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#2425056 - 07/11/12 07:04 PM Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)?
mahinty Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/11/11
Posts: 95
Loc: New Zealand
Has anybody out there in KC land had any experience with Reaper DAW software?

I’ve just ditched my old Windows PC (which had Cubase on it) and have moved to a MacBook Pro and now need a new DAW.

The price of Reaper has definitely got me curious. A friend downloaded the trial version and said it ran pretty sweetly.

It just sounds too good to be true. But perhaps it is cheap AND good - there are some very favourable reviews here:
http://www.reaper.fm/reviews.php

Any horror stories out there?

Any drawbacks that I should be aware of?

Any other software package recommendations, that are a sharp price or free (and aren't GarageBand!)? I need to be able to record actual instruments as well as have MIDI/VST instrument tracks.

Cheers!
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#2425057 - 07/11/12 07:37 PM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: mahinty]
Cygnus64 Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 02/18/07
Posts: 4019
Loc: Cleveland
Originally Posted By: mahinty


The price of Reaper has definitely got me curious. A friend downloaded the trial version and said it ran pretty sweetly.





Any drawbacks that I should be aware of?




It doesn't have score/notation view, which is a must for me but maybe not for most users. It also doesn't come with the gazillion vstis that many DAWs have (and is reflected in the low price).

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#2425068 - 07/11/12 08:38 PM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Cygnus64]
Geoff Grace Offline
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Registered: 08/13/02
Posts: 8701
If you collaborate at all with other people, then it's sometimes best to choose the DAW they are already using. That's certainly the path of least resistance—unless the DAW they use is a bad fit for you.

I know people who love Reaper, but I've never tried it because there was no QuickTime or sync to picture support when I last checked.

My understanding is that the features Reaper has are well-implemented, but it still has some catching up to do in a few areas. That said, I believe Cockos are constantly updating the program; so Reaper is probably growing at a more continual rate—and perhaps even faster—than its competition.

If you're interested in the program and it has the features you need, then it probably makes sense to give it a try for yourself and see what you think.

Best,

Geoff
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#2425070 - 07/11/12 08:55 PM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Geoff Grace]
Magpel Offline
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Registered: 02/07/01
Posts: 7281
Loc: New Paltz,NY,UNITED STATES
long time Reaper user here. Switched from Sonar a long ways back. Also work a lot with Pro Tools. Reaper is awesome--stable, efficient, flexible and intuitive routing, great host. The only question is always whether the "paradigm shift" time involved in switching DAWs is worth i.
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#2425072 - 07/11/12 09:10 PM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Magpel]
kelp Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/24/10
Posts: 274
Loc: Milwaukee, WI USA
+1 on REAPER. It's my main DAW.

As mentioned, it doesn't install with GBs of content and VSTi's. It does has some great effects (albeit with less-than-glamorous UI's). This makes it perfect for my needs.

It's MIDI implementation is often criticized. And no score editor.

Very stable. Very small install footprint. Super quick launch time.

The developers (Cockos) and the community (forums) are what make it so great. Tons of help available from very experienced people there.

The one caution is that it's made to be customized. If you are quick to learn new software and like to operate as a power user (shortcut keys, macros, etc.) there's hardly a better tool on the market. But if that kind of stuff baffles you and you need to have very obvious buttons and simple functions then the learning curve may be a bit daunting.

I came from Cubase, which I still respect, but for $60 + speed + power + community it's a winner for me.

It doesn't touch Pro Tools in terms of user base but it has been getting some higher profile press. Sound On Sound magazine now features a column on it and often uses screenshots from it in their Mix Rescue column.
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#2425093 - 07/12/12 12:53 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: kelp]
therealvicz Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/20/10
Posts: 335
Loc: Shropshire, UK
Hard to beat Logic Pro Ģ140 in the OSX App store
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#2425096 - 07/12/12 02:25 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: therealvicz]
midinut Offline
Platinum Member

Registered: 08/18/03
Posts: 1097
Loc: North Carolina
Still using Cubase on a older PC too that is starting to show its age. Been considering jumping to a Mac Mini as well. Cubase is supported on the Mac, right? Depending on which version you're running (I'm on 5 looking to upgrade to 6.5). I'm also concerneed that all the last 10 years of Cubase PC files I've recorded wont be recognizable in Cubase for the Mac.

