Hi Folks,

I've been reading all about acoustics and room setup for several weeks. Thanks to Ethan, Glenn and many others on this forum for all this great and accessible info. The videos really opened my ears to how a room can be improved through treatment.

I'm trying to make the best of my circumstances. One man studio. I needed both a room to mix and to record. I only have access to 1/2 of a one car garage. Pipes, fridge, washer/dryer in garage, noises from inside the house, and generally bad "garage vibe" all get in the way. Plus I play late into the night and can't disturb the neighbors. I considered finishing and treating the entire garage to get a larger effective space for mixing, but that doesn't solve my recording problem.

So I now have a room-within-a-room in my garage. It's only 8'x12' inside. Not ideal but I have to make due. Hey, I've mostly been recording in (literally) my closet, and trying to mix in my car with a laptop attached to my car stereo (!) so this is a major upgrade for me

After all the study, I've come up with the following layout. See images for a top view and side view.

Top view

Side view


Mixing position is the recommended 38% into the room length. I'll have nearfield monitors sitting on top of some nice Klipsch towers (which I don't use for mixing).


My planned treatments are:

1) Superchunk floor to ceiling on all corners to maximize bass trapping in a small space. I use larger in back and smaller in front to try to recover a little floor space. Plus a couple of floor corner wedges.

2) Side traps for first reflections. Note that placement is somewhat determined by the door. I'll have one trap attached directed to the door (bonus: covers window as well).

3) Front ceiling corner trap and two additional overhead traps.

4) Diffuser/Absorber on back wall.

I'll be measuring as I go along.


My questions are:

1) Given how small the room is, will this really help? For mixing I am trying to acheive clarity. For recording I have no illusions about getting any real "live" sound out of this small space, so I think my target is to get clean vocals and guitar basically uncolored by the room (will have to add a sense of space later with things like convolution reverb, etc.). I'm not recording live drums, just vocals, acoustic guitar, mando, harmonica. I've been recording bass and electric guitar DI but it would be nice to try some miked cab as well.

2) Am I overdoing it on treatment? Honestly the space is small and will be even smaller with all this treatment. But I'm willing to go for it if the acoustic results are there. I can work in a small space.

3) Will it be a problem to have my nearfields on top of the Klipsch towers? Trying to make best use of space.

4) Any other suggestions?

Thank you for your thoughts on this.

..ant

1) Yes! Geez!

2) No.

3) Monitor speakers need to be at a height that puts the tweeters at ear level.

4) You're doing great!

--Ethan

Ethan,

Thanks. Good to hear I'm on the right track. A few more weeks of studio build and then I'm ready to start putting in treatment. Can't wait to hear the impact.



I know it will help. I guess my real question was "am I kidding myself thinking I can turn this little space into a decent mixing room?" I guess I didn't ask directly because I'm afraid of the answer. I have to work with what I got. Honestly, with all the great advice here, I'm pretty confident I can make it work, and at a minimum be much better off than I've been.

..ant

I have seen very small rooms transformed from "OMG this sucks!" To "Wow, not bad at all!" with enough bass traps. At least you're realistic in the number of traps you plan. I'm sure it will make a huge improvement.

--Ethan

Great to hear. I'll post an update when it goes in.

..ant

Hi,

A couple of followup questions:

For the side traps, as I understand they're more about first reflections and mids, not bass trapping. So should they be on the thin side (2") or thick side (4"). Wondering if they should be acting as bass traps as well for a room this size.

Does the diffuser/absorber make sense for a room this size, or should it just be more bass trapping? As I've said I don't expect to get a useful "room sound" but I would like to capture acoustic guitar as well as vocals and thought the diffuser might be helpful here. But maybe for a room this small there's no value add with a diffuser.

thanks again

..ant

Reflection absorbers don't need to be more than two inches thick, but making them thicker is still better.

With a room 8x12 I think you could use diffusion successfully.

--Ethan

Thank you.

..ant

My little room is now built and mostly set up, except for room treatment, which I hope to do in the next couple of weeks. All my reading on this subject has me anticipating great things.

I finally figured out RoomEQWizard and here are some first measurements. Great program but a bit hard to figure out. This set of videos is the closest thing I found to a RoomEQWizard for Dummies and it was quite helpful.

