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#2841984 - 03/15/17 02:26 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: AnotherScott]
OrpheusNY Online   content
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Who would have thought the plot would thicken like this after 175 pages?

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#2841987 - 03/15/17 02:35 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: OrpheusNY]
davedoerfler Offline
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It's the KC version of "New Coke". laugh
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#2841988 - 03/15/17 02:41 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: AnotherScott]
Dave Bryce Administrator Offline
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Originally Posted By: AnotherScott
So if you had to do it again, would you

a) stick with the v3 at the higher weight
b) go with the v5 anyway because, to you, the advantages of the v3 are not worth the extra weight
c) skip the SS entirely, because the v3 is too heavy for you, and the v5 is too sonically compromised for you?

I love the v3 to bits. May be my favorite combo amp ever. It was not too heavy for me - was less than my Motion Sound - although it was certainly more than one would expect from something that size.

I got the v5 because I blew a driver on my v3, so Aspen took the opportunity to give me a new one. I admit - I jumped at the opportunity to get a lighter unit (why not, right?), but if I had any idea of the difference in sound, I most likely would not have taken the v5.

Originally Posted By: davedoerfler
So how long are you gonna let your amp live in TO?

Hopefully until after my next gig. grin

dB
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#2841994 - 03/15/17 03:09 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: AnotherScott]
zxcvbnm098 Offline
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My personal take on the weight of the v3 unit is, while it is kind of a heavy little bugger, it's such small package that it's less of an issue because of the ergonomics. When I carry mine, my arm holding it is pretty close to my body. At least for me, that feels like less of a strain than something bigger and more cumbersome. YMMV...

I'll leave the unit with dB for a week or so if any other local peeps are interested A/Bing them together. And if that's OK with dB of course.....



Edited by zxcvbnm098 (03/15/17 03:14 PM)

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#2841996 - 03/15/17 03:19 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: zxcvbnm098]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: zxcvbnm098
I'll leave the unit with dB for a week or so if any other local peeps are interested A/Bing them together. And if that's OK with dB of course.....

So, how far away does Aspen live? ;-)
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#2841997 - 03/15/17 03:24 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: zxcvbnm098]
Dave Bryce Administrator Offline
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Originally Posted By: zxcvbnm098
My personal take on the weight of the v3 unit is, while it is kind of a heavy little bugger, it's such small package that it's less of an issue because of the ergonomics. When I carry mine, my arm holding it is pretty close to my body. At least for me, that feels like less of a strain than something bigger and more cumbersome. YMMV...

I carry mine in a rolling case for an 8 channel PA head, so - as previously mentioned - the weight wasn't that big a deal to me.

Quote:
I'll leave the unit with dB for a week or so if any other local peeps are interested A/Bing them together. And if that's OK with dB of course.....

Sure... thu

dB
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#2842452 - 03/17/17 10:38 AM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: Dave Bryce]
zaphod betamax Offline
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Sorry, what is the V5?
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#2842480 - 03/17/17 11:53 AM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: zaphod betamax]
Dave Bryce Administrator Offline
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I believe there have been two different revisions since the v3 was released. One took the weight down a few pounds - I'm not sure of the specifics, or of any other changes to the electronics or drivers. The latest version took the weight down a bunch more - again, not sure of the specifics of other changes to any electronics or drivers, if any. The v3's output jack weren't sealed, so it has an issue with air coming through it with high volume/low frequency program material. That has been fixed in the current rev.

While there has been no official name change, we've been referring to them that way to keep straight which one we're talking about.

dB
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#2842525 - 03/17/17 03:58 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: Dave Bryce]
MotiDave Offline
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so the experts are advising that improvements to the v3 made it ... worse? huh. that is a thickening plot indeed!
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#2842530 - 03/17/17 04:30 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: MotiDave]
Dave Bryce Administrator Offline
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Originally Posted By: MotiDave
so the experts are advising that improvements to the v3 made it ... worse? huh. that is a thickening plot indeed!