I looked at and tried Reaper about 5 years ago to help my nephew get into recording cheap and haven't touched it since. He seems to like it though.

I also, in considering the Mac platform, have considered that Logic at $200 is a hell of a deal for what all you get. After all, it's going to cost me that to upgrade Cubase. But I do like it ... and am used to the workflow.
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#2425138 - 07/12/12 07:03 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: kelp]
Al Coda Offline
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Registered: 08/31/08
Posts: 2668
Loc: DE
Originally Posted By: kelp

It's MIDI implementation is often criticized. And no score editor.

Very stable. Very small install footprint. Super quick launch time.


Reaper is a cool application, but I donīt know how good it works on Mac.

On Windows XP (probably also Win7) itīs extremely stable and very ASIO efficient when it comes to spreading load on multiple cores.
It also runs plugins "firewalled" on demand.

SWS Extensions are a must for studio work.
But I also think itīs ideal as a live host w/ itīs amazingly small footprint allowing portable install on a USB stick incl. all itīs plugins and your most prefered CPU lightweight VST plugins,- and it is by far the fastest loading host Iīve ever seen.

Itīs a fast growing application and as long thereīs no score editor,- use an external one like Musescore (free !).
If you want hi end scoring, Finale or Sibelius are the ones to use anyway.

Reaper version 4.25 will be a huge update next days and it got MIDI love w/ the previous updates already.
The times of 16 MIDI channels only for Rewire are over p.ex..

I expect weīll see a MIDI score editor sooner or later.

A.C.
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#2425139 - 07/12/12 07:04 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: midinut]
Geoff Grace Offline
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Registered: 08/13/02
Posts: 8701
Originally Posted By: midinut
Still using Cubase on a older PC too that is starting to show its age. Been considering jumping to a Mac Mini as well. Cubase is supported on the Mac, right? Depending on which version you're running (I'm on 5 looking to upgrade to 6.5). I'm also concerneed that all the last 10 years of Cubase PC files I've recorded wont be recognizable in Cubase for the Mac.

I looked at and tried Reaper about 5 years ago to help my nephew get into recording cheap and haven't touched it since. He seems to like it though.

I also, in considering the Mac platform, have considered that Logic at $200 is a hell of a deal for what all you get. After all, it's going to cost me that to upgrade Cubase. But I do like it ... and am used to the workflow.

IIRC, there was a period during which Cubase Mac development and support lagged behind the PC version; but I believe those days are over and there is parity between the PC and Mac versions of the program now.

I'd be shocked if the Mac version of Cubase couldn't open your old PC Cubase files, so I'd expect your Cubase experience to be essentially the same on a Mac as on a PC—that is, other than the key command differences between operating systems.

Personally, I like Logic better than Cubase. I used to own both programs, but I eventually stopped upgrading Cubase because I wasn't using it at all. I'd recommend Logic to you, but you wouldn't be able to open your old Cubase files in Logic. Of course, there are workarounds—you could save your old files in the SMF (Standard MIDI File) format and import the SMF and any audio files into Logic. But that would require opening the files in Cubase first, so you might want to keep your current setup active until you finish making the transition.

Logic is similar to Cubase in that they both use an object oriented approach to sequencing. There's always a learning curve when beginning with a new DAW, but I think Logic is more like Cubase than most other Mac DAWs.

Best,

Geoff
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#2425152 - 07/12/12 07:36 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Al Coda]
Cygnus64 Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 02/18/07
Posts: 4019
Loc: Cleveland
Originally Posted By: Al Coda





Itīs a fast growing application and as long thereīs no score editor,- use an external one like Musescore (free !).
If you want hi end scoring, Finale or Sibelius are the ones to use anyway.