These are recorded in my untreated 8x12 room using a Nady CM100 measurement mic (thanks Ethan for your mic shootout!), and Apogee Duet interface and using my Klipsch towers. I sold my old nearfields and plan to buy some better ones but haven't yet. Still I think this gives some picture of what's going on.

Based on what I see below and my limited knowledge of RoomEQWizard and this whole topic in general, it looks similar to what I've seen from other charts of small rooms pre-treatment. That is, a lot of slow-to-fade bass, a big dip around 125, and a bunch of intermittent notches which I assume are driven by room modes. If I'm interpreting this correctly, it seems I am on the right track. I hope to post some before and after measurements when the treatment is in.

..ant

First Room Measurement - no smoothing



First Room Measurement - smoothed


First Room Measurement - Waterfall

Okay, now let's see the results after adding bass traps!

--Ethan

I completed the rear corner absorbers (superchunks) this weekend. I can absolutely hear the difference. Wow! I'm glad I bought all the material for the front absorbers and side panels at the same time or I'd be tempted to stop now, and miss out on further improvement.

I'll post updated measurements and more detailed observations on the sound once all the treatments are in.

A couple of notes and observations for others considering the same.

The difference it makes in the room is readily observable by comparing the bare walls and the treated corners at close proximity. If I put my face right up to a bare wall and talk, it has that classic "recorded in a small room" sound. Sounds like something recorded on a cassette recorder in my kitchen. Then I put my face right up to the corner absorber and it sounds smooth, even, and "real", like what I expect an expensive studio recording to sound like. I did the same with my guitar and it's downright shocking. Added about $500 to the sound of my guitar. Of course as I back away, the cheap room comes back in. But I'm optimistic when I'm done with all the planned treatement, that will be tamed.

For my small room, I didn't want to get too involved in creating frames for the corner absorbers. I don't want the room too dead and read that some facing can help. And I was a bit concerned about the fiberglass, just because it's itchy and not fun to breath. So after struggling to create a big corner absorber I came up with a good solution for all the above.

I created all my absorbers in two-foot high and one-foot high units. Using butcher paper and masking tape, I wrapped each section up like a gift. This made it very easy to move them into the room and simply stack them in the 7-foot corners, without any fiberglass material coming loose. Unclear if I lost any effective bass trapping with the paper cover because they seem to work really well.

To cover them, I found these curtains for $16 at WalMart, which include two 40" wide panels (perfect for the 34" facing larger superchunks) and come in various lengths including 84" (a perfect match for my room). They are 100% polyester, like the high-end stuff I've read about. As far as I can tell they are acoustically transparent. In the store I held one up to my ear and it had no impact (unlike most others in the store). At home I threw them over my speakers to test again and they are transparent to my ears. In fact, I might use a set to fix a torn speaker grill.

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=5739841

..ant

That all sounds great ant!

Can't work on further acoustic treatment until the weekend, so I spent last night playing around with SketchUp. Here are some 3D images of my little mixing room and the final planned treatments. If I'm on the fence on anything it's whether to use 2" or 4" thickness for the side traps and overhead traps, thus using SketchUp to try to visualize. I will probably drop the floor wedges since one would block the door. I'm planning to make the rear absorber into a diffuser/absorber.

..ant

Exterior View


Interior Treatments Only View


X-Ray View


Diffuser View

I added the front side panels (at the listener position) and the three overhead traps. Still to do are the front superchunks and the rear diffuser panel. I may drop the second side panels because one blocks the only window into the room (on the door), but I may build them and store them just in case for critical mixing/tracking.

Here are some interim measurements. I got my Yamaha HS80Ms in and these measurements are with those and a Blue Sky sub. I'm really enjoying the sound but know it can be improved further.

Ethan I really appreciate all the advice you've given me, and historically in your many postings and articles which I've tried to read as much as I can. What a difference it's making! I'll post again when all the treatments are in.

..ant

Smoothed


Unsmoothed


Waterfall

Some photos...

The diffuser is installed, image below. It's a much more subtle change than the bass traps, but I do hear a positive difference when I A/B compare before and after install. Made it out of OC 703 so it should provide some trapping as well.

Only the front corners left to do.

..ant