I dont know about "experts", but I definitely prefer the v3. In no way do I claim to speak for everyone, though. YMMV... idk

I'm not sure too many people will even get the opportunity to compare the two, so I imagine it won't be much of an issue. As I've said a few times - the v5 still sounds like a Space Station. thu

dB
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#2842532 - 03/17/17 05:11 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: Dave Bryce]
davedoerfler Offline
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hard for me to believe that I have had my CPS SS3 for 2 years now. Time passes quickly for me. Guess mine is the original v3.
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#2842737 - 03/18/17 07:25 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: davedoerfler]
cphollis Offline
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Same here. Solid unit, no complaints.
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#2842870 - 03/19/17 12:51 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: cphollis]
Nadroj Offline
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My old Behringer packed in after 5 years of faithful service. I'm not gigging as much now, but I still need a monitor and something to go through at home when I'm not plugged into headphones.

The SSv3 (or 5, whatever!) would be perfect, but with my buying a Kronos at the end of the month, I'm not sure I can afford it. Are there any alternatives similar to the V3 that could get me by for the next year or so? I got on fine with my tiny Behringer, but would like something with a bit more oomph. Due to space issues, carrying around 2 PA speakers for monitoring simply isn't an option. Any thoughts?
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#2842875 - 03/19/17 01:07 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: Nadroj]
davedoerfler Offline
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Originally Posted By: Nadroj
Any thoughts?


None that would help based on what you posted. You are in a conundrum. idk
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#2842895 - 03/19/17 03:13 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: davedoerfler]
midinut Offline
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So I haz a question. If v3 is considered the first generation, v4 the second with slightly less weight, and v5 the current, any ideas where the serial numbers break so we know which one we have? I'm pretty sure mine is a v3 but am curious. I suppose I could slap it on the scales and check the weight.

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#2842904 - 03/19/17 04:54 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: midinut]
AnotherScott Offline
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Originally Posted By: midinut
So I haz a question. If v3 is considered the first generation, v4 the second with slightly less weight, and v5 the current, any ideas where the serial numbers break so we know which one we have? I'm pretty sure mine is a v3 but am curious. I suppose I could slap it on the scales and check the weight.

Get on a scale with and without it. Based on an earlier post from Aspen:

first gen of the v3 = approx 41 lbs
2nd gen of the v3 ("v4") approx 39 lbs
3rd gen of the v3 ("v5") approx 32 lbs
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#2842916 - 03/19/17 06:06 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: AnotherScott]
slowtraveler Offline
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In a post on 12/22/16, Aspen said that production run #9 of the SS3 was the first to incorporate the new digital switching power supply and plywood cabinet construction that characterize what we now call v.5. I don't think he mentioned the exact dates of production run #9, but his last post on KC (dated 2/3/17) offered this guidance regarding dates and serial numbers:

Originally Posted By: Aspen
Originally Posted By: NBrooks
Hi Aspen,
Could you let us know please how we would identify the 'new' SSv3s (the lighter ones) for when they appear in retail chains...e.g. is there a serial number run to be looking out for?

The last 4 digits of the serial number tell you the month and year of it's production; so Run #10 made in October of last year will read '1016'.

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#2843224 - 03/20/17 05:18 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: slowtraveler]
John Tweed Offline
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I've had my SS3 for two years now, and it's served me well during that time. Unfortunately the sub out has stopped working. It's not a showstopper for me, as there are other ways, but it'd be handy neverthlees.

As I recall someone posted instructions as to how to get the amp out of the box, somewhere in the last 176 pages. Could somone repost that info if possible - save me the effort of trawling thru the thread. Many thanks in advance.
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#2844169 - 03/23/17 11:42 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: John Tweed]
John Tweed Offline
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Take heart folks, Aspen might be banned but he's still watching over us! He contacted me outside of the forum after seeing my post and sent me the instructions I was asking for. He also pointed out that the schematics for all his designs are available at https://aspenandassoc.com/schematics/

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#2844269 - 03/24/17 10:31 AM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: Dave Bryce]
garnermike Offline
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Registered: 09/21/11
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Loc: Garner NC
Hey, Dave.