What you're describing is a slightly different use. I don't use the notation (Staff view in Sonar) for printing or even writing music. What I do with it is basically midi editing: change pitch, note duration, delete notes, note start/stop, add/delete pedals, note velocity etc. For me, it's a lot easier than a piano roll view or event list, that shiat frightens me. laugh

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#2425161 - 07/12/12 07:59 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Cygnus64]
Bill W Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/04/10
Posts: 483
Loc: Fairfax, VA
I just downloaded and installed it. It seems very streamlined and efficient compared to my current DAW (Sonar X1). It was also able to load and run a number of VST instruments on my laptop with no external soundcard (something that Sonar could not do).
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#2425167 - 07/12/12 08:11 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Cygnus64]
Al Coda Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 08/31/08
Posts: 2668
Loc: DE
Originally Posted By: Cygnus64

What you're describing is a slightly different use. I don't use the notation (Staff view in Sonar) for printing or even writing music. What I do with it is basically midi editing: change pitch, note duration, delete notes, note start/stop, add/delete pedals, note velocity etc. For me, it's a lot easier than a piano roll view or event list, that shiat frightens me. laugh


I understand you very well and Iīm with you !
Iīd prefer having a MIDI score editor, like you and because itīs also easier to me than the piano roll.
So, Iīm a DAW hopper ...
I have Presonus Studio One Prov2, Reason 6.5.1, Logic 6 on a Mac PPC and Reaper.
You wonīt believe, I have still a ATARI Mega STe and Notator SL and when these complex DAW apps drive me nuts, I do my MIDI the old way and import, then record, ha, ha ... or I play and print to harddrive directly laugh

In addition, Iīm able to go thru a MIDI track by event list and by ear, so lack of score editor AND piano roll wouldnīt be a real drawback for me.
I avoid editing and better play another take which is often faster, then edit some note length stuff and/or velocities and thatīs it.
Most editing is necessary for me if I have to do complex drum tracks.
I donīt use much loops, so the copy/paste stuff is also not my cup of tea.
For me, a DAW is a modern tape machine,- and I mix in SCOPE.

A.C.
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#2425171 - 07/12/12 08:21 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Cygnus64]
Craig MacDonald Offline
Platinum Member

Registered: 08/14/10
Posts: 1944
Loc: Toronto, Canada
I don't have anything against Reaper, and I've heard many extremely positive comments about it, however.... there was a time that Reaper was free (or only a few dollars) while the big DAWS were charging $5/6/700 for their professional packages, and Reaper was a really inexpensive way to get into computer based recording.

However, these days, all the big DAWS are coming down in price, and while Reaper is $60 ($200 for the commercial license), SONAR X1 Studio is only $199. So $$$-wise the reasons for choosing Reaper over another DAW aren't quite as compelling as they once were, unless you're really on a strict budget. If you're not on a strict budget, your decision regarding which DAW is best for you, should probably be made based on which "workflow" you prefer.. This really means how the DAW works and how well it matches the way you think and creat music.

If you're going to invest a lot of time and money into a DAW (any DAW) I think you want a couple of things..

1. A DAW who's workflow matches the way you think.
2. A DAW that has the features and functionality you want/need.
3. A DAW that will continue to grow and be supported.

From my perspective I found Reaper's workflow confusing (I use Sonar and it's workflow seems to match how I approach creating and recording). You can easily perform a feature by feature comparison of one DAW vs another, but be careful, just because a DAW has a feature doesn't mean that the feature is easy to use. The implementation of certain features are very cumbersome in different DAWS... A good example of this is "drum replacement". This is very easy to do in some DAWs and very cumbersome in others! With respect to support, I think that Reaper has proven itself to provide good support (some really like their approach), but on the other hand, Sonar is owned by Roland, and Cubase is owned by Yamaha, and some might argue that this results in better Hardware/Software integration, more money for research and development, more credibility, and better support overall.

That said, my suggestion would be to start by downloading some trial versions and try the different DAWS to see which is the easiest/best for you and the way you work. That really is the most important factor.
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#2425183 - 07/12/12 08:59 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Craig MacDonald]
Jim Alfredson Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 06/04/02
Posts: 5052
Loc: Lansing, MI
Why not install Cubase on your new computer via the install CD?
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#2425187 - 07/12/12 09:07 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Jim Alfredson]
Steve Force Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 03/01/04
Posts: 8684
Loc: Metro-Detroit, Michigan
Originally Posted By: B3-er
Why not install Cubase on your new computer via the install CD?


