of those?

 

I actually tried one and didn't care for the sound, plus it was noisy.

 

I trust the SS is better. (mine arrives tomorrow!)

 

Aspen was involved in the SFX. Check out the beginning of this thread.

 

[Aspen]

And lastly...I'm having a lot more FUN! Because I love the sound I'm getting! With the sub taking the strain at under 110Hz (will experiment with that crossover point), I've got all the power I need from this combo. High notes with fast Leslie from my Numa Organ 2 just sing out like never before! It all makes me feel more alive on stage and a real part of the music.

 

The other guy in the band who has ears and gives a crap agrees that it sounds a lot better too.

 

Thanks Aspen for designing this (BIG-sounding) little thing! It's changed gigging for me overnight. I wonder if I'm the first adopter in Scotland? It's nice being a pioneer! Rohan

 

Hey Rohan, first off THANKS for your GREAT gig report and kind words, much appreciated.

 

And that HK sub looks more than up to the task...first I've heard of it but we don't see that brand over here much.

 

Lastly, to you your question about being the first CPS "Braveheart" in Scotland; well yes, to my knowledge you are! Thanks for taking that leap of faith, and be sure to let the good folks at Thomann know your happy experiences, I am depending on them (alone) to supply the growing the CPS 3D stereo choir over there in Euro land!

[Bill Spencer]

I did some research and learned that the same technology was used in the Fender "SFX" kybd amp a while back. Any of you ever gig with one of those?

 

I actually tried one and didn't care for the sound, plus it was noisy.

 

I trust the SS is better. (mine arrives tomorrow!)

 

Aspen was involved in the SFX. Check out the beginning of this thread.

 

Yes, that's where I got the info. My implied question was: Why didn't that amp get the same reception that the SS is getting?

 

Any of you check that amp out at the time?

[Al Quinn]

I don't have experience with the Fender SFX amp but I did buy an earlier version of the SS. I think it was about ten years ago. Returned it within a day. Although I heard the 3D effect and liked it, the audio quality fell short of my needs. Because of this experience I was hesitant to buy the SS V3. But with all the positive feedback on this thread I ended up buying one and am very happy.

[rickp]

I did some research and learned that the same technology was used in the Fender "SFX" kybd amp a while back. Any of you ever gig with one of those?

 

I actually tried one and didn't care for the sound, plus it was noisy.

 

I trust the SS is better. (mine arrives tomorrow!)

Aspen was involved in the SFX. Check out the beginning of this thread.

Yes, that's where I got the info. My implied question was: Why didn't that amp get the same reception that the SS is getting?

 

Any of you check that amp out at the time?

I don't think it got the same reception for several reasons, especially its size and weight and expense relative to the time, but the primary one for me was sound. It just never seemed to me that Fender became serious enough about keyboard amps to develop or use speakers and amp circuitry more attuned to keyboards rather than guitar.

 

I played a FenderRhodes 73 through a Fender Super Reverb and Fender Vibratone for several years and that combo worked great for that, but as keyboards with APs and stereo patches appeared and advanced, that combo starting falling a bit flat for anything other than EPs, and the SFX didn't seem appreciably better to me at the time it came out. It's development might have very well suffered primarily from the lack of abundant stereo boards (and therefore lack of demand) and lack of quality patches to show its stuff as much as anything.

 

To my thinking in hindsight, ironically, it was probably so far ahead of its time that it wasn't/couldn't be fully appreciated - so it was dropped before it could benefit from being developed further and upgraded along the way.

 

And it didn't seem very powerful either. At the time I looked at it, I ended up buying two USA made Fender Princeton Chorus amps based on the guitar guys' raves about them, put 2 10" JBL D110s in each and had an amp tech change out caps, etc., in the circuitry to expand its capacity beyond guitar frequency biases, and love everything about those little guys except their weight. Still use them sometimes for outdoor stuff (the metal cones make me feel nostalgic). But their weight plus stage area and hauling space requirements make them impractical for frequent use.

 

The SS3, as opposed to the SFX, is designed with a very manageable size and weight (actually remarkably light given its components) with speakers, amp designs and crossover points optimal for modern keyboards, and is debuting with a reasonable price at a time when there is an abundance of keyboards and voices to take full advantage of and show off its capabilities, which creates a stir, which in turn creates a demand - all of which the SFX lacked.

 

And, the SS3 is much more versatile. In addition to using it as a keyboard amp, I've used it as a rear-firing monitor for a trio setup using stereo mains (one monitor is all that's needed with it, plus the surround effect bleeds into the audience), and as near-center sound reinforcement (positioned front-center stage, facing audience, running stereo between stereo QSC K system). Some of the guys here have used it as a PA. The SFX couldn't have suitably served those additional functions.

 

Anyway, in answer to your question, those are my impressions re the SFX vs. SS3 for what they're worth. Some of the tech guys may have far better answers.

[MathOfInsects]

Today's spot-the-SS3 includes a bonus third-tier "analog" board in my rig.

 

http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab67/mathofinsects/analog_zpsujycb3vm.jpg

[Aspen]

I did some research and learned that the same technology was used in the Fender "SFX" kybd amp a while back. Any of you ever gig with one of those?

 

I actually tried one and didn't care for the sound, plus it was noisy.

 

I trust the SS is better. (mine arrives tomorrow!)

 

Yes, better on all counts!

 

I licensed the CPS patent first to Fender, about 15 years ago while my patent was still "pending". And in that deal I insisted they make 3 products (in return for an exclusive); a KB amp, a satellite version that could be used with any guitar amp that had a FX loop, and the one they really wanted the technology for...an acoustic electric guitar amp.

