Hello eveyone, this is my first post here. I've been reading here for some time, and i guess it's time for me to sign up

I've been looking for a hammer action keyboard recently, and i've found a mint kurzweil pc1se that i can afford When i google it, i've found that even HC has no user review for it! I guess it's not a new board (i don't know the production date though).

Are any of you using this board? What are your comments? What i'm looking for is a above average feel (i'm not expecting the feel of my P250), and good piano/rhodes/wurly sounds. Any other extras are welcome as well:) I'm currently using Yamaha P250, Motif ES6, CS2x and Alesis Micron. I'm plannig to take PC1SE to gigs since P250 is way too heavy to carry.

Thanks for your time!

The PC1SE is definitely not a hammer action; it is a semi-weighted sprung action, similar to (but lighter than) the newer PC3 76-key board.

That being said, it's not a bad action at all, and was on my short list while I was waiting (and waiting, and waiting ) for the release of the PC3. The PC3 is even better, though, on a number of levels, and I'm very happy I waited. Had the PC3 not come on the scene, I may very well have gone with the PC1SE.

As with all things related to something as personal as action, YMMV.

Oh this is bad news. Kurz website says "76 note fully weighted action" for PC1SE. I think they should be morecareful about their explanations.

"Fully weighted" does not mean "Hammer action"

There are weights under the keys on this board, and it's definitely a heavier weight than your Motif/CS2x/Micron boards, but it's not anywhere near as heavy as your P250.

The problem is how people interpret what "fully weighted" means. Kurzweil is far from the only manufacturer out there that uses these terms in seemingly misleading ways.

Good luck.

I don't think this info is accurate. I remember the PC1SE being similar to a PC2x, which is Kurzweil's/Fatar's weighted action. The PC3 is more like the PC2 action.

Hmm... I tried it a couple years ago and from what I remember, it definitely is a hammer action, similar to PC1X and PC2X, and not at all like PC3/PC2/PC161.

I keep on seaching the net, and i came across this :


Keyboard Action:
PC1X - (88 notes - fully weighted action) Fatar TP-30 AFT
PC2X - (88 notes - fully weighted action) Fatar TP-10 MDF AFT

So, i gues touchwise pc1x = pc1se. Andybody familiar with Fatar TP-30 AFT action ? Fatar probably discontinued it, because i cannot find it on their website.

it's fully weighted, but on the light/quick side, which is not necessarily a bad thing

I guess I was mistaken, having played both the PC1SE and the PC3 side-by-side 3 weeks ago at my local retailer. My bad.

Never mind the fact that the PC1X and PC2X are NOT "hammer action" keyboards, that can't have any bearing on the discussion.

Action aside, it's a good sounding KB. Not quite PC3 level, but sweet nonetheless.

+1

Here's Kawai's explanation: Kawai's Website

Hmmm. They are.

Hammer action - the original Kawai "Hammer Action" is wooden key, although some of the other action parts are plastic. It features a more complex action than the "weighted actions" used by most other companies. There is a counterweight in the key, and the separate hammer part is also weighted. The advantage is a feel more like an acoustic piano. Drawbacks include considerable added weight of the keyboard, and the complexity of the mechanism means more things to go wrong with use and age.

Some of the later Kawaii actions no longer use wood keys. The added density (plus long time strength) of the wood key is partiall responsible for the acoustic feel.

The Kurzweil PC1SE is one of the very few instruments that feature a 75 key weighted keyboard, made by Fatar. The reason you no longer find it listed by Fatar is that it (like most keyboards designed more than 2 years ago) used lead in its materials - the EU has prohibited imports of equipment containing ANY lead - which meant everyones' designs were obsoleted as far as continuing production.

I don't own a PC1SE, but I do own a PC2 and a PC2X - and the keyboard on the PC1SE should feel very much like my PC2X 88 key keyboard. Both the PC3 and PC3X (which I also own) feel different, not necessarily worse or better, just different - from the PC2 series. The PC1 and PC2 were very similar in electronics, except the PC1 is missing the KB3 Hammond/Leslie emulation section, and some of the editing capability of the PC2 is not in the PC1.

I have played a P250 at the college - it doesn't feel just like any of my Kurzweils - again, just like two acoutic pianos won't feel the same. What I have found is that I can switch from one to the other with no great pain. The fully weighted is definitely better for playing classical or jazz - especially romantic period music than the "lightly weighted."

So, if the PC1SE is mint, and the price is right - play it, see how it sounds and feels to YOU - decide based on your feeling toward it. The PC1 (without the SE) was the same 76 key, with a "lightly weighted" keyboard - and the SE also includes both of the optional ROM modules. Later PC1 included the Orchestral, but the SE also has the Vintage Keyboards ROM - some very fine CP80, Rhodes, Wurly, Clav, Mellotron, and other vintage samples.