I was thinking the same thing, actually...
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#2425196 - 07/12/12 09:29 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Craig MacDonald]
Al Coda Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 08/31/08
Posts: 2668
Loc: DE
Originally Posted By: Craig MacDonald

However, these days, all the big DAWS are coming down in price, and while Reaper is $60 ($200 for the commercial license),


Thereīs a big difference in Cockos business model compared to the other DAW manufacturers !

1.)
You can evaluate Reaper until youīre sure you really WANT to buy it !
The app is fully functional when you download for "free" except thereīs a 5 sec. nag screen slowing down the normally ultra fast loading process.

2.)
For nearly every update for Logic or Cubendo you pay.
For Reaper you pay 60 bucks for 2 major version numbers, then pay a upgrade fee lower than 60 bucks.
Within the 2 major version numbers you receive tons of updates for free which are major upgrades in other DAWs.

3.)
Itīs very cool they offer a small business licence for a fully fledged application w/ no restrictions on updates.

4.)
Install Reaper on many machines, local or portable.
I know people using 2 instances at once, one local and one portable on the same machine.

5.)
Reaper still works on older computers w/ good result.
Intel Pentium 4 northwood single core 2.4GHz /512MB cache,- ~ 70 tracks w/ Win XP SP2.
It works also w/ multiple core machines and much, much better.
It works w/ latest Mac OS X but also on Mac PPC OS X 10.4.
It works 32Bit and 64Bit ...

Buy Cubendo and you need Win 7, 32Bit or 64Bit.

I was on Cubase for a long time, then sold Cubase SX3 in the end because Steini upgrade cost 499 Euros and the MIDI Score Editor drove me nuts anyway.

In fact, best in DAW app integrated MIDI Score Editor is Logic, period.

Originally Posted By: Craig MacDonald


If you're going to invest a lot of time and money into a DAW (any DAW) I think you want a couple of things..

1. A DAW who's workflow matches the way you think.
2. A DAW that has the features and functionality you want/need.
3. A DAW that will continue to grow and be supported.


Thatīs correct, but you recognize what works for you and what not after you buyed the other DAWs and w/ Reaper you recognize it before you buy and itīs not a demo.
In addition and if you start using DAWs, you definitely donīt know what you really want,- the demands come while using it.

Originally Posted By: Craig MacDonald

From my perspective I found Reaper's workflow confusing (I use Sonar and it's workflow seems to match how I approach creating and recording).


If you come from another DAW, Reaper is confusing 1st.
Itīs all about "right click" in Reaper and Reaper doesnīt come w/ all the features when you download,- you should download SWS extensions to get the full set of features.
Reaper looks ugly to many people,- who cares, itīs skinnable and there are cool layouts for all purposes for download in the stash.

To be up to date w/ Reaper, Cockos Reaper forum is essential because updates and improvements come very fast and not only when these are announced and released on their website officially.
This also rules for the SWS extensions.
Reaper is a different beast being based on actions and scripting.
If customization of an app is not for you, better buy something not being customizable.

The audio routing in Reaper is outstanding for a DAW application,- but you wonīt find the standard mixer layout like channels, master, subgroups & aux-busses visualized and there are no VST racks and such.
Instead it is much more flexible for configurations w/ channels offering not only sends but also receives.
Itīs all about your imagination what you do with it.

Reaper is designed for you to customize your workflow by creating your own actions, groups of actions, these triggered by one shortcut and so on.
Itīs learning curve but if youīve done it, itīs faster than other DAWs because itīs YOUR workflow and not the workflow the manufacturer has in mind.

I agree, Reaper is behind the other DAWs MIDI wise but also this difference became smaller the past 2 years and will become more smaller every day.
If I work w/ VSTis, just for the recording, I prefer Presonus Studio One Pro over Reaper because the drag and drop of plugins from the browser into tracks is unbeatable fast.
Same rules for the loops stuff.