 

Well, the SFX (Stereo Field Expansion...their TM for the CPS technology) acoustic guitar amp did VERY well. It had a 42% market share, received a TEC nomination and won product of the year from the joint international press at the International Musik Messe in Frankfurt (those Euro guys "got it", while the TEC award went to the 2nd edition of the EVH guitar...go figure).

 

But the SFX Satellite and SFX 200 KB amp were comparative commercial flops, for different reasons.

 

The Satellite was just too hard to use, nobody "got it". Guitar players need to keep it simple, and also not too many stereo FX back then (circa 2000).

 

The Fender SFX 200KB amp should have been a slam dunk, but it had several catastrophic design flaws (IMHO). First most was the black carpet covering (like cheap PA speakers of the day) that collected more lint than a clothes dryer after a few weeks in the store. It also had a 12" guitar speaker woofer, a Piezo tweeter for the high end (think scratchy caulk board), and 3 channels w/ a ton of EQ + stereo FX on every channels, including a vocal mic channel. The problem was, it sounded like a cheap PA w/ a piezo brittle high end....and there was absolutely no "modeling". Even in those days, many (if not most) KBs were stereo and were good enough sounding to record direct! IMHO, they should have just given mixing levels and nothing more...KBs didn't NEED a bunch of EQ OR stereo reverb and chorus (and still don't!).

 

So today Fender is working on the 3rd evolution of a SFX acoustic guitar amp (thank the Lord!), due out in the next few months. But they have lost all interest in building another KB amp. They see themselves as a guitar company first and foremost.

 

So I decided to take a 3rd bite at tha Apple, an it seems we finally hit the mark. BTW, this v.3 third version underwent extensive testing and computer modeling to deliver a truly wide appeal product with world class audio quaity...and NO stereo FX or equaizers!

 

But it is only available from Sweetwater OR Thomann...you can't buy one from a Fender dealer.

 

Now that you know the Fender SFX history, I'll close w/ this; Fender never asked me once what these should have as features, or asked my input on the audio design. So other than licensing my patent to them, I had nothing to do with any part of those designs.

 

That is something I regret, and also regret they didn't have sucsess with their KB amp like their guitar amps....I really wante them yo make a tube SFX KB amp!. IMHO, t was a Golden opportunity lost, as there was a demand then (and still now) for a stereo transmission that works, for all those stereo engines out there!

[Bill Spencer]

Thanks for the great reply, Aspen!

 

That was exactly my impression of the SFX200KB. I was so excited when I saw it, as I've always run stereo and been on the lookout for a more convenient option than a stereo PA. After my local music store (remember those?) let me try it out I had to reluctantly admit it wouldn't cut it. Unlike others, I could never stand playing anything through a guitar amp, even a Fender Rhodes.

 

I got my SS3 Thursday from Sweetwater (it came with a cover- is that standard? If so, should be noted), and will use it on my gig tonight at the Monterey Bay Aquarium. This is billed as an "unplugged" show, Acoustic Guitar, Upright Bass, vocals (small PA), and me with my Kurz PC3k and the SS amp (acoustic piano sounds only allowed). Should be a good test, a big very live room- all concrete and glass.

 

Tomorrow night, a private event with a full dance band in a ballroom. I'll report back here next week.

 

Excited again.

 

Spence

[David Loving]

I got to quit reading this thread. I'll end up buying one of these!

[RandyFF]

PLEASE RESPOND NOW, IM ABOUT TO ORDER AND NEED ADVICE! Thanks!

 

I've followed this thread for the first 70 pages but not since. I play in outdoor jam sessions so I'm concerned about it not having reflective surfaces to bounce off of. Also, the minimal setup is preferred cause I'm schlepping a keyboard, hand drums, pa, mic stand, car battery, etc., in one trip, so portable/ minimal is good!

 

? Being outside, what's going to do the best job of supporting the 3d sound: an amp stand (with the side speaker pointin down)or a L shaped Plexiglases/plywood "portable walls" setup? If an amp stand, which one?

 

? CPS bag recommended?

 

? Smallest mixer with fx?

 

? Any other advice on getting the 3d sound outside?

 

Thanks!

 

[Raymb1]

This is the amp stand I use:

http://www.guitarcenter.com/Gator/Combo-Amp-Stand.gc

If you're outside and on a stage, then the amp stand is a must. The stage itself is a reflecting surface. I use a small Behringer mixer. I don't need effects as all my patches have built in effects.

[RandyFF]

Thanks for the reply!

 

I'm not on a stage, its usually pavement or grass. I need the mixer with effects for voice.

[Raymb1]

At times I've used a piece of plywood or a stiff surfaced tarp for the side speaker to reflect off of. Pavement makes a good reflecting surface.

[Bosco Adama]

Unfortunately I'll probably be putting my CPS SSv3 up for sale soon. It has only been used in my music room and played lightly and rarely. I received it in the late January - early February shipment from SW. Perfect condition. Please PM if interested.

[mak1457]

I don't know if I'm putting this correctly but has anyone discovered an ideal setup to fatten up the sound of a "clonewheel" used with the SSv3 any more than it is already (or make the sound larger, I don't know). Just so people don't read me wrong, I don't think the SS is bad. I'd just like to "fatten up" the sound more to help me feel like I'm next a full-size Leslie. Would a bass-combo amp be the answer? Or maybe a large subwoofer?

[Raymb1]

I don't know if I'm putting this correctly but has anyone discovered an ideal setup to fatten up the sound of a "clonewheel" used with the SSv3 any more than it is already (or make the sound larger, I don't know). Just so people don't read me wrong, I don't think the SS is bad. I'd just like to "fatten up" the sound more to help me feel like I'm next a full-size Leslie. Would a bass-combo amp be the answer? Or maybe a large subwoofer?

 

You might need this: http://music.ashbysolutions.com/vent.htm