If you go back to the original post that started this thread (Page #1, June 2014), you see that it was mine. I haven't been on KC for a long time (long story).
Anyway, I just saw that you had to ban Aspen. That's too bad. But rules are rules.
Just wanted to reinforce your comment that Aspen is "easy to find." He certainly is, and I have always found him accessible via direct email and phone calls.
Thanks for moderating this site, and also for contributing to this humungous SpaceStation thread!

Garnermike


Edited by garnermike (03/24/17 11:59 AM)
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#2844276 - 03/24/17 11:05 AM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: cphollis]
MathOfInsects Offline
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Originally Posted By: davedoerfler
hard for me to believe that I have had my CPS SS3 for 2 years now. Time passes quickly for me. Guess mine is the original v3.

Originally Posted By: cphollis
Same here. Solid unit, no complaints.


Same. I got mine from Aspen's shop that Jan '15 just after NAMM. They were back-ordered in delivering to SW, so I imagine that makes mine one of the first dozen or two deployed. Just lent it out yesterday to a guitarist/singer who came back raving about the sound, and the familiar report that FOH pulled him out completely for the second set because it was doing such a nice job filling the large space on its own. I tend to buy early and "niche" with the intent for long miles, and this speaker has rewarded that tendency in spades.
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#2844287 - 03/24/17 11:31 AM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: MathOfInsects]
HammondDave Offline
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Are you guys still talking about this?...

I guess I will check back in another year....


Edited by HammondDave (03/24/17 11:32 AM)
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#2844292 - 03/24/17 11:55 AM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: HammondDave]
cphollis Offline
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It's still an active topic. People who discover it are curious and want to ask all sorts of questions, despite the enormous amount that's been written already.
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#2844337 - 03/24/17 02:40 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: John Tweed]
davedoerfler Offline
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Originally Posted By: John Tweed
Take heart folks, Aspen might be banned but he's still watching over us! He contacted me outside of the forum after seeing my post


Awww, I'm telling. cop grin
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#2844339 - 03/24/17 02:49 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: davedoerfler]
hardware Offline
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Can we have another thread after the XL this summer?
I'll share pics of my Quad SSv3 stack with QSC Dual 18" Sub and stereo XL satellites....
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#2844386 - 03/24/17 07:28 PM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: hardware]
cphollis Offline
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Registered: 10/05/13
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Loc: Massachussets, Florida
I'm still kind of hesitant on the XL. Yeah, I get the concept, and lord knows I'm a huge fan of the SSv3.

But I'm not sure the concept scales, especially vs. other alternatives. There's a high-fidelity thing that sort of matters at that price point vs. sheer volume.

We'll see. Aspen has proven me wrong before, let's see if he can do it again.
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#2846184 - 04/01/17 03:02 AM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: cphollis]
NBrooks Offline
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In case any European friends are wondering, I enquired directly with Thomann and they said the ones they have in stock are all from August 2016, so on this basis it doesn't sound like they have any of the 'v5s'.

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#2846206 - 04/01/17 06:41 AM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: NBrooks]
slowtraveler Offline
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Registered: 03/07/13
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Loc: Boston, MA
Originally Posted By: NBrooks
In case any European friends are wondering, I enquired directly with Thomann and they said the ones they have in stock are all from August 2016, so on this basis it doesn't sound like they have any of the 'v5s'.

Did Thomann provide information based on unit serial numbers, or on the dates they received shipments? Based on Aspen's previous posts regarding production runs and serial numbers, I'd suspect that SpaceStation units with serial numbers ending in "0816" (assuming any such units exist) could actually be from production run #9, which Aspen described as the first run to incorporate the "v5" changes.

Unless he's made public statements elsewhere about the relevant dates and serial number ranges, weight may be the only reliable way (other than internal inspection) to characterize SS units produced during 2016.

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#2847606 - 04/07/17 09:20 AM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: slowtraveler]
tfort Offline
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Registered: 05/06/16
Posts: 81
I've been looking at the Spacestation, primarily for acoustic piano sounds in smaller spaces. I was worried that the new version might not be as good for that purpose, so wrote Aspen for his take. He responded the next day.