But I also like the track templates stuff in Reaper,- once you did your routing for a specific VSTi, letīs say a multi out one like Kontakt, you can load that exactly the same way in any other new project and donīt even have to think about it anymore. That is for your personalized routing though.
Inserting a VSTi in new track and build multi-out routing automatic works flawlessly too.

Originally Posted By: Craig MacDonald

A good example of this is "drum replacement". This is very easy to do in some DAWs and very cumbersome in others!


Even it is not Drumagog or such, thereīs a JS plugin for download in the Reaper Stash called Drum Replacer which works.
Donīt underrate JS plugins !
There is a s**tload of cool ones in Reaper and there are more in the Stash,- EQs, limiters, compressors and more are very good even they donīt have expensive looking GUIs !

Donīt overlook the MIDI plugins which are necessary because the inspector like in Cubendo doesnīt exist.

Originally Posted By: Craig MacDonald

With respect to support, I think that Reaper has proven itself to provide good support (some really like their approach), but on the other hand, Sonar is owned by Roland, and Cubase is owned by Yamaha, and some might argue that this results in better Hardware/Software integration, more money for research and development, more credibility, and better support overall.


The real support for Reaper is the Cockos Reaper forum!
Quick answers, solutions and workarounds like nowhere else.

Originally Posted By: Craig MacDonald

That said, my suggestion would be to start by downloading some trial versions and try the different DAWS to see which is the easiest/best for you and the way you work. That really is the most important factor.


As I said, Reaper in evaluation mode isnīt a trial version functionality wise and it loads the SWS extensions, any VST/AU, loops and samples like a licenced program.

I think, now it depends on platform.
If I were on a up to date Mac,- Iīd go Logic and then try what Reaper does for me in addition or if it runs well on Mac.

On PC, I know it runs well, but use Presonus Studio One Prov2 as my commercial DAW up to now, waiting for Reaper MIDI perfection.

Itīs just too cool having Reaper on a USB stick portable.
Itīs dead on as alive host and you can load more plugins in Reaper than in any other DAW.

A.C.
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#2425199 - 07/12/12 09:38 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Al Coda]
Steve Force Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 03/01/04
Posts: 8684
Loc: Metro-Detroit, Michigan
Come on Al Coda, tell us what you REALLY think! grin
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#2425218 - 07/12/12 10:59 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Al Coda]
Craig MacDonald Offline
Platinum Member

Registered: 08/14/10
Posts: 1944
Loc: Toronto, Canada
Al Coda,

I think that we agree on most things.. #1 being that workflow is probably the most important.. most DAWS have trial versions available.. as does Reaper... so go try them and see which one you like. It goes without saying that Reaper has a different business model, but it's not necessarily the best business model for someone who's wants stability, someone who isn't particularly computer savy or someone who'd rather not rely on user forums for support. Other DAWS have excellent forums too for informal support as well, but I would hate to have to rely on this. Some people don't want to spend endless hours on forums in order to stay on top of all the fixes and issues that comes with a product that is developed and released almost in "real-time", and what I mean by this is a product where there's a new release every month or so.

For me, I value the support and stability I get with Sonar, I also value the fact that Roland owns it and there is good integration between Roland HW and Cakewalk SW products. No business model is perfect, and just because Roland and Cakewalk have partnered up (like Steinberg/Yamaha) doesn't mean that everything's perfect. At the same time, there is no question that Reaper is a viable DAW these days, and it wouldn't be around today if it wasn't.

It was not my intention to debate which DAW is the best (that's been done adnauseum in a number of different forums). I was attempting to point out a couple of simple things..

As Reaper functionality get's closer to the level of the high priced DAWs, the high price of those DAWS is dropping to such an extent that the low cost advantage of Reaper may no longer justify the downside of their business model.

Cost aside, what is most important is workflow, take advantage of trial versions to see how well the workflow matches the way you create.

Do a function/feature comparison to make sure that the DAW you choose can do the things you want it todo.. as you say, if someone is intereted in Loops or Midi, Reaper is likely NOT the DAW of choice.. again this is something that will likely be sorted out when you begin using trial version of the various DAWs.