IIRC the pc1se is a pc1x with 76 keys instead of 88. I have a pc1x - it's weighted - not as heavy an action as my yamaha cp33 or as a cp300. I like the action. I gig with it all the time. If you buy the pc1se, consider installing the classic/vintage - whatever - keys module if it does not already have it (it may come with it; in fact I am pretty sure it does). The classic keys module makes this instrument really special IMO. I have a pc2 - it's lighter action than the pc1x, but I find it quite playable, too. I'd recommend the pc1se. It's a good board.

Thank you all for your replies. In fact, i need a weighted action keyboard for live piano playing and practicing when i'm away from my P250.

I used to have a Roland RD700SX. Its touch was noticeably lighter than P250. I'm hoping for a RDish action on PC1SE. I should go try it myself.

I just got a PC3X and have had my PC1se for about 3 years, which I use for gigs. I love the actions on both - they are both definitely weighted. The actions are both very similar, but I think the PC3X is a bit heavier, but "springier" if that's possible. For now, I am going to keep using the PC1se for gigs and leave the PC3X at home. I think the PC1se is a perfect size for gigging, and has some great sounds (I play through a MS KP200S). I use it mainly for pianos, EPs, and brass. Has the Classic Keys and Orchestral roms installed. Only weakness are the organs, and I have a Electro 61 on top for that. Oh and another fault - is that the display is very hard to read outdoors!

You should avoid gigs outdoors...nothing good ever happens outdoors on gigs!

The PC1SE and PC1X are identical apart from the number of keys and size and weight. The action is a hammer action (pull it apart and you can see it) that is non-graded (all keys the same weight) and the action weight is less than most other digital piano actions, which a lot of people like. To quote one reviewer "It’s actually much closer in feel to a well-played vintage grand piano than you’d think possible – which should mean that pianists will love it and synth veterans will at least be comfortable with it.". As an owner of a vintage grand piano I totally agree. 3 hour gigs are no problem,and organ and synth playing is OK.

There are two online reviews available for the PC1X

* January 2004 MUSIC TECH magazine
* March 2004 Keyboard magazine.

If you can't find them online I have electronic copies.

The PC1SE usually came with the Classic Keys ROM pre-installed, which makes it a monster keyboard for piano and classic keyboard sounds (include mellotron and ARP). If not installed, they are still available new.

The KFM sound bank from www.dlnsound.com adds ~70 great FM sounds - genuine FM synthesis NOT samples! Highly recommended.

I have programmed a fully functional drawbar organ sound bank that overcomes the weaknesses in the organ sounds and gives most of the functional of KB3 mode on the PC2 - I might release it soon once I'm done with it.

If you want to program your own sounds the PC2 manager editor lets you do this with a VAST system similar to the K2000 and most of the samples of the PC3.

Michael

I had a PC1SE for a couple of years. It was very serviceable, and was built well. I then bought a PC2R, and I used i as a controller, but then it became redundant, so I got a Yamaha p-90 as either a controller , and w/o the rompler.

I've been gigging with a PC1X for many years. I also have a PC2X but prefer the action on the PC1X. It is extremely playable for piano parts but not so stiff that you get fatigued playing non-piano parts (which I do a lot) over a 4-hour gig. The organ is not so great but I use a Nord NE2 on top so it doesn't matter. Besides the pianos, the orchestral sounds and classic keys sounds are where this board really shines. If you regularly need these types of sounds like I do, they are not only uniformly excellent but they sound great live and fit naturally into the mix.

I haven't answered this topic for some time, and i decided to get PC1SE. I've been playing it for about 3 hours, and i'm still on the piano/ep section

Exactly what i was looking for. Lovely pianos, excellent EPs. Thanks you all for your help.

@Micheal, PM me when you're finished with B3 programs

Glad to hear it. Enjoy!

Congratulations on your new PC1SE. I got a PC1SE a little over a year ago and have been extremely pleased with it. IMO it is very underated and under-recognized. Once you dig deeper into this instrument, you'll probably find it to be very playable and inspirational. Have fun!

Yeah, it's already inspiring for me

I might even sell my ES6 and go for a PC361 sometime

Now you're talkin

Nice going. The pc1se is a fine instrument.

The B3 emulation is at Beta stage. It all works and sounds pretty good. Once work settles down a bit I will be able to do the final tweaks to get it as good as I am capable of.

Michael

Could you post the results? I have a pc1x and am interested in theb3 emulation.

Lighter? Really? I have both, and to me the PC1se is considerably heavier than the PC3...?!?