First of all, what the thread has been calling v3 and v4 he considers the same, and what the thread has been calling v5 he likes to call the "SS3 Lite." He thinks the SS3 Lite sounds essentially the same, if not better, than it did before. From his email to me:

Quote:
"First off, there has only ever been ONE SS3 amp, nothing had changed in the first 8 runs except a very few minor improvements like adding a cover, one side speaker additional hi pass filter and an increasing of the wire lengths on a few cable assemblies for easier servicing. And, none of these 'fixes' changed the weight at all. These first 8 runs of my SS3 amps (so called because it was the 3rd version of the Spacestation) all weighed about 39 lbs from the start. There was some confusion as our first spec sheet we packed with the v.3 used a weight spec from the old SS MK2 spec sheet that showed 42 lbs. That was the weight of the old MK2, not the new SS3. There were no SS v.3 amps that weighed 42 lbs. Sorry about that, it was a misprint on the early spec sheet and also that spec went up on the Sweetwater page too.

Then with run #9, which arrived here late last year, I significantly upgraded the SS3 in two ways;
1) we switched over to a DPSU (Digital Power Supply Unit) replacing the heavier and less efficient linear power transformer. FYI, the power supply is NOT in the audio chain, but is the component that converts external AC wall current to internal DC current that supplies the audio amps. Think of this as a better battery...nothing more.
And 2) we changed over from particle board (MDF) to plywood for the cabinet...to add strength and prevent stripping of screws that held things together....as we had some complaints about that.

We didn't do these upgrades to lighten the SS3, but to improve it's performance and durability...but the fact that we lost about 7 lbs, now weighing in about 32 lbs...was an additional benefit."



I asked Aspen about whether the original SSv3 might be better than the the SS3 Lite for acoustic piano reproduction, and he strongly believed no:

Quote:
Logically speaking, there really should be NO difference b/w the latest run and all previous SS3 runs because we did not change ANY of the critical audio path components; Run #9 has EXACTLY the same speakers, same amps, and same design. Then also, the new and better DSPU actually had higher supply ratings. It is possible the lighter weight cab could make a small difference in the extreme low frequency of the SS3, but since the SS3 is not really a sub cabinet it is not noticed at all.



I asked him specifically about any muddiness/lack of midrange clarity and lower SPL in the SS3 Lite, and he said they did extensive testing before moving forward with the changes and their testing didn't show anything like that (he even forwarded me some testing numbers). His best guess was that a midrange driver on that particular unit might be loose, but he was a bit baffled to be honest.

Aspen was very responsive to concerns that the new lighter model was in any way sonically inferior than before. He offered a money back guarantee on the SS3 Lite, and offered to pay for shipping both ways if I wanted to try one on a gig, or arrange a loaner if I lived near a retail partner (I don't). He extended that offer to any forum members.

I'm not in a rush to buy anything right now, but all in all I feel reassured that the SS3 Lite is probably no worse than before and is likely still the best amplification option for what I'd need. I'd still like to compare one directly against some of the less expensive line array systems, but on price and potential benefits with stereo patches I think I'm leaning toward the Spacestation.

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#2847635 - 04/07/17 10:52 AM Re: Head's-up: SpaceStation keyboard amp is apparently back [Re: tfort]
Dave Bryce Administrator Offline
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Aspen did contact me and offer to try and figure out what was happening with my unit/get me a new one...but only if I let him back on to the forum. I had to decline.

I know what I hear, guys. My band noticed it (multiple members, without being told). My wife noticed it. zxcvbnm098 noticed it. I have yet to show it to someone who didn't notice it. Both units were here for close to two weeks for anyone who wanted to come over and listen for themselves; moreover, I have nothing to gain by reporting what I'm hearing other than to share my experience of having had both versions. I want the newer one I have to sound like the older one... idk

I do not believe the midrange driver on my unit is loose. That doesn't sound like what I'm hearing at all. It sounds like the unit is working too hard somewhere, and that the dynamic range has changed. It's especially noticeable when I play piano in the midrange - it's almost like the program hasn't got a lot of velocity response. When zxcvbnm098 was here, we listened to the exact same program on both versions of SS, then upstairs in my studio on the PA that's up there. The difference was not subtle.

For the record, the low frequency response is not an issue.

dB
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