Don't fear the Reaper, absolutely, but recognize it's strengths and weaknesses.. the cost advantages aren't what the once were and often you get what you pay for!!
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#2425238 - 07/12/12 11:38 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Craig MacDonald]
PinkFloydDudi Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/11/12
Posts: 456
Loc: Rochester, NY
+10 (is that allowed?) for Reaper.
I have used ProTools, and Adobe Audition - and decided to scratch both of them in favor for the nice, simple, and cheap "Reaper".

If you want to try it - go for it! Full function version is free to try!

It all depends on what you do with your DAW. For my recording purposes, it has pretty much everything I need and is very easy and efficient to use.

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#2425316 - 07/12/12 03:43 PM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Steve Force]
Al Coda Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 08/31/08
Posts: 2668
Loc: DE
Originally Posted By: Steve Force
Come on Al Coda, tell us what you REALLY think! grin


Itīs ALL crap,- back to hardware

grin grin grin

A.C.
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#2425330 - 07/12/12 04:54 PM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Al Coda]
Jim Alfredson Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 06/04/02
Posts: 5052
Loc: Lansing, MI
he score editor in Cubase has gotten a lot better since SX. It's really unfair to judge it based on a version that several years old.

I have Reaper on my laptop. It's ok. It's pretty ugly, though I know there are skins for it; I don't want to bother with skinning my software. Why not make it look good in the first place?

Cubase 6 is incredibly stable and my plug-ins tend to run at lower latencies without glitches in Cubase than they do in Reaper. I know, it surprised me, too.

You can of course run Cubase on as many computers as you like; you just need to bring along the dongle and obviously can't run it on multiple computers at the same time unless you buy another license.

I found Logic to be the anti-thesis to it's name. smile And ProTools; meh.
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#2425331 - 07/12/12 04:54 PM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Craig MacDonald]
Al Coda Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 08/31/08
Posts: 2668
Loc: DE
Originally Posted By: Craig MacDonald

Don't fear the Reaper, absolutely, but recognize it's strengths and weaknesses.. the cost advantages aren't what the once were and often you get what you pay for!!


v4.25 out
here

updated manual
here

Donīt forget Quickstart and recpath guides ...

latest SWS extensions
here

basic SWS extensions manual
here

my up to now prefered theme
clonk

A.C.
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#2425332 - 07/12/12 05:36 PM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Jim Alfredson]
Al Coda Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 08/31/08
Posts: 2668
Loc: DE
Originally Posted By: B3-er
he score editor in Cubase has gotten a lot better since SX. It's really unfair to judge it based on a version that several years old.

I have Reaper on my laptop. It's ok. It's pretty ugly, though I know there are skins for it; I don't want to bother with skinning my software. Why not make it look good in the first place?

Cubase 6 is incredibly stable and my plug-ins tend to run at lower latencies without glitches in Cubase than they do in Reaper. I know, it surprised me, too.

You can of course run Cubase on as many computers as you like; you just need to bring along the dongle and obviously can't run it on multiple computers at the same time unless you buy another license.

I found Logic to be the anti-thesis to it's name. smile And ProTools; meh.


Cubase needs the dongle and I wanted to get rid of it.
The original Cubase coder(s) do Studio One, I can use the same shortcuts.
The upgrade price from SX3 was too much,- I decided to sell and got Studio One for the money I made w/ the sale of Cubase SX.
I donīt regret and love Studio One has Melodyne ARA implemented, the way it handles VSTis and is a 1 window app.
I need my screens for other stuff like Reason 6 (today 6.5.1) and my Scope 5.1 environment.

Reaper is my quick launch host and the most portable,- itīs 6.4MB only and I plan to use it as my live host together w/ Scope/XITE-1.
When I launch Reaper, it automaticly loads Reason rewired w/ my desired Reason startup project and Reaper loads Kontakt and other stuff by in itīs project embedded track templates,- and when both are up they show up in my SCOPE projects mixer channels correctly, all without any additional mouse clicks.
No crashes up to now during tests.

Hereīs a pic w/ Reaper, Reason 6.02 and SCOPE 5.1 working
clonk

Hereīs one w/ Studio One ...
works too, but I have to activate Rewire manually after Studio One is up.
clonk

A.C.
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Gear: What the venue really needs

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#2425341 - 07/12/12 08:02 PM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Al Coda]
Jaime Chimuelo Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/26/09
Posts: 297
I use Reaper for live MIDI data streams and hosting Kontakt.
It's MIDI is fine by me since I don;t need to edit much, but I still prefer Cubase if MIDI editing and time is an issue.
But Cubase chokes on large streams of MIDI data.
Reaper excells in stable playback.
I actually learned about it from from a lighting director as he showed a large console with automated faders having jittery movements using Cubase, but Reaper appeared to be perfect and smoother than any DAW I have ever used or seen.
But it is way behind Cubase when it comes to simple, logical fast MIDI editing.
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#2425439 - 07/13/12 08:37 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Jaime Chimuelo]
Al Coda Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 08/31/08
Posts: 2668
Loc: DE
Originally Posted By: Jaime Chimuelo
I use Reaper for live MIDI data streams and hosting Kontakt.

...

But it is way behind Cubase when it comes to simple, logical fast MIDI editing.


Yes, thatīs right and thatīs why I use 2 (3 incl. Reason 6) DAW applications for different purposes.
Now, weīre PC DAW hoppers ...

If someone is on a Mac and needs good Score MIDI Editing,- Logic, to me, seems the best,- even the app is not that logic as itīs name promises.

I donīt own latest and fast Mac computers, so Iīm unable to leave a comment on how well Cubendo or Presonus Studio One Pro run on Mac.
I have Logic 6 for PPC only and assume later version of Logic didnīt introduce significant changes for MIDI/MIDI Score Editor,- it was good always since the Atari times and Notator.
So, if I were on a Mac Iīd go Logic over Cubendo for MIDI Score Editing.
Just only my opinion.

Now talking about load times, Cubase as also Personus Studio One Pro load significanly (!!!!) slower than Reaper which is up in 3 seconds if not being in evaluation mode.
That makes a big difference for me in some situations.
I could easily use Presonus Studio One as a live host too,- but Reaper is much, much faster, itīs very stable and itīs portable.
In a live host, I donīt need all the bells and whistles the big DAWs offer and like you, I donīt edit much in depth.
So, Reaper would do it for recordings for me too, especially live recordings.

A.C.
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#2425452 - 07/13/12 09:06 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Jim Alfredson]
Aidan Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 08/11/06
Posts: 3403
Loc: Stoke-on-Trent, UK
Originally Posted By: B3-er
Why not install Cubase on your new computer via the install CD?


+1 Why put yourself through having to learn a totally new piece of software when you can bring in all your old projects and continue using a solid, proven DAW platform?
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#2425470 - 07/13/12 09:51 AM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Aidan]
johnchop Offline
Platinum Member

Registered: 10/29/09
Posts: 1525
Loc: Georgia, US
If the DAW is for your own use most of the time, +1 on just finding something that makes sense.

Try setting up an utterly basic recording project in the DAW: couple of audio tracks, couple of MIDI/VST tracks. Was doing just that much confusing or frustrating? Kick it to the curb.

Quickly realized results > inherent "flexibility".

For me, Cubase was becoming a confusing mix of icons and widgetry, with upgrades going more towards instrument add-ins (that I didn't need).

Live has been great for idea capture, but I find it fiddly for more linear recording work.

Presonus Studio One v. 2? A joy.

What does this mean? Not much. Just one guy's opinion.

-John
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#2425513 - 07/13/12 01:19 PM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: johnchop]
RABid Offline
10k Club

Registered: 11/01/01
Posts: 10028
I've watched Reaper grow from the beginning and had an early version. In all that time I don't recall any truly negative comments other than missing features. Any new program is going to have missing features. The fan base is passionate but seems to have cooled the past few years. I did not stick with it because there were features missing that I use a lot in Sonar. If Sonar was not so consumer friendly with support and copy protection I would have given Reaper a harder look. As it is, after using Sonar, Cubase and Logic I really appreciate the way Cakewalk treats customers. Plus, I've used Cakewalk since version 1. Hard to walk away now.

The fact that you are considering a move away from Cubase may indicate it does not have a workflow that you find a joy to use.
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#2425722 - 07/14/12 03:19 PM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: Jim Alfredson]
mahinty Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/11/11
Posts: 95
Loc: New Zealand
Originally Posted By: B3-er
Why not install Cubase on your new computer via the install CD?


The original disk is long gone (it was Cubase SX), but mostly I'm in the mood for change. I'm keen to not just replicate the way I use to do things. I'm shaking things up!

I have had experience with ProTools in a studio also, but it's too expensive and bloated for home use. I'm not too invested in either system (Cubase or PT), so am open to learning a new package - if it saves me money in the long run, and runs efficiently.

Thanks for all the feedback and advice. I shall trial Reaper just as soon as I get a chance.
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#2447588 - 10/23/12 10:11 PM Re: Don't fear the Reaper (DAW)? [Re: mahinty]
wmp Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member

Registered: 12/02/04
Posts: 2982
Loc: MA
My engineer has been using Reaper since 2004. It's his favorite DAW, and he's very familiar with most of them. He says it's rock solid on both M$ and Mac platforms. He uses this stuff like a tape machine, never messing with MIDI at all.

He loves it for all the reasons cited above; lean, mean, loads and runs more plugins better than the others. He says it kicks Pro Tools butt. I see the lack of notation as a big plus. I'd rather do that in a program geared almost exclusively to scoring and notation and not consume the resources I'd never use in a DAW. I like lean, mean, do one job and do it well sort of software. Recording and scoring are two very different things, at least for me.

Cakewalk was just a MIDI sequencer when I first saw it. I'm still running Sonar 4 on an ancient XP laptop. It did what I needed it to do for years, but I'm overhauling and upgrading my little home studio and it's time to do everything over.

The last time I upgraded the computer was in 2007 with a Mac Pro. I'd heard that Apple finally figured out that they couldn't write an OS to save their butts and that OSX was Unix. I figured it'd be easy to use it like a Unix machine and I'd have a platform for all that Mac music software folks like so much.

I was so horrified by my first taste of Apple that I put the brakes on using it as a DAW and stuck with trusty old Sonar. It looks a lot like Unix if you only take a quick glance, but it can't be used as a Unix machine. Instead of taking BSD Unix and implementing the whole Mac user experience as a thin layer of slime that could be easily pealed away, or not even applied in the first place, they neutered Unix and implemented the whole Mac thing as more of a fibrous tumor that infects Unix all the way down to init(). I'm sorry, that's launchd() in OSX. OSX isn't Unix, it's vandalism. Please don't make me elaborate. Cygwin under Windows is more stable and less hair pulling than OSX.

I've never used Reaper myself. I've read about it for about an hour or so here and there and played with it for about ten minutes. I'm totally hooked and totally pumped that it's a Unix native program that's solid on Mac and M$ platforms. The Actions list is long and absolutely beautiful. Keyboard shortcuts and MIDI controllers for everything Reaper does, your way, easy. You can chain actions together to create custom actions. That's just from a quick glance. I'm sure there's more to it. If that isn't enough, there are APIs for C, Perl, and Python. Yee haa!

This means I can easily drive Reaper on a Mac or M$ box from the sanity and comfort of my Unix machine, from the command line, without pointing, squinting, clicking, or even looking. Reaper on a Unix machine will be the berries. I find it amazing that 33 years after Steve Jobs' historic visit to Xerox, so few know what a real windowing system is. Unlike M$ and Mac windowing systems, X is very cleanly and completely separated from the OS and thus the machine, so I can have as many monitors on an applications as I have computers and screens. I could even use your screen at your place if you were running an X server and wanted to play. The last time I looked, there was a lame X server on the Mac and a better one in Cygwin under Windows.

I'm also very interested in the state of things in tempo mapping. I love practicing with a click, but I find playing with one pretty limiting. Reaper came up among the first google hits on tempo mapping, which seems to suggest that it's probably got a pretty happening MIDI sequencer implementation too.

I haven't even used it yet, and I already like it. I think I'm going to love